Any signs of a new run on gun purchases yet?

[Pharmacology]

I don't get the hate for CTD either.

Everyone loves capitalists until someone actually acts like one.

If there's anything to not like them for its their other business practices, such as when they take your money and then tell you something is on backorder for 6 months.

I think it was based on the whole -folding-under-pressure-and-not-selling-evil-black-rifles-anymore

[280plus]

I called a local gun store and asked how they were doing on ammo. The lady laughed. 

[Gewehr98]

I think it was based on the whole -folding-under-pressure-and-not-selling-evil-black-rifles-anymore

Could be, but they're selling black rifles. 

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/ItemListing.aspx?catid=7777

[freakazoid]

Went to a local gun store yesterday and they were pretty well stocked up on all sorts of ammo.

[MechAg94]

"all sorts of ammo" can be pretty general.  Bass Pro Shops had all sorts of ammo if you are looking for hunting ammo in calibers that are not 308, 223, 5.56, 7.62X39 or any halfway common pistol ammo.

I realized last night my local Academy had Winchester 5.56 and Monarch 308, 7.62x39, 223 up at the front service desk.  Limit of one box per person per caliber. 

[freakazoid]

They had all those. There was another place selling Wolf 7.62x39 and some type of bulk surplus .308. When I was back home in Kansas the Cabela's had a huge stack of Herter's 7.62x39, had a limit but I don't know what it was, maybe 20 boxes.

[cordex]

Could be, but they're selling black rifles.  

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/ItemListing.aspx?catid=7777

Well, now they are.  They stopped selling guns right alongside Dick's decision to stop selling ARs.  That suspension was phrased thusly:

Cheaper Than Dirt! is suspending online sales of firearms effective immediately. We are reviewing our policy internally, and will continue to be the leader in the outdoor industry with our full line of gear and accessories.

Given the context and the timing, the meaning I read that as: "We're stopping online gun sales, and are trying to decide whether or not we're going to continue selling guns online at all.  Don't worry, we'll still sell camping and hunting stuff."

Their customer base exploded at them and all of a sudden their decision wan't about "Reviewing our policy" it was about catching up on their orders.

You may buy their spin, but I don't.  I think they stopped because they were afraid they were going to be excoriated by the press for selling guns online and thought it would be a good PR trick to be like Dick's did and make a proactive move against guns.  Get out ahead of the antis, as it were.  Since then they've had to backpedal for their lives when they figured out what their customers thought of that decision (hence the donation to SAF and pimping their no sales to anti-gun states policy).

[Doggy Daddy]

Given the context and the timing, the meaning I read that as: "We're stopping online gun sales, and are trying to decide whether or not we're going to continue selling guns online at all.  Don't worry, we'll still sell camping and hunting stuff."

Exactly the way I read it too.

[Gewehr98]

I disagree.

Seeing how gunshops and Mountain of Geese are currently and completely sold out of everything, without any prospect of being really stocked until maybe sometime in 2014 if not later, it was never a bad idea to take a short time out and assess one's business model for the long haul.  Inconvenient to panicked consumers, yes.  I'm still flabbergasted by the $1.00/round XM193 55gr ammo at the last gun show I attended, and the flocks of people scrambling to buy it at that price.

"Suspend" always meant "temporary" in my understanding of the term. Magpul will probably suspend sales while they transition to their new digs outside Colorado, too.  It may be a couple days, or a couple weeks.

As for Dick's, well, I never liked them to begin with. They are a sports clothing and shoe store that dabbles in boomsticks on the side.  It wasn't their big revenue generator.

Wait until the next school shooting.  There won't be anything left to buy, IMHO.

[cordex]

I guess we'll have to disagree (except about Dick's and what will happen when there is another shooting).  Context and phrasing simply did not indicate they were on the side of the angels.  Everything they've done since then has been desperately trying to make up for the bad publicity their initial statement caused.

If they were really worried about being overwhelmed with orders, they - like so many others - would have said something like "Due to overwhelming order volume, we are temporarily not accepting new orders.  Existing firearm orders may be delayed as much as 72 hours for shipping while we catch up with the backlog."  Instead they start talking about reviewing policies?  Not at all the same thing.

[Jim147]

When you take all the ammo and components out of the Midway flier, it gets mighty thin.

I think that shows how bad things have become.

jim

[MechAg94]

I disagree.

Seeing how gunshops and Mountain of Geese are currently and completely sold out of everything, without any prospