Author Topic: What did the President know and when did he know it?  (Read 24178 times)

Perd Hapley

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #50 on: October 26, 2012, 06:47:13 PM »
A humiliating electoral defeat and retreat into ignominious obscurity is the best punishment we can hope for.


You're an optimist. He will have a comfortable life as an academic or consultant, until he is appointed to U.N. Ambassador by the next Democrat administration.
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SADShooter

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #51 on: October 26, 2012, 08:22:38 PM »

You're an optimist. He will have a comfortable life as an academic or consultant, until he is appointed to U.N. Ambassador by the next Democrat administration.

I deliberately wrote hope for, not expect.
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kgbsquirrel

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #52 on: October 26, 2012, 08:54:59 PM »
There was a Spectre ready and waiting for the word GO. It was never received.

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2012/10/26/ac-130u-gunship-was-on-scene-in-benghazi-obama-admin-refused-to-let-it-fire/




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zxcvbob

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #53 on: October 26, 2012, 09:09:41 PM »
I sometimes wonder if the ambassador might have done something to piss off Obama and got Uriah'd
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SADShooter

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #54 on: October 26, 2012, 09:41:43 PM »
I sometimes wonder if the ambassador might have done something to piss off Obama and got Uriah'd


Sadly, that's probably a more comprehensible explanation than the truth. I was mad before. Now, hard to quantify the reaction.
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Ben

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #55 on: October 26, 2012, 09:55:13 PM »
I've just started seeing some interviews with Tyrone Woods' father. If accurate, behavior of the administration in their interactions with him is pretty darn deplorable, and someone should smack Biden upside the head with a 2x4.

Sample:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/26/father-seal-killed-in-libya-says-clinton-vowed-to-arrest-and-prosecute/
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Sergeant Bob

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #56 on: October 26, 2012, 09:56:09 PM »
The more I hear about this the more infuriated I become. Leon Panetta says they did not know enough about the situation to take action. They had realtime video and 2 drones photographing the action, along with reports from CIA operatives on the ground, yet he said they did not have enough intel to deploy rescue teams to the site. How much intel did he freakin need!?

This is a travesty of justice and heads should roll.

The only ones really questioning the operation ( or lack of) is Fox news. This should bury Obama, but the faithful will follow him no matter what.

I am so frakking pi$$ed!
Personally, I do not understand how a bunch of people demanding a bigger govt can call themselves anarchist.
I meet lots of folks like this, claim to be anarchist but really they're just liberals with pierced genitals. - gunsmith

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RoadKingLarry

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #57 on: October 26, 2012, 10:53:14 PM »
Panetta sa;s they didn't have enough info to act.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/26/panetta-military-lacked-enough-information-to-intervene-during-benghazi-attack/

Bullshat!

You had US personnel calling for help.
THAT is enough info to act.


If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

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Scout26

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #58 on: October 27, 2012, 02:57:25 AM »
You had US personnel calling for help.
THAT is enough info to act.

This.  When Americans call for help, we send it.  American troops are smart enough and trained enough to improvise on the fly and accomplish the mission.

That being "Save the Americans."

Why do I feel that the NCA/POTUS did not want the possibility of a "Desert One" or "Blackhawk Down" and then they (being the NCA and his "team") came up with the cockamamie Youtube video story to cover-up his failure to act. 

Again, I will bet that Hillary had the e-mails and other information leaked, so she won't have to fall on Barak's sword.



Say hello to the "October Surprise".  Four dead Americans, denied support, and story to cover-up why they died.



Enraged doesn't begin to describe it. 
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Jamisjockey

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #59 on: October 27, 2012, 07:59:38 AM »
Panetta sa;s they didn't have enough info to act.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/26/panetta-military-lacked-enough-information-to-intervene-during-benghazi-attack/

Bullshat!

You had US personnel calling for help.
THAT is enough info to act.





Lets pause for a second.

Lets give them the benefit of the doubt.
"Not enough info to act".

Okay, fine. Not enough information to act.
But then cover it up for over 2 weeks? Refuse to call it a terrorist act?  Blame it on some half assed video nobody ever heard about? 

 :facepalm:

This is plain and simply an obvious political calcuation so that the president didn't look weak in the month leading up to the election.  No, he slept like a baby while his people were dying in Lybia, and then when everyone realized how that was going to look, they covered it up.
*expletive deleted*ing disgusting. 
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Sergeant Bob

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #60 on: October 27, 2012, 09:52:58 AM »
This is plain and simply an obvious political calculation so that the president didn't look weak in the month leading up to the election.  No, he slept like a baby while his people were dying in Libya, and then when everyone realized how that was going to look, they covered it up.
*expletive deleted* disgusting. 

