Author Topic: I think my motorcycle is worse than I thought... (Read 8599 times)

gunsmith · « **Reply #25 on:** May 21, 2012, 04:17:40 PM »

Quote from: RoadKingLarry on May 21, 2012, 04:05:47 PM

Another alternative for breaking the pistons loose if it is seized is ATF.

If your object is to ride THAT bike then it's doable but your cost is very likely going to be quite a bit higher than value. If your object is to ride A bike it may be time to cut your losses and find something else.

I'd be surprised if there isn't a Honda CM forum on the net somewhere.

Try BARF ( bay area riders forum ) plenty of good info, as long as you do not bring up politics.

White Horseradish · « **Reply #26 on:** May 21, 2012, 04:46:03 PM »

Quote from: RoadKingLarry on May 21, 2012, 04:05:47 PM

I'd be surprised if there isn't a Honda CM forum on the net somewhere.

There probably is, but APS knows EVERYTHING.

Seriously, I've got good info on AC, appliances, and so on down the alphabet to zombies here.

White Horseradish · « **Reply #27 on:** May 21, 2012, 07:43:50 PM »

Ok, something got unstuck. Maybe the clutch.

Now, if it's in gear, it won't roll. If I pull the clutch, it will. If I stomp on the kickstarter with the clutch disengaged it will go down and come back up. If I leave the clutch engaged it won't budge.

What is the correct way to use the kickstarter? Is it in neutral with clutch engaged? Am I just fighting the stuck pistons now?

RoadKingLarry · « **Reply #28 on:** May 21, 2012, 08:02:39 PM »

If you can kick it over the pistons either aren't seized (anymore?) or something major has broken. Sounds to me like it is working more or less like it should.
With the trans in neutral you should be able to kick it over with the kick starter, clutch pulled or not. I don't know if that model had a clutch interlock or not but it may, that "probably" would only either electrically lock out the electric starter and/or disable the ignition.
At this point I would pull the plugs, and shoot some light oil in the cylinders and work it some more.

Time for a battery and see if it has any life in it.

Also, I don't remember if it's been mentioned on this thread but don't forget the tires. Even if the tires on it look good, if they are vintage to the bike they are dangerous and need to be replaced. When motorcycle tires get old they get harder than Chinese algebra and they will put you on the ground.
A buddy of mine resurrected a late '80s Goldwing a few year ago, I gave him the same advice. He didn't listen. I miss him.

He retired and I haven't seen him since but he did have the bike slide out from under him with the old tires.

Lee · « **Reply #29 on:** May 21, 2012, 08:08:03 PM »

On the bright side, if parts are hard to find, you could part it out and do pretty well.

White Horseradish · « **Reply #30 on:** May 21, 2012, 08:12:31 PM »

Ok, so if clutch is not pulled and it rolls, it's safe to say it's in neutral.

In this state the kickstarter moves when clutch is pulled and does not move when it is not.

I am not sure it actually moves the engine. I took out a plug, put my finger over the hole, kicked it, and didn't feel anything going in or out.

Jim147 · « **Reply #31 on:** May 21, 2012, 08:45:59 PM »

Quote

I am not sure it actually moves the engine. I took out a plug, put my finger over the hole, kicked it, and didn't feel anything going in or out.

That is not a good sign.

jim

geronimotwo · « **Reply #32 on:** May 21, 2012, 09:01:30 PM »

i had a 69 cl350, and as i recall the kickstarter should work (turn the engine over) regardless of the clutch position. did you try to force it to get the engine unfroze, and feel something snap? if you put it in gear, does the rear wheel turn with the cletch released?

Jim147 · « **Reply #33 on:** May 21, 2012, 09:31:18 PM »

It's been a while since I've worked on a bike. My Grizzly doesn't have a kickstarter. Anyone have a link to a manual so I can look this over?

jim

griz · « **Reply #34 on:** May 21, 2012, 10:46:38 PM »

I think your clutch works but your rings are rusted to the cylinder walls. IIRC the kickstarter drives through the clutch so unless it's released (clutch lever out) it will only spin the clutch basket. If the engine is not locked up you will be able to hear it turn over by putting the bike in top gear and rocking it back and forth. Can you see in to the clylinder through the plug hole? If you can see the cylinder walls at all I'll bet you will see some rust. Sorry for the bad news, sounds as if it's time for some sort of penetrating oil to start with.

White Horseradish · « **Reply #35 on:** May 22, 2012, 08:24:33 PM »

Well, I think this is the case as well. Filled cylinders with PB Blaster. Pulled the carb, which was surprisingly clean inside. Dumped it into a bucket of cleaner.

We'll wait and see.

On a side note, I see a few cheap bikes on CL that are "motor turns, doesn't run". Is this typically gummed up carbs? If so, I might look into that. Carburetor cleaning does not intimidate me, I have compressed air.

