VAT... whispers of a VAT from Obama lackey

[AZRedhawk44]

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6355N520100406

Volcker: Taxes likely to rise eventually to tame deficit
NEW YORK
Tue Apr 6, 2010 7:57pm EDT

NEW YORK (Reuters) - The United States should consider raising taxes to help bring deficits under control and may need to consider a European-style value-added tax, White House adviser Paul Volcker said on Tuesday.

Volcker, answering a question from the audience at a New York Historical Society event, said the value-added tax "was not as toxic an idea" as it has been in the past and also said a carbon or other energy-related tax may become necessary.

Though he acknowledged that both were still unpopular ideas, he said getting entitlement costs and the U.S. budget deficit under control may require such moves. "If at the end of the day we need to raise taxes, we should raise taxes," he said.

Value Added Tax:  A surcharge placed by a government entity on a good or service each time it is transferred from one consumer/producer to another consumer/producer.  Essentially, a transaction tax that eclipses even end-consumer sales taxes and inserts itself into the supply line transactions for corporations, your ISP and telephone bill, and the cost of your plumber to fix your leaky pipes.

"Not as toxic an idea" is meant to mean:  They would lynch us for VAT before Obamacare.  Now Obamacare is our party's death knell, and VAT just doesn't matter other than the fact that we like to hurt economic progress and a VAT creates more recession and slower recovery, resulting in more government "need" to pay out entitlements.

I can't believe that these people won't man up and address revenue streams BEFORE addressing new spending.  Commit to debt, then double-whammy the tax payors that DON'T WANT THIS CRAP with a tax on top of the insulting legislation.  Argh.

[209]

We're broke- they will have to do something.

But they won't raise taxes.  It'll be called a Value Added Fee or something.  And millions will get a subsidy to pay for it so they aren't affected by it.

[Waitone]

Now that didn't take long, did it?

[kgbsquirrel]

...he said getting entitlement costs and the U.S. budget deficit under control may require such moves.

Here's a novel thought: Move the nation away from the entitlement mentality and *gasp* spend less! Wait, you mean I'm not the only one who's thought of this?

[HankB]

The FAIR tax is related to the VAT tax, except it's collected entirely from the end purchaser, rather than tacked on at each part of the chain, essentially, it would be a consumption tax - a rich guy that spends 1000x what Joe Sixpack spends would pay 1000x the tax.

The rate would be fairly high - just under 20% - but as explained by its proponents, it would be a REPLACEMENT for the income and FICA taxes, which would simply go away. (As would a good part of the Federal tax bureaucracy, saving us beaucoup dollars.  )

The VAT tax that Obamites are considering would be AN ADDITION to the income tax. <expletive> <expletive> <string of expletives>

[makattak]

I'm fine with implementing a VAT so long as the 16th Amendment is repealed first.

[Monkeyleg]

I'm fine with implementing a VAT so long as the 16th Amendment is repealed first.

Fat chance. New taxes are added, but old taxes are never removed.

[makattak]

Fat chance. New taxes are added, but old taxes are never removed.

Quite. Which is why my statement stands.

Sort of like "a cold day in hell".

[MechAg94]

Form what I understand, since a VAT is implemented at each stage of production, it's effect is much greater than an equivalent sales tax. 

How many laws has the Obama administration "talked" about so far and how many are they seriously trying to pass? 

[Tallpine]

Can anyone say "Black Market" ? 

Oh great... now there will be swat teams breaking down your door to see if you have any non-taxed items in your possession 

[sanglant]

the only way to do a vat at this level is to for all money be converted electric.

[makattak]

the only way to do a vat at this level is to for all money be converted electric.

You think people won't find a black market means around that?

[sanglant]

with cash? no not really. gold maybe, and goods sure, but there are other things that come(at least according to some religions ) with the ecash.

[kgbsquirrel]

with cash? no not really. gold maybe, and goods sure, but there are other things that come(at least according to some religions ) with the ecash.

Silver is easier to get a hold of in any quantity. Thoughts from the more knowledgeable in the realm of intrinsic worth?

[Scout26]

They will push to get as much as they can before November.  They will go to the congresscritters that signed their own death warrants with Obamacare, and tell them might as well go all the way, you've jumped off the cliff, lets get as much as we can before we hit bottom.

[longeyes]

The VAT won't stop this country from going broke.  It's just the next drug of choice.

[sanglant]

Silver is easier to get a hold of in any quantity. Thoughts from the more knowledgeable in the realm of intrinsic worth?

i was using gold as shorthand for "valuable metal" isn't that the way most of us use it?

[kgbsquirrel]

i was using gold as shorthand for "valuable metal" isn't that the way most of us use it?

No, I use "material of intrinsic value" or more simply "barter item" for that purpose. I use "gold" when I mean the actual metal gold.    Don't feel bad, I'm just weird like that.

[AZRedhawk44]

The next 4 years will be a litmus test for the GOP.

Especially if this:

They will push to get as much as they can before November.  They will go to the congresscritters that signed their own death warrants with Obamacare, and tell them might as well go all the way, you've jumped off the cliff, lets get as much as we can before we hit bottom.

comes to pass.  Obamacare, VAT, Illegal Amnesty, might as well throw in some gun control for good measure.  Maybe some gerrymandering, too.

I acknowledge that repeal of this stuff while Obama is in office is problematic.

However:  he needs to be stopped COLD in 2011, and removed from office in 2012.  The GOP needs to make efforts to repeal or defund a lot of this stuff while in control of the House and in less dire straits in the Senate, and they need to field a REAL CANDIDATE for POTUS... not Rudy McRomney again.

And that POTUS, if/when he wins, needs to take initiative to strike this $#!+ off the books of USC in his first 90 days of office.

Anything less than that means the dramatic decline of this country and the retirement of the GOP as a meaningful alternative to the Democrats.

[Jamisjockey]

They need amnesty and gerrymandering.  They will try desperately to create more (D) districts between Amnesty and the Census this year.  Even if we clean house in 2010, it's not over.  The Stupid party needs to stick it out and repeal and roll back as much as they can from at least the last two administrations (including GWB's idiocy).  I personally don't think they have the balls.

[Scout26]

If the GOP doesn't become the party of NO and doesn't start undoing/unfunding parts of the .gov, they will go the way of the Whigs.....

[makattak]

They need amnesty and gerrymandering.  They will try desperately to create more (D) districts between Amnesty and the Census this year.  Even if we clean house in 2010, it's not over.  The Stupid party needs to stick it out and repeal and roll back as much as they can from at least the last two administrations (including GWB's idiocy).  I personally don't think they have the balls.

Gerrymandering is done at a state level, I believe. If you want to stop that, make sure you have good representatives in your state legislature.

[Boomhauer]

Though he acknowledged that both were still unpopular ideas, he said getting entitlement costs and the U.S. budget deficit under control may require such moves. "If at the end of the day we need to raise taxes, we should raise taxes," he said.

BULLSHIT. They haven't got any intention of paying for the costs with these taxes...they will just vote for more and more spending.

[longeyes]

Counting on the GOP is like trying to stop a tank with a 9-iron.

They are stuck on nice.

[Waitone]

Gerrymandering is done at a state level, I believe. If you want to stop that, make sure you have good representatives in your state legislature.

Those states subject to the Voting Rights Act (which curiously approximates the Confederacy) makes fed.gov the overseer of all things voting in subject states.