Author Topic: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor  (Read 12209 times)

roo_ster

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Hey, can I got to Georgia, carry a gun & badge, play copper, shoot clerics, and not bother to get any sort of training/certification (not even a CHL)before doing so?



Plenty of links at the web link.



http://reason.com/archives/2010/03/23/another-senseless-drug-war-dea

Another Senseless Drug War Death
Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor Jonathan Ayers

Radley Balko | March 23, 2010

The Jonathan Ayers story was already outrageous enough. Last September, Ayers, a 28-year-old Baptist pastor from Lavonia, Georgia, was gunned down by a North Georgia narcotics task force in the parking lot of a gas station. Ayers had not been a suspect in any drug investigation. And even today, police acknowledge he was not using or trafficking in illicit drugs. Instead, Ayers had either been ministering to or having an affair with (depending on whom you believe) Johanna Kayla Jones Barrett, the actual target of the investigation.

Ayers is yet more collateral damage in the boundlessly tragic and wasteful drug war, as are his widowed wife Abigail and the child she was carrying at the time of his death. But that's really only the beginning of this mess. In a lawsuit filed last week, Abigail Ayers makes some astonishing new allegations about the competence of the police officers who killed her husband, the supervisors who hired them, and the law enforcement agencies and the grand jury that investigated Ayers' death. Most damning: The police officer who killed Ayers wasn't even authorized to be carrying a gun or a badge.

Hours before Ayers was killed, police say Johanna Barrett sold undercover officer Chance Oxner $50 worth of crack cocaine. According to an interview Barrett gave to the North Georgian newspaper shortly after Ayers' death, the pastor had seen her walking near a gas station on her way back to an extended-stay motel where she was living with her boyfriend. Ayers, who had known Barrett for a number of years, offered her a ride back to the motel and gave her the money in his pocket, $23, to help pay her rent.

The police were trailing Barrett at the time. But instead of apprehending her at the motel, they instead followed Ayers, the stranger they'd just seen give her a ride and hand her some cash.

Ayers then pulled into a nearby gas station to withdraw money from an ATM. Shortly after he got back into his car, a black Escalade tore into the parking lot. Three officers, all undercover, got out of the vehicle and pointed their guns at Ayers. The pastor, understandably, attempted to escape. As he pulled out of the station, Ayers grazed Officer Oxner with his car. Officer Billy Shane Harrison then opened fire, shooting Ayers in the stomach. (You can watch surveillance video of the altercation here.) Ayers continued to drive, fleeing the parking lot for about a thousand yards before eventually crashing his car. He died at the hospital.

Ayers’ last words to his family and medical staff were that he thought he was being robbed. The police found no illicit drugs in his car, and there was no trace of any illegal substance in his body.

If the story ended there, it would merely be enough to boil your blood. These officers jumped from an SUV waving their guns commando-style over a possible $50 drug transaction. Worse, the man they pounced upon wasn't the target of their investigation.

The police claimed they announced themselves, but it isn't difficult to see how Ayers—or anyone else—might have been confused in the commotion. It was a hot, late summer Georgia afternoon. Ayers likely had his windows up and his air conditioning on. The officers were undercover, dressed in shabby clothes and ski-mask caps. The badges they had hanging from their necks, seen in this photo, were far from conspicuous.

Let’s say that you (which would include 99 percent of the people reading this) aren't a drug dealer, or a mobster, or some other sort of career criminal. You've just returned to your car after getting cash from an ATM. An unmarked Escalade pulls up and three men jump out in masks and guns. Confusion and self-preservation is not only understandable, it ought to be predictable, even expected.

This would have been a grossly disproportionate way for these cops to have approached Barrett, their arctual suspect, much less a guy they sought to question only about the 10 minutes he'd just spent in the car with her.

The Stephens County, Georgia Sheriff's Department initially said Ayers was a drug suspect, but later had to retract. In her September interview with the North Georgian, Barrett told the paper that Ayers had been trying to help kick her drug habit, but later, while facing charges related to both the Ayers case and another incident, she told investigators that Ayers had in previous years paid her for sex. This testimony persuaded the grand jury not to indict the officers who killed Ayers. The pastor may have fled the police, the grand jury concluded, because he feared his reputation would be ruined if his relationship with Barrett were exposed.

District Attorney Brian Rickman praised the Georgia Bureau of Investigation for going to "very extraordinary lengths" to insure the investigation into the shooting was fair. But Abigail Ayers' civil suit (PDF) calls that assessment into question. The complaint alleges that Officer Harrison, the cop who shot Ayers, wasn't even authorized to arrest him. On the day Ayers was killed, Harrison had yet to take a series of firearms training classes required for his certification as a police officer. More astonishing, Harrison apparently had no training at all in the use of lethal force.

These allegations have since been confirmed by local TV station WSBTV and, after the fact, by the Georgia Bureau of Investigation. Despite the fact that Harrison had killed a man suspected of no crime months earlier without having undergone lethal-force training and certification, the officer was still carrying his badge and gun up until the time of the WSBTV report. Once the publicity hit, Harrison was suspended. Abigail Ayers' civil suit also alleges prior disciplinary problems with both officers Oxner and Harrison, including alleged drug use.

The wasteful use of public resources to pursue a petty drug offender and the aggressive and short-sighted apprehension of Jonathan Ayers that led to his death are bad enough. That a police officer untrained in the use of lethal force and unqualified to be holding a badge and gun was put on a narcotics task force, and then placed in a position where he was able to shoot and kill a non-suspect is worse. But the kicker has to be that the subsequent police-led investigations of this high-profile case failed to turn up such a critical piece of information. It ought to cast more doubt on the already dubious notion that police shootings should only be investigated by other police officers.

At the heart of this outrage, though, once again, is our increasingly demented, hysterical, all-too-literal drug war. Until we're ready to dispense with the notion that gun-toting cops in ski masks going commando at a public gas station is an appropriate response to an alleged $50 drug transaction, we're going to see a lot more Jonathan Ayerses.
Regards,

roo_ster

“Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions.”
----G.K. Chesterton

taurusowner

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2010, 04:21:49 PM »
I stopped reading after the second sentence.  The phrase "gunned down" is an automatic editorial red flag IMO.  I can't trust anyone to be a reliable conveyor of fact if they use that term.

I don't know this case or story.  And if I want to learn about it and form an opinion, I want it to be through facts, not writing style.  The moment I can tell a "journalist" is trying to get me to not like someone or something, not by facts, but by the words they choose, it automatically makes me skeptical of anything they say.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2010, 04:26:28 PM by Ragnar Danneskjold »

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2010, 04:27:24 PM »
I stopped reading after the second sentence.  The phrase "gunned down" is an automatic editorial red flag IMO.  I can't trust anyone to be a reliable conveyor of fact if they use that term.

i red flag the words radley balko
shame he likes to shade the truth just enough to help his cause.  and lose credibility with me
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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zxcvbob

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2010, 04:28:08 PM »
"Gunned-down" is more than fair.  "Murdered" is the word I use to describe this case; I've been watching it since it first happened.  Ayers was shot as he sped away from what looked like an attempted armed robbery or kidnapping.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2010, 04:32:52 PM by zxcvbob »
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2010, 04:28:53 PM »
and this story is no different  lets play the radley game  where we spot the bs
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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taurusowner

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2010, 04:34:01 PM »
"Gunned-down" is more than fair.  "Murdered" is the word I use to describe this case; I've been watching it since it first happened.

I don't really care.  The writer is trying to elicit an emotional reaction in me through his selection of words, not be presenting the facts of an incident and letting me come to my own conclusion.  I don't even know who Radley Balko is, and his second sentence alone shows me he's a hack not to be taken seriously.

makattak

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2010, 04:34:09 PM »
and this story is no different  lets play the radley game  where we spot the bs

Quote
District Attorney Brian Rickman praised the Georgia Bureau of Investigation for going to "very extraordinary lengths" to insure the investigation into the shooting was fair. But Abigail Ayers' civil suit (PDF) calls that assessment into question. The complaint alleges that Officer Harrison, the cop who shot Ayers, wasn't even authorized to arrest him. On the day Ayers was killed, Harrison had yet to take a series of firearms training classes required for his certification as a police officer. More astonishing, Harrison apparently had no training at all in the use of lethal force.

These allegations have since been confirmed by local TV station WSBTV and, after the fact, by the Georgia Bureau of Investigation. Despite the fact that Harrison had killed a man suspected of no crime months earlier without having undergone lethal-force training and certification, the officer was still carrying his badge and gun up until the time of the WSBTV report. Once the publicity hit, Harrison was suspended. Abigail Ayers' civil suit also alleges prior disciplinary problems with both officers Oxner and Harrison, including alleged drug use.