That's exactly what it is. :mad:
Personally, I do not understand how a bunch of people demanding a bigger govt can call themselves anarchist.
I meet lots of folks like this, claim to be anarchist but really they're just liberals with pierced genitals. - gunsmith

I already have canned butter, buying more. Canned blueberries, some pancake making dry goods and the end of the world is gonna be delicious.  -French G

longeyes

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #61 on: October 27, 2012, 11:19:38 AM »
He ends up looking like what he is, only to only half the nation.  That's our future, I'm afraid.
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slingshot

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #62 on: October 27, 2012, 01:04:18 PM »
The PRESIDENT went to bed is the only reasonable explanation for this fiasco. Dereliction of duty!  There is simply no explanation that is acceptable and it goes right to the President.  Presidential authority was necessary for our planes and interdiction forces to cross into Libya as I understand it.  I don’t know how THE president can look at himself in a mirror.  But he does....  that should tell you something about THE MAN.

If this would have been George W. Bush, all of the press would be climbing all over his butt and he would have lost his re-election bid over this one event.
 
Not “optimal”?  That term does not do any justice to what happened.  Even if the Ambassador was still killed, the correct response is to take immediate action even if there are casualties.
 
The debate on foreign policy should have been a total blow out against Obama.  The problem was that there was not enough factual information available yet to people outside the White House.

I think it's time for a very serious campaign ad by Romney that points out Obama foreign policy....  Obama sleeping....

This whole ordeal really pisses me off.  Words simply do not capture my feeling of disgust.
 
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RocketMan

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #63 on: October 27, 2012, 01:10:07 PM »
Slingshot, Romney, and the Republican leadership in general, are too 'nice' to run a serious campaign ad of that sort.  Historically, they have shown an overwhelming, totally unrealistic and rather pathetic desire to be liked by those that will never think well of them under any circumstances.  Romney and the Republican leadership are afraid to upset or offend anyone.
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longeyes

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"Domari nolo."

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Monkeyleg

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #65 on: October 27, 2012, 07:10:35 PM »
Slingshot, Romney, and the Republican leadership in general, are too 'nice' to run a serious campaign ad of that sort.  Historically, they have shown an overwhelming, totally unrealistic and rather pathetic desire to be liked by those that will never think well of them under any circumstances.  Romney and the Republican leadership are afraid to upset or offend anyone.

If Romney were to go on the attack on this issue, it would set back the image he's trying to portray on foreign policy (especially to women) as being thoughtful, and not rash. It would also remind everyone of the Candy Crowley moment in the first debate.

What could work is having an outside group run ads attacking Obama on this, with no mention of Romney.

An even more effective strategy, but harder to pull off in less than two weeks, would be a nationwide grassroots drive that would force the media to cover this issue in depth. I don't think a petition would cut it (do they ever?). Something like tens of thousands of people in front of the White House would be something that couldn't be ignored. If there were enough conservatives left who subscribed to the NYT, a mass cancellation of subscriptions could force their hand. The media can be forced to cover stories if the right tools are used.

ArfinGreebly

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #66 on: October 27, 2012, 09:49:51 PM »


The PRESIDENT went to bed is the only reasonable explanation for this fiasco. Dereliction of duty!  There is simply no explanation that is acceptable and it goes right to the President.  Presidential authority was necessary for our planes and interdiction forces to cross into Libya as I understand it.  I don't know how THE president can look at himself in a mirror.  But he does....  that should tell you something about THE MAN.

If this would have been George W. Bush, all of the press would be climbing all over his butt and he would have lost his re-election bid over this one event.

Something to keep in mind is the time scale and time zone differential.

When this attack started, it was about 4:00 PM in Washington DC.  The attack went on for about seven hours.  The president didn't go to bed until after 11:00 PM, DC time.

In other words, the president was awake for the entire action.

There would be NO PLAUSIBLE WAY for him to have been ignorant of the action or its circumstances or the requests for support and their denial.

Just, you know, to set the record straight on the "slept through it" concept.
 


Not “optimal”?  That term does not do any justice to what happened.  Even if the Ambassador was still killed, the correct response is to take immediate action even if there are casualties.
 
The debate on foreign policy should have been a total blow out against Obama.  The problem was that there was not enough factual information available yet to people outside the White House.

I think it's time for a very serious campaign ad by Romney that points out Obama foreign policy....  Obama sleeping....

This whole ordeal really pisses me off.  Words simply do not capture my feeling of disgust.

Smartest thing Romney has done with this was to NOT engage on it during the debate.

