Economics for the math challenged

[Monkeyleg]

The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel had a question for readers as to whether they thought that having additional taxes on "millionaires" to pay for the "payroll tax reduction" would help the economy. They published this jewel of an answer:

Yes: The Journal Sentinel Editorial Board on Dec. 6 asked whether readers favor a surcharge on millionaires that would "pay" for the extension of the payroll tax cut. After considering this question for perhaps a nanosecond, I decided that I definitely favor this surcharge.

The payroll tax cut could mean approximately $1,500 annually or about $125 per month for those who earn less than $1 million. I thought I would see how $125 might be spent by the over-$1 million population as opposed to the 99% who earn less than $1 million.

Now, where might the over-$1 million population shop? Hmm? What might $125 buy at Tiffany's? I found that Tiffany's had 18 items on its under $250 link that cost only $125. Sparkly baubles at bargain prices to cheer the millionaires.

Now the under-$1 million population - where might they shop? Macy's is somewhat pricey, but what could $125 buy on a link at Macy's? It seems that the kids link has about 350 items under $125 in the coats and cold weather pages alone. Jackets, scarves and mittens to warm toddlers, kids and teens in the under-$1 million population.

It doesn't take an economist to see that the purchasing power of 99% of the population might actually have a considerable impact on the Gross Domestic Product and the United States economy, not to mention middle- and lower-income families.

If a surtax on millionaires allows an extension of the payroll tax cut for average working people, I say, yes, without a doubt, to the surtax.

Marilyn McKnight
Milwaukee

[Rob Morse]

The money you loose won't cost a thing, and the same money I get is invaluable.  Now they call it 'Stuck on stupid.'  We called it CADET when I was in school.

Can't
Add,
Doesn't
Even
Try

[freakazoid]

So anyone who makes less than $1 million is in the 99%, and they are still complaining? Dang, those are some rich people.  Went looking to see how much the top 1% actually make, therefore knowing how "little" the 99% has to make to be a part of the 99% and came across this, http://www.joshuakennon.com/how-much-money-does-it-take-to-be-in-the-top-1-of-wealth-and-net-worth-in-the-united-states/ Interesting article. Talks about mean income verses net wealth and such and the intellectual dishonesty that is used to report wealth, sort of like how anti-gunners often lump in suicides by guns.

[Monkeyleg]

I wonder if she ever sat down and figured out what she was saying. Let's for the sake of argument say that her side (whatever that is) wins, and the top 1% pay for the $1500 "payroll tax cut" for the other 99%. This means that one person out of one hundred is paying $1500 for each of the 99, or $148,500. That's not exactly $1500.

It's also $14.85% of the income of someone with taxable income of $1 million. Add to that the 35% federal tax they would pay on that taxable income, plus 6-10% state tax, and we're up to 55.85% to 59.85% of their income, and that's not even including other taxes (such as the 12.5% Social Security tax when congress lifts the income cap).

I wonder how she'd feel if .gov took nearly two-thirds of her income? Would she even bother to work (assuming she works now)?

[Jamisjockey]

The money you loose won't cost a thing, and the same money I get is invaluable.  Now they call it 'Stuck on stupid.'  We called it CADET when I was in school.

Can't
Add,
Doesn't
Even
Try

You've found loose money? Where?
 

And if I read your reply right, you're accusing Monkeyleg of being in the 1%? 

[Monkeyleg]

JJ, I wouldn't use "accuse" in your sentence. "Mistaking" might be more appropriate.

[Ned Hamford]

I wonder if she ever sat down and figured out what she was saying....
It's also $14.85% of the income of someone with taxable income of $1 million. Add to that the 35% federal tax they would pay on that taxable income, plus 6-10% state tax, and we're up to 55.85% to 59.85% of their income, and that's not even including other taxes (such as the 12.5% Social Security tax when congress lifts the income cap).

I wonder how she'd feel if .gov took nearly two-thirds of her income?

As long as its someone else, I think the phrase is 'fair share.'   

Basic math and reasoning skills are death to popular political catchphrases.  Which may explain why schools seem so purposefully inept at cultivating them... 