Anything else he says is rather unimportant compared to these points.

If the officer that killed the pastor did not have lethal force training, AND the investigation into this shooting failed to "uncover" that, I have VERY strong doubts about trusting the police to investigate themselves.

Who watches the watchers?
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2010, 04:35:40 PM »
"shows me he's a hack not to be taken seriously."

good assesment
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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MicroBalrog

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2010, 04:36:10 PM »
i red flag the words radley balko
shame he likes to shade the truth just enough to help his cause.  and lose credibility with me

Or so you like claiming.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

MicroBalrog

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2010, 04:37:29 PM »
I don't really care.  The writer is trying to elicit an emotional reaction in me through his selection of words, not be presenting the facts of an incident and letting me come to my own conclusion.  I don't even know who Radley Balko is, and his second sentence alone shows me he's a hack not to be taken seriously.

There's no such thing in the universe as unbiased media reporting. Every report is biased. The better journos are just more subtle.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

red headed stranger

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2010, 04:37:48 PM »
I'm not sure what is more apt than "gunned down"?  "Shot to death" seems just as loaded a phrase.  What is the better term?
Those who learn from history are doomed to watch others repeat it

dogmush

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2010, 04:45:02 PM »
I stopped reading after the second sentence.  The phrase "gunned down" is an automatic editorial red flag IMO.  I can't trust anyone to be a reliable conveyor of fact if they use that term.

I don't know this case or story.  And if I want to learn about it and form an opinion, I want it to be through facts, not writing style.  The moment I can tell a "journalist" is trying to get me to not like someone or something, not by facts, but by the words they choose, it automatically makes me skeptical of anything they say.

Let me help then.

Last summer a pastor was shot by LEO's in GA.
The Pastor was not the target of their investigation, and not suspected of dealing drugs
LEO's were in plain clothes w/ badges around there necks.
They blocked the pastor's vehicle with their unmarked, black Escalade w/rims and got out with pistols drawn.
The pastor tried to flee, and one of the LEO's shot him.
In the course of fleeing, the pastor's car clipped a LEO, who was not injured.
the pastor died claiming he was the victim of an attempted robbery
The LEO that shot him was not trained in use of deadly force or authorized to be carring a weapon.
The GBI's investigation, while being hailed as very complete, failed to turn up that last tidbit.

There you go, no loaded phrases.

taurusowner

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2010, 04:48:19 PM »
Thank you.  Did the officer fire his weapon before or after the subject hit his vehicle?

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #13 on: March 23, 2010, 04:49:33 PM »
Or so you like claiming.

want me to go over this or some of radleys other work?  his recent piece on the mayor of berwyn heights is a good one to start with.  its easy for radley to get away with his typical reader is too busy leaning forward say "yea!" to look for the caca
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #14 on: March 23, 2010, 04:51:40 PM »
Thank you.  Did the officer fire his weapon before or after the subject hit his vehicle?


ahhh you noticed too?  lines 5 and 6 in dogmushes chronicle are in reverse order of how it happened.  an oversight i'm sure
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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lupinus

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #15 on: March 23, 2010, 04:52:36 PM »
Thank you.  Did the officer fire his weapon before or after the subject hit his vehicle?
I believe the report states that he was fired on after.

However, it's a moot point IMO. The core of this is that piss poor overzealous tactics were used.

If you are going to approach someone as if you are robbing/kidnapping/car jacking them don't be surprised when they try to escape. I'd have likely made the same attempt to escape.
That is all. *expletive deleted*ck you all, eat *expletive deleted*it, and die in a fire. I have considered writing here a long parting section dedicated to each poster, but I have decided, at length, against it. *expletive deleted*ck you all and Hail Satan.

taurusowner

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #16 on: March 23, 2010, 04:56:28 PM »
I believe the report states that he was fired on after.

However, it's a moot point IMO. The core of this is that piss poor overzealous tactics were used.

If you are going to approach someone as if you are robbing/kidnapping/car jacking them don't be surprised when they try to escape. I'd have likely made the same attempt to escape.

Well it's not really a moot point because it's a mitigating factor in how serious to charge the officer.  It is a fact that hitting someone or their vehicle with your own vehicle is a deadly force scenario.  Should the officer have been carrying? No.  So that alone is enough for some disciplinary action.  But is he guilty of a crime?  Maybe.  Not murder as others have said.  Perhaps some for of manslaughter as his prohibited carrying of a firearm in the operation could be easily argued to be negligence.  The fact that the officer fired after being struck with a vehicle shows that he could reasonable have been in fear of his life, and that pretty much takes murder off the table.

Obviously the officer did a number of things wrong.  But after hearing what happened without all the hyperbole, I would NOT say that "officers gunned down a pastor".  There is more here than that.

At very least, I think it's a sound policy not to use plainclothes officers for takedowns.

dogmush

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2010, 04:56:55 PM »
Thank you.  Did the officer fire his weapon before or after the subject hit his vehicle?

To be clear, he clipped the officer, not his vehicle.
And it's unclear which happened first.  The officer's inital reports stated that he tried to flee, making them fear for their (pedestrian) safety, so they started shooting.  Exactly where in there the officer standing behind the pastors car was clipped is unclear. (at least to me.)

Quote
an oversight i'm sure

Actually it was, as I added line 6 during a proof-read before I hit post.  I forgot to restructure line 5.  Proof-read, you should really try it sometime.

Perd Hapley

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #18 on: March 23, 2010, 04:58:11 PM »
This is the pastor who was helping a guy that was involved with drugs, and the cops thought he was an accomplice? 

I could easily see my preacher-man getting into that situation, and that would be a real tragedy. 

Still not sure I could blame the cops' screw-up on drug laws, though, but many people seem happy to do so. 
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #19 on: March 23, 2010, 05:00:22 PM »
why in the world would a dept have a guy on the street without certification?  how illegal is that?


and the cops routinely go after the person seen giving up the cash  as generally they are the ones that then have the dope
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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dogmush

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2010, 05:02:02 PM »
 The fact that the officer fired after being struck with a vehicle shows that he could reasonable have been in fear of his life, and that pretty much takes murder off the table.

Obviously the officer did a number of things wrong.  But after hearing what happened without all the hyperbole.  I would NOT say that "officers gunned down a pastor".  There is more here than that.

Except that he was only in reasonable fear for his life due to an un-needed situation that he created.  If they were not justified in creating that threat, they're not justified in responding to it.

If someone breaks into my home and I shoot at them, they're in fear for their life, but not justified in shooting me.

(calm down C&SD, it's an allegory, I'm not calling the cops home invaders.  That's for the ones that shot the mayors dog.)

taurusowner

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2010, 05:02:51 PM »
Quote
This is the pastor who was helping a guy that was involved with drugs, and the cops thought he was an accomplice?  

Being involved with a drug user/dealer, regardless of your vocation, is a pretty good reason to be suspected of also being involved with drugs yourself.  I'm sorry, but it comes with the territory.  And clergymen are not immune to being criminals.

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2010, 05:03:45 PM »
lol  you must read radley a lot.   you spot the radlyisms in that story too?
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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taurusowner

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #23 on: March 23, 2010, 05:04:58 PM »
Quote
Except that he was only in reasonable fear for his life due to an un-needed situation that he created.  If they were not justified in creating that threat, they're not justified in responding to it.

Not quite.  Police are justified in arresting someone they have probable cause to believe has committed a misdemeanor in their presence or a felony anywhere.  I do think they had this when tying to arrest the pastor.  Was the execution of that arrest messed up?  Yep.  But the arrest itself was not unjustified.

lupinus

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Re: Stunning developments in the 2009 police shooting of Georgia pastor
« Reply #24 on: March 23, 2010, 05:06:23 PM »
And rolling up in an unmarked vehicle and jumping out guns drawn that anyone would assume to be a robbery? I consider that the mediating factor here.

Had they blocked him off with black and white, fine whatever. Had they tapped on his window and showed credentials, great.

But they didn't. They used the same exact tactics a car jacker or robber would have used and he reacted accordingly. He had every right to fear for HIS life in the situation, the cops put themselves there with their piss poor tactics.

Perhaps if they received a stiff consequence for their bad tactics that led to an innocent man being killed other officers might be more encouraged to stop and think of the tactics they choose to employee.
That is all. *expletive deleted*ck you all, eat *expletive deleted*it, and die in a fire. I have considered writing here a long parting section dedicated to each poster, but I have decided, at length, against it. *expletive deleted*ck you all and Hail Satan.