Author Topic: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?  (Read 10566 times)

Lanius

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to suggest that general intelligence, which is an adaptive* trait(one that often governs how well an entity survives), may not be equally well developed in all populations of men? I mean, it's far harder to survive in the steppes than to survive in some pleasant, tropical place that has lots of rain and shine and where stuff grows easily and the chief problem is to keep the monkeys from eating it.

It's also freaking obvious that Jews are someone's chosen people. According to IQ** tests, most of them have higher verbal intelligence, supposedly it's about 115 on average, at least in European Jews. Now, I don't feel threatened by that, as my general intelligence is nearly one standard deviation higher, supposedly... but it is a damned interesting thing to think about.

The explanation is either that during their millenia long history, Jews who couldn't hack the tora were shamed and maybe cast out, or that during the middle ages, when Jews in Europe were banned from agriculture and restricted to trade and money-lending, the smart ones were far better at these occupations, which enabled them to support bigger families. This went on for centuries.

If you're interested in the technical side of that debate, google ashkenazi intelligence and plenty of articles will come up.

Another group of geneticists claim it may have been founder's effect, that most of European Jews today are descended from a small population of Jews who were probably smart.

There is also the fact that Jews suffer from a lot of interesting genetical diseseas akin to sickle cell anemia in that they're thought to be related to their higher intelligence, but sometimes are fatal.

The diseases are neural system related(Tay Sachs disease for example), and only express themselves if there's an unlucky match(in plain-speak). It's thought that these diseases are caused by rapid evolution that had happened to Jews back whenever it was they've gotten so smart..

I've gotten banned from places just for pointing out Jews are smarter, which... is chanelling 2nd Lt. Obvious due to the number of geniuses their tribe has produced.. but really. But these were mostly crypto-antisemitic places ran by New-Zealand survivalist libertarian types.

Most people don't know about it, but in the past, certain elite US schools had Jew quotas, so they only took a certain number of Jews in each year, which kind of reminds me that today, certain US schools supposedly don't take people by merit, but also have racial quotas on asian-americans and other fanatical student types.

**yeah, I know they don't really measure anything, but it seems they correlate pretty well with stuff like SAT results, personal income, the chance to end up in prison and distaste towards hip hop and rap music and one's ability to write anything useful quickly in C++

*I may be off here, but anyway, it's obvious general intelligence is useful. For some things, like mathematics or physics or programming or indeed anything worthwhile

seeker_two

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2011, 08:52:42 AM »
So.....you're saying that the Jews are the Master Race?.....  =|
Impressed yet befogged, they grasped at his vivid leading phrases, seeing only their surface meaning, and missing the deeper current of his thought.

makattak

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2011, 09:15:24 AM »
I don't think it racist to believe that one "race" of people, on average, have a certain set of characteristics that are better or worse than those same characteristics in other races.

For example, Kenyans (and West Africans in general) are AMAZING at distance races. Looking at the list of marathon winners across the world bears that out.

Racism only comes from thinking that a person is inferior, that is, worth less than some other person, and deserving of fewer rights based on their having that set of characteristics that make up a "race."

Unfortunately, many liberals believe that thinking the "races" are different must necessarily mean you think certain "races" are inferior and others superior. (Works that way with the sexes as well.)

Thus, if you believe that any certain race (or sex)possesses, on average, any advantage or disadvantage,  you are a racist (sexist). (Exception: Unless you think "disadvantaged" minorities (or women) have advantages over majorities (or men). Then you are enlightened.)
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

makattak

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #3 on: June 06, 2011, 09:19:03 AM »
Also, this reveals the liberal belief system.

It's not just any characteristic that makes you a racist (sexist). It is generally having to do with intelligence. If you think a non-disadvantaged race (or men) has some advantage in some aspect of intelligence, you are a racist (sexist.)

Thus, liberals believe that people of lower intelligence are inferior. I reject that notion.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

kgbsquirrel

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2011, 10:18:58 AM »
I don't think it racist to believe that one "race" of people, on average, have a certain set of characteristics that are better or worse than those same characteristics in other races.

For example, Kenyans (and West Africans in general) are AMAZING at distance races. Looking at the list of marathon winners across the world bears that out.

Another example would be the Sherpas whose culture thrives at altitudes at which I'd keel over from hypoxia.

To Lanius, if the capacity of other physical attributes can be directly linked to one's genetic composition (and thus one's lineage) it would be reasonable to presume the same would hold true for brain development and thus intelligence. That a vociferous group of dubious intent have striven to make such a concept distasteful and un-PC through the disingenuous application of the label of racism is neither here nor there because, as Makattak said, the stating of a physical fact based on empirical evidence is not the defining factor of racism but is instead the baseless and supercilious contempt held for those of differing descent and any definitive actions derived there-of.