[brimic]

The letters to the editor in the milwaukee journal sentinel have gotten to a new level of stupid over the last few weeks.

[Perd Hapley]

The money you loose won't cost a thing, and the same money I get is invaluable.  Now they call it 'Stuck on stupid.'  We called it CADET when I was in school.

Can't
Add,
Doesn't
Even
Try

I guess she can add alright. It's the subtraction she forgot about. Do you think that money that "millionaires"  won't be spending might hurt the GDP? Just a crazy thought I had.

[Jocassee]

You've found loose money? Where?
 

And if I read your reply right, you're accusing Monkeyleg of being in the 1%? 

I believe he was mocking the writer of the letter, not our own dear Monkeyleg.

[Brad Johnson]

I believe he was mocking the writer of the letter, not our own dear Monkeyleg.

Can we still mock him even when he's right?

Brad

[Monkeyleg]

OK, folks, another great letter this evening:

TAXES

War is over; wealthy won

When American officials consider higher taxes for the top 1%, they are met with cries of "redistribution of wealth" and "class warfare."

America's wealth has been redistributed for decades. Every time we buy gasoline, our wealth is channeled into the coffers of the oil companies. These companies often, in turn, pay no taxes, so the wealth only moves upward. When we shop at Walmart, though Walmart does pay considerable taxes, our dollars go to the Walton heirs who have a combined wealth greater than those of us whose wealth is in the bottom 30% of all Americans.

These are only two examples of how wealth in America has been siphoned from the middle class and working class into the coffers of the wealthy for decades.

Redistribution of wealth? A great part of America's wealth has been going only one way, to the top. Class warfare? That war is over, and the upper classes have won.

Karen Wagner
Wautoma

Huh. Every time we buy a product, our wealth is channelled into the coffers of the company we bought it from. What a radical concept. I wonder if the company she works for just hands the money back to the customer and says, "here, it's free. Have a nice day."

And those gawdawful Walton heirs. To think that they should make money from the largest chain of retail stores in the country. I wonder if it ever occurred to Ms. Wagner to buy a small store, as Sam Walton did, and build it into a huge chain of stores, and make a lot of money. Nah. Better to hate the people who did.

[TommyGunn]

OK, folks, another great letter this evening:

TAXES

War is over; wealthy won

When American officials consider higher taxes for the top 1%, they are met with cries of "redistribution of wealth" and "class warfare."

America's wealth has been redistributed for decades. Every time we buy gasoline, our wealth is channeled into the coffers of the oil companies. These companies often, in turn, pay no taxes, so the wealth only moves upward. When we shop at Walmart, though Walmart does pay considerable taxes, our dollars go to the Walton heirs who have a combined wealth greater than those of us whose wealth is in the bottom 30% of all Americans.

These are only two examples of how wealth in America has been siphoned from the middle class and working class into the coffers of the wealthy for decades.

Redistribution of wealth? A great part of America's wealth has been going only one way, to the top. Class warfare? That war is over, and the upper classes have won.

Karen Wagner
Wautoma

Huh. Every time we buy a product, our wealth is channelled into the coffers of the company we bought it from. What a radical concept. I wonder if the company she works for just hands the money back to the customer and says, "here, it's free. Have a nice day."

And those gawdawful Walton heirs. To think that they should make money from the largest chain of retail stores in the country. I wonder if it ever occurred to Ms. Wagner to buy a small store, as Sam Walton did, and build it into a huge chain of stores, and make a lot of money. Nah. Better to hate the people who did.

Oh joy ... yet another jackwagon who needs to be locked in a room with Professor Walter Williams for about half an hour .......
I could go on ... but dwelling on this type of stupidity isn't good for my blood pressure.

[MicroBalrog]

Every time we buy gasoline, our wealth is channeled into the coffers of the oil companies.

It's almost as if this person simply threw money into the self-service machine and got nothing in return.

If only gasoline was valuable somehow...

[Perd Hapley]

America's wealth has been redistributed for decades. Every time we buy gasoline, our wealth is channeled into the coffers of the oil companies. These companies often, in turn, pay no taxes, so the wealth only moves upward. When we shop at Walmart, though Walmart does pay considerable taxes, our dollars go to the Walton heirs who have a combined wealth greater than those of us whose wealth is in the bottom 30% of all Americans.

These are only two examples of how wealth in America has been siphoned from the middle class and working class into the coffers of the wealthy for decades.

Redistribution of wealth? A great part of America's wealth has been going only one way, to the top.

And yet, she keeps buyin' stuff, doesn't she? 

[Jim147]

If only every dollar my company made went into my pocket...

I might make enough to be in the 99%

jim

[Monkeyleg]

I wonder if she's ever viewed her paycheck as the profit she makes for working (assuming she does) after the cost of transportation, food and any materials or equipment needed for the job?

It's been said here (and elsewhere) again and again that this is all just a politicized manifestation of a base human emotion, envy.

Every time I read letters like these, I'm reminded of my oldest friend, John, whom I met in third grade. He was raised by two flaming liberals and became a card-carrying member of the Communist party in senior year of high school.

At our tenth class anniversary, one of the speakers was a classmate of ours who had built a multi-million dollar business in those few years. Very impressive. My friend wasn't impressed, though. He talked about the millions of dollars in the most loathing tones, and he sounded as though he thoroughly hated our classmate. It was clear, though, that what he felt the most was jealousy. This guy had made a lot of money by working hard. My friend hardly worked, but wanted what our classmate had. If he could have taken it with a gun, I'm sure he would have.

[Monkeyleg]

Another letter. Notice the similarity to the letter above that makes reference to the Walton heirs. Coincidence or faxed talking points?

WAL-MART

Walton's heirs helped destroy middle class

A recent Forbes magazine article stated that Sam Walton's combined six heirs' fortunes of $93 billion are more than the total bottom 30% of Americans, which means that just six people in Bentonville, Ark., own more than do 100 million Americans in 50 states.

How can this be? I recall when Walton was alive, he prided himself on selling American-made products. After he died, that seemed to change rapidly when some bean counters discovered that Wal-Mart could make more profit buying from Chinese companies rather than from American companies. Thus, with the help of conservative GOP tax breaks (and former President Bill Clinton's NAFTA) American jobs were destroyed as Walton's heirs quickly moved millions of American jobs offshore or to Mexico.

For example, take the Mirro Corp. in Manitowoc. For generations, Mirro made high-quality aluminum kitchen items that provided over 1,000 family-paying jobs in the Manitowoc-Two Rivers area, an area of 50,000 hardworking families. Mirro was a community base for good jobs, good schools and a good quality of life.

Thanks in large part to Walton family price pressures, Mirro was forced to leave Manitowoc for Mexico. Yet how ironic that at Walton's family museum in Bentonville, where Sam opened his first mercantile store, an original Mirro aluminum pan is proudly displayed and bears the inscription "Mirro. Made in Manitowoc Wisconsin." Not anymore.

I think if Walton were still alive, he'd say "enough already" and gladly agree to live for less wealth (maybe a paltry $15 billion) just to have hometown favorites such as Manitowoc become healthy, wealthy (middle class) and vibrant again.

God bless Sam Walton, because his heirs, in my opinion, have destroyed this once great America by destroying its middle class.

M.J. Mangan
Milwaukee

Either M.J. here was good buddies with Sam Walton, or M.J. is a psychic. Either way, he seems to know that Walton would have said "enough" at $15 billion. But why 15? Why not 5 or 3 or 30 or 60? Why would Sam Walton (assuming M.J's psychic abilities are sound) think that $15 billion was not just "paltry", but just right?

As for his heirs, I never realized they wielded enough power to destroy the American middle class. Barack Obama has done a fair amount of damage, and he's in the White House, and even is sometimes working. The Walton heirs have more power to damage the US middle class than the president? Why can't Iran or the Saudi's do the same kind of damage? Surely they can come up with a few billion, just like the Walton heirs. I didn't realize destroying the middle class was so easy.

[Perd Hapley]

I like how the author blames tax cuts in the U.S. for jobs moving to Mexico. Maybe he meant that Mexico lowered taxes?