Tuco · « **Reply #36 on:** May 22, 2012, 10:17:10 PM »

Quote from: White Horseradish on May 22, 2012, 08:24:33 PM

....... cheap bikes on CL that are "motor turns, doesn't run". Is this typically gummed up carbs? ....

Or blown head gaskets, or scored cylinder walls, or tossed wrist pin, or fried ignition... ad infinitum
Check compression on everything before you buy it.

Go down that road and you'll wind up with an awesome set of specialty tools. Not a bad thing, but not quite cheap.

charby · « **Reply #37 on:** May 22, 2012, 10:59:15 PM »

Quote from: Tuco on May 22, 2012, 10:17:10 PM

Check compression on everything before you buy it.

That is what I do after I make sure the motor isn't stuck when buying non running motors off craigslist.

White Horseradish · « **Reply #38 on:** May 23, 2012, 09:14:51 AM »

Quote from: Tuco on May 22, 2012, 10:17:10 PM

Go down that road and you'll wind up with an awesome set of specialty tools. Not a bad thing, but not quite cheap.

That's where I wound up with cars.

I can't really afford to buy what I want, so I buy cheap and broken and fix it.

White Horseradish · « **Reply #39 on:** May 23, 2012, 10:32:43 AM »

Pulled the valve cover just to take a look.

charby · « **Reply #40 on:** May 23, 2012, 10:52:36 AM »

Looks really clean.

Is that rust on that cam journal bolt?

White Horseradish · « **Reply #41 on:** May 23, 2012, 11:19:57 AM »

I think it is. It doesn't make sense, the other bolts look like new.

RoadKingLarry · « **Reply #42 on:** May 23, 2012, 12:07:58 PM »

Other than the orange spot that looks incredibly clean for that old a bike. But now that you have the moving parts exposed, do they move?

Grebnaws · « **Reply #43 on:** May 23, 2012, 01:43:12 PM »

I'm not familiar with the cm200 or related Honda 250cc engines but they should respond to all the basic tricks needed to free up an engine. With the cover off you can see that it's bone dry inside. Check for any obvious slack in the cam chain and start soaking the cylinder walls through the plug hole. With the internals that dry it seems likely that your pistons and rings could be frozen. Soak the crap out of it for a few weeks and then start rolling it back and forth in gear to break it loose. I don't know the common wisdom about breaking an engine loose by removing an engine cover and turning a nut on the exposed crankshaft so be careful before attempting that method. If it breaks loose continue with a valve adjustment and work your way back to the carbs and electronics from there.

This would never be my first response to a bike problem but with a small 200cc engine that can be handled alone you may consider swapping over to a known good engine. I have dead ended on my cb500 project due to parts cost and availability. If a good engine came my way for a few hundred I'd hand over the cash and be done with it.

gunsmith · « **Reply #44 on:** May 23, 2012, 04:04:34 PM »

Are you sure you really want a cm200 anyway? Those things are tiny,-the only thing they are really good for is teaching 4 ft tall girls how to use a motorcycle anyway.

I had a friend who tried to use one - he is about 5" 5 - he kept on crashing as it was just to small, he finally got a bigger bike - a 500 and was much better off

White Horseradish · « **Reply #45 on:** May 23, 2012, 05:21:06 PM »

Quote from: RoadKingLarry on May 23, 2012, 12:07:58 PM

But now that you have the moving parts exposed, do they move?

Nope.

Quote from: gunsmith on May 23, 2012, 04:04:34 PM

Are you sure you really want a cm200 anyway?

Well, I'd really like something shinier, bigger, newer, and working, but this one is already here. "iwannamotorcycle" is fighting the reality of my bank account.

I am thinking of checking out this Suzuki 450 that a guy has nearby. He says it won't start after years of storage, but that the motor turns.

Quote from: gunsmith on May 23, 2012, 04:04:34 PM

Those things are tiny,-the only thing they are really good for is teaching 4 ft tall girls how to use a motorcycle anyway.

You know, as it happens, I know a 4ft-tall girl that is thinking about learning...

gunsmith · « **Reply #46 on:** May 24, 2012, 08:47:04 PM »

Quote from: White Horseradish on May 23, 2012, 05:21:06 PM

I am thinking of checking out this Suzuki 450 that a guy has nearby. He says it won't start after years of storage, but that the motor turns.
You know, as it happens, I know a 4ft-tall girl that is thinking about learning...

If its one of them GS models from the 80's early 90's I'm envious - they're great mc's

White Horseradish · « **Reply #47 on:** May 24, 2012, 10:50:10 PM »

Quote from: gunsmith on May 24, 2012, 08:47:04 PM

If its one of them GS models from the 80's early 90's I'm envious - they're great mc's

That's exactly what it is. Guy wants $400. Weather was extra-wet today so I didn't go, I'll call him tomorrow.

There is another guy with a Honda 750 of the same vintage, might check that out, too.

News:

Author Topic: I think my motorcycle is worse than I thought... (Read 8599 times)