If he had taken this on, given the state of the known information at that time, then the continuing story would be "well, Romney said this," and the spin on the phrasing, whether it was ill-informed, premature, etc. and the story would have gotten lost in that noise.

Instead, the fact Romney didn't engage on that became the topic in the days that followed, providing a stage for the developing story, and Romney has no exposure in the developing story at all.

Dumb luck or genius execution, I don't really care which, I'll take it.


Every expert under the sun is now making it clear that the president HAD to know within minutes, had to have a real-time feed, and had to have known everything he needed to know to issue a "go" order for a rescue.

Patraeus has now made it clear that the CIA leadership issued no order to "stand down."  He didn't embellish, which is telling in itself.

Father of Tyrone Woods has made it clear that Obama and Hillary both lied.


Romney has no need to engage on this further.  He can focus on the economy and jobs, and let the public wave of outrage do the rest.
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RoadKingLarry

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #67 on: October 27, 2012, 09:59:54 PM »
Obama slept, widows wept.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

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kgbsquirrel

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #68 on: October 27, 2012, 10:09:08 PM »
I'm not one to post RUMINT, but I've been hearing bits and pieces about General Carter Ham getting relieved of command of AFRICOM. Also raising an eyebrow is the Stennis Battlegroup's Admiral being relieved today as well. Does anyone have access to a credible source?

ArfinGreebly

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #69 on: October 27, 2012, 10:32:21 PM »

I'm not one to post RUMINT, but I've been hearing bits and pieces about General Carter Ham getting relieved of command of AFRICOM. Also raising an eyebrow is the Stennis Battlegroup's Admiral being relieved today as well. Does anyone have access to a credible source?

Conflicting narratives at this time.

The Admiral really can't be all that related, since his group departed for the Middle East via Pacific Ocean with stops along the way, all of which started AFTER the 9/11 thing, so I don't see any connection.

Ace of Spades is poo-pooing the Gen. Ham thing as likely not relevant.

Steve Shippert (Threats Watch) is less sanguine about Gen. Ham, and finds it plausible that there may be some "disagreement with stand-down orders" shenanigans going on.

No definitive information at this time.
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RoadKingLarry

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #70 on: October 27, 2012, 11:28:50 PM »
Wouldn't the mass resignation of every US ambassador just be a gut buster? :rofl:

It's not like they are going to get any support from the Obama admin.
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kgbsquirrel

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #71 on: October 27, 2012, 11:49:44 PM »
Wouldn't the mass resignation of every US ambassador just be a gut buster? :rofl:

It's not like they are going to get any support from the Obama admin.

Or protection?  =|

ArfinGreebly

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #72 on: October 27, 2012, 11:52:02 PM »

[Biden] Hey, who ya gonna trust? [/Biden]
"Look at it this way. If America frightens you, feel free to live somewhere else. There are plenty of other countries that don't suffer from excessive liberty. America is where the Liberty is. Liberty is not certified safe."

Perd Hapley

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #73 on: October 28, 2012, 01:44:58 AM »
I've just started seeing some interviews with Tyrone Woods' father. If accurate, behavior of the administration in their interactions with him is pretty darn deplorable, and someone should smack Biden upside the head with a 2x4.

Sample:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/26/father-seal-killed-in-libya-says-clinton-vowed-to-arrest-and-prosecute/


Hillary assured him that they would arrest the film-maker. There is no facepalm graphic sufficiently large enough to suit that.
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kgbsquirrel

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Re: What did the President know and when did he know it?
« Reply #74 on: October 28, 2012, 10:27:34 AM »
Yesterday:

http://washingtonexaminer.com/playing-the-petraeus-card/article/2511908
Quote
the CIA put out a statement that “No one at any level in the CIA told anybody not to help those in need; claims to the contrary are simply inaccurate.”

Today:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/26/cia-operators-were-denied-request-for-help-during-benghazi-attack-sources-say/
Quote
urgent request from the CIA annex for military back-up during the attack on the U.S. consulate and subsequent attack several hours later on the annex itself was denied by the CIA chain of command


Hmmmmm......   :mad:


ETA: Just something to point out that seems to get lost in the whole "the seals went to help and died thing." They, reportedly, didn't die trying to reach the ambassador, those two seals were, again reportedly, killed by a mortar "while manning a machine gun nest on the roof of the CIA compound." Said compound was about a mile from the consulate where the ambassador was killed. So, trying to piece their movements together, they went out to try to get the ambassador, came back, decided to man an MG nest on the open roof of the CIA compound during a mortar attack, and were subsequently killed?
« Last Edit: October 28, 2012, 10:52:34 AM by kgbsquirrel »