Pb

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2011, 11:34:08 AM »
Sowell's "Ethnic America" has a fascinating section on Jews:

http://www.amazon.com/Ethnic-America-History-Thomas-Sowell/dp/0465020755

If I remember the book correctly, around 100+ years ago Jewish immigrants were on average the poorest, most uneducated, had the lowest IQs and the highest birthrate of all immigrant groups.

My how that changed!

He goes into great detail about the cultural practices of Jews that allowed them to thrive in the USA.

MicroBalrog

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2011, 01:21:51 PM »
Brain development is known to also hinge on a group's social status, and even the quality of their food.
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makattak

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2011, 01:23:09 PM »
Brain development is known to also hinge on a group's social status, and even the quality of their food.

I would expect that physical development would hinge on the quality and quantity of food as well...
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

wuluf

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2011, 07:38:32 PM »
Quote
Brain development is known to also hinge on a group's social status, and even the quality of their food.


Then how'd we do so well on cow tongue, jellied carp and no bacon????

zxcvbob

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2011, 07:42:49 PM »
"Racist" is mainly a codeword for Neoliberals declaring the debate to be over and themselves to be the winners on whatever topic when they've been beaten or baffled by the logic.

(So when racial prejudice really occurs, everybody just rolls their eyes and think the liberals are being ignorant again.)

Neoconservatives are just as bad, but different.  They want to be Hitler, but a good Hitler this time.

Classic Liberals, Paleoconservatives, and Libertarians (IMHO) have a lot in common.
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Lanius

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #10 on: June 07, 2011, 08:52:07 AM »
Quote
So.....you're saying that the Jews are the Master Race?.....  undecided

Not really.  Nazis and Islamists think so.. that Jews are always conspiring or actually control everything, but it does not seem likely.

I would say that the master race will arise when the oligarchs who wield great influence in western societies decide that their progeny should recieve some genetical engineering that would give them superior abilities. Quite possible, because only the richest people can afford the cutting edge in medical technologies.

Quote
Thus, liberals believe that people of lower intelligence are inferior. I reject that notion.

Well, we can always say who is superior and who is inferior in some area, like that Jews are much better at Chess than  say, African americans.

Some cultures are superior to others. For example, compare the Japanese and Nigerians. Sure, Japanese have a lot of issues, but they are world class in many industries and are doing okay. Nigeria is only world class in corruption and maybe 419 scams.
But the thing is, nothing is static, and for example, some hundreds of years ago Germans had a bad reputation, were thought unreliable and stupid, whereas these days you can hardly find a more orderly country. Shame about their Greens though.

Quote
Brain development is known to also hinge on a group's social status, and even the quality of their food.
Hmm. Iodide deficiency is dangerous, and also, supposedly seafood slightly raises intelligence because it contains stuff that does good to the neural system.

280plus

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #11 on: June 07, 2011, 08:10:35 PM »
I'd venture it has a lot to do with the Jews being a race that values and strives for education. I believe if you grow up in an educated household you are much more likely to have an enhanced affinity for educating yourself.
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Lanius

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #12 on: June 08, 2011, 04:46:43 AM »
That's true, it is likely a factor, but it looks very likely it's not just that, as intelligence is heritable, partially.

MicroBalrog

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #13 on: June 08, 2011, 07:39:33 AM »
I'd venture it has a lot to do with the Jews being a race that values and strives for education. I believe if you grow up in an educated household you are much more likely to have an enhanced affinity for educating yourself.

Certainly true in Ashkenazi households.

A pair of Jewish mothers are watching their children play in the park.

'So,' - one asks - 'How old are your kids?'

'Well, the lawyer is seven years old. The doctor is five.'
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"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

280plus

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #14 on: June 08, 2011, 07:55:17 AM »
I would imagine that if you took an accurate cross section of most any ethnic group you would find the curve of less smart to more smart would be about the same for all.

Then you might compare it further to the curve of highly educated vs uneducated and see if there is any correlation between that and the "smartness" curve.
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Lanius

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #15 on: June 08, 2011, 08:21:39 AM »
Quote
less smart to more smart would be about the same for all.

That's true. The kicker is, ethnics or nations don't have the same 'average' IQ.
Average IQ for Jews, if they are given the same test as non jewish white Americans is supposedly 115. Chinese average(in China) seems to be 105.




makattak

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #16 on: June 08, 2011, 08:32:52 AM »
Then you might compare it further to the curve of highly educated vs uneducated and see if there is any correlation between that and the "smartness" curve.

Reverse causation.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

grampster

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #17 on: June 08, 2011, 10:26:19 AM »
"For example, Kenyans (and West Africans in general) are AMAZING at distance races. Looking at the list of marathon winners across the world bears that out."

