The Deadly Remington 700

[sanglant]

the point of the glock safety system is to make a market for these.


but really, here's the marketeer's take. is it better than any other handgun's safety system? i have no idea.

[230RN]

Well, it's true that when I was young enough to go bounding around the mountains and prancing around the Grasslands, I did carry it C&L, but I had a holster strap under the hammer.

But not for day-to-day carry around town.  Sorry.  I'll never convince anybody that C&L with a 1911 is an unsafe practice, and you'll never convince me that it's safe.

230RN said that, and that's the way it goes, 21 Oct 10.

[sanglant]

something you might want to read.

[roo_ster]

Well, it's true that when I was young enough to go bounding around the mountains and prancing around the Grasslands, I did carry it C&L, but I had a holster strap under the hammer.

But not for day-to-day carry around town.  Sorry.  I'll never convince anybody that C&L with a 1911 is an unsafe practice, and you'll never convince me that it's safe.

230RN said that, and that's the way it goes, 21 Oct 10.

So, how do you feel about Glocks being cocked & unlocked (Condition zero)?

--even though, according to a retired military person who was in the MPs, the Army will not allow you to carry a 1911 C&L unless you were escorting a prisoner.

The Army just plain doesn't trust most enlisted men with ammo of any sort.  This is not unique to the 1911, but a function of leadership not investing in much training for folks in the "big Army," as I refer to most of the Army outside my (former) community.

I'd bet you dollars to donuts that units issued 1911s nowadays have no problem carrying C&L, when loading weapons is called for.

[GigaBuist]

So, how do you feel about Glocks being cocked & unlocked (Condition zero)?

Glocks are not fully cocked.  If every internal safety gave way at the same time there's not enough potential energy for the striker to ignite the primer.  They're closer to Condition 2 than Condition 0.

[zahc]

Glocks are not fully cocked.

But plenty of comparable designs are. My XD45 and my M&P9 are basically single-action, with a firing pin block safety like a series 80. Sure, they have the stupid trigger widget of some sort, and the XD has a grip safety, but they are basically cocked and (not even) locked. Just because you can see the hammer on a 1911 doesn't make it more dangerous.

[MechAg94]

Which is why I like my CZ 75P06 which I can carry double action. 

IMO, You can carry any way you feel like as long as YOU are fully aware of what it takes to make the gun go off and YOU make sure that doesn't happen unless you intend it.

[Marnoot]

The only real difference is in the stock trigger-pull. The trigger-pull weight on an XD is higher than that on a 1911, which makes an ND a touch harder over an un-safed 1911. Equating a Glock/XD to a cocked & unlocked 1911 isn't quite accurate.

IMO, You can carry any way you feel like as long as YOU are fully aware of what it takes to make the gun go off and YOU make sure that doesn't happen unless you intend it.

+1

[230RN]

Well, it's true that when I was young enough to go bounding around the mountains and prancing around the Grasslands, I did carry it C&L, but I had a holster strap under the hammer.

But not for day-to-day carry around town.  Sorry.  I'll never convince anybody that C&L with a 1911 is an unsafe practice, and you'll never convince me that it's safe.

230RN said that, and that's the way it goes, 21 Oct 10.

Also sprach 230RN

[Regolith]

This is literally 28 year old news.

The original Remington 700 trigger system WAS prone to doing this.  In 1982, Remington re-designed the trigger to stop this from happening and issued a recall.  They will still fix any old rifles that haven't been to a shop.

If the rifle was made after 1982, the most likely culprit is either gunk and rust in the mechanism, or someone doing some shade tree gunsmithing on the trigger.

Here's a more detailed post about it:

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2010/10/21/my-take-on-remington-under-fire/

[280plus]

That's right, I said it... http://www.magazineart.org/main.php/v/ads/sportsandguns/gunsandammo/ColtAutomaticPistol-1911A.jpg.html

[HeroHog]

I watched all of Remington's videos and saw.... nothing. They showed an "expert witness" handling a rifle in an unsafe manner (bolt closed, finger on trigger. Don't know if it had just been fired or what) and another who worked at an ammo plant that may or may have not made their ammunition. There was no substance at all. They showed an apparent "expert witness" saying he couldn't make the rifle misfire but it was again shown with no context at all. So far what they show on their own site amounts to a small pile of nothing I am afraid.

[brimic]

This whole news hatchet job smells a lot like exploding gas tanks.

[Jamisjockey]

Anyone remember what killed the Samurai?


http://www.aim.org/aim-report/aim-report-a-black-eye-for-consumer-reports/

Consumer reports felt that they had to save consumers from something. The thinking being that this would give credibility to the their testing.  The supervisor in charge of the testing ordered the drivers to roll the Samurai, or she would find someone who would.  They couldn't get it to roll on the course they'd used for 15 years, even driving it at a higher speed than the other vehicles.  Solution?  Drive the snot out of it, get it to lift two tires off the ground, then redesign the test course around the conditions that they used to get the Samurai's wheels off the ground.  The testers still reported that even under the new test conditions, it was difficult to get the Samurai to lift tires, much less roll.
After dozens of tries, they finally got it to lift two tires again.  The result? They had advertising material for years to prove how they exposed an unsafe product.

[brimic]

Consumer reports felt that they had to save consumers from something. The thinking being that this would give credibility to the their testing.  The supervisor in charge of the testing ordered the drivers to roll the Samurai, or she would find someone who would.  They couldn't get it to roll on the course they'd used for 15 years, even driving it at a higher speed than the other vehicles.  Solution?  Drive the snot out of it, get it to lift two tires off the ground, then redesign the test course around the conditions that they used to get the Samurai's wheels off the ground.  The testers still reported that even under the new test conditions, it was difficult to get the Samurai to lift tires, much less roll.
After dozens of tries, they finally got it to lift two tires again.  The result? They had advertising material for years to prove how they exposed an unsafe product.

Unfortunately, any test can be gamed.
SUVs can be made to roll if you drive them excessively fast into corners, hitting the brakes hard at the apex, then letting off the brakes as well- but these aren't real world driving conditions.
Gas tanks can be made to explode if you rig them with explosives.
Police sniper rifles will 'fire by themselves' if the armorer stets the sear engagement way too thin on purpose for the camera. (If the video remington 700 on the police range fired by itself without being set to do so, the armorer of that department needs to be buttstroked with the rifle and then fired.)