Hunh!  I've been betting on the skinny dark colored dogs in the last race (marathon) at the dog track for years.  Mostly lose. :facepalm:  No correlation between skinny and dark for distance runners. [popcorn]  =D

Sorry, couldn't resist.  Now I'll go back and read the rest of the thread. :P
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280plus

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #18 on: June 08, 2011, 03:59:19 PM »
Quote
Average IQ for Jews, if they are given the same test as non jewish white Americans is supposedly 115
Anybody that knows me knows I can't resist saying,,,  >:D

All that proves is the Jews are secretly in control and the tests are written by Jews so that Jews will inherently score higher than everybody else and it's all part of their grand scheme to claim their superiority above all the other races on Earth even though they are just cheating.  :angel:

No really, IQ tests for one can be biased, even unintentionally. So are virtually invalid when compared across various ethnic groups. Beyond that I would again like to be able to compare the curve of these IQ tests with the curve of the education level of the subject group. For example if you take 100 random Jews and 100 random non Jews chances are the Jews will have an overall higher education level. Just a guess on my part of course. Could depend on what area you're getting your people from too. Here in West hartford the Jewish population are all highly educated. Rye, NY however, You'll find a much more middle class jewish population. i wonder how those two groups would measure up against each other.

Although I will say, I'm an Eyetalian and in HS I measured 130 junior year and 131 senior year. Graduated 1975. Since then I have gotten a 4 year degree among doing a bunch of other things. A few years back I took an online IQ test and scored,,, 131. I'm not sure what that says but I thought it was interesting

MENSA wants me but I'm just a little too smart to give them my money.  :laugh:

I know! We're going to need government funding to reserch this further!.
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makattak

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #19 on: June 08, 2011, 04:02:42 PM »
No really, IQ tests for one can be biased, even unintentionally. So are virtually invalid when compared across various ethnic groups. Beyond that I would again like to be able to compare the curve of these IQ tests with the curve of the education level of the subject group. For example if you take 100 random Jews and 100 random non Jews chances are the Jews will have an overall higher education level. Just a guess on my part of course. Could depend on what area you're getting your people from too. Here in West hartford the Jewish population are all highly educated. Rye, NY however, You'll find a much more middle class jewish population. i wonder how those two groups would measure up against each other.

Again, you're likely mixing up the causation relationship. Higher intelligence is very likely to be the cause of pursuing more education.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

AJ Dual

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #20 on: June 08, 2011, 04:37:00 PM »
Lanius,

All I know is that English is not your first language. What's your country of origin?

What I can say though is that in America, these differences (that everyone KNOWS exist) between different racial/ethnic groups are "racist" is because the Political Correctness movement, Political Left, and Mainstream Media have decided that discussing or acknowledging these differences is "racist".

More culturally/ethnically homogeneous countries like Japan and other Asian nations, some European nations (at least, until recently) don't have as many, or any minority groups trying to leverage political power through professional indignation and professional victimhood. So sometimes these differences are discussed more openly and bluntly.
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Lanius

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #21 on: June 08, 2011, 04:42:17 PM »
Country of origin? I was born in Czechoslovakia.. a nation that, sadly, no longer exists. Idiots  [ar15] 

Quote
No really, IQ tests for one can be biased, even unintentionally.
Jewish superiority is evident elswhere. Were Jews equally smart as other ethnics, the share of exceptionally gifted Jews would be markedly lower.

How come an ethnic with .5% population has produced what.. 25-30% of all physics nobel prize winners?
And I don't think it's just about 'education'. You can't really  educate people beyond their level of intelligence..

See more here:
http://www.jinfo.org/Nobel_Prizes.html

280plus

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #22 on: June 08, 2011, 05:38:22 PM »
Again, you're likely mixing up the causation relationship. Higher intelligence is very likely to be the cause of pursuing more education.
Yes but higher education may also lead to higher intelligence in regards to if you grow up in an educated household you are more prone toward developing a higher intelligence. I'm saying environment has a hand in there as well.
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grampster

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #23 on: June 08, 2011, 07:31:17 PM »
Most of the truly smart people that I have encountered in life, usually did not have much of a formal education from institutional schools.  My father, for one, made it through 10th grade, yet when he died in his 90's, had taught himself and had very good grasp of advanced math and was reading and understanding quantum mechanics, general relativity and string theory.  He also was well read in history, sociology and had many talents in wood working, drawing, painting and welding among other things.  (I must have been adopted :facepalm: =D)

Many of the truly inventive and intuitive people I've known were tradesmen.  Successful people in sales have to be bold, not smart.  I'm not slighting those in medicine and associated sciences, for example, for whom a structured education is necessary.  Although a medical education could be thought of as a trade school.  The research end of medicine is another horse.

As for Jews, in my mind they took advantage of a world that mostly reviled them, interfered with them, stole from them, killed them and generally put them in a position that they either excelled or else......In other words, they built a culture of hard work and success.  Other cultures are notable for abject failure and self hatred when confronted with the same circumstance.  

My money is on the fact the one's culture has more to do with individual and group success than IQ.
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Bogie

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Re: Can of Mongolian thunder death-worms: Why exactly is it racist...?
« Reply #24 on: June 08, 2011, 07:48:01 PM »
Okay... We've got someone living in a desert. It's hot, it's nasty, they hate it. Why don't they move? They don't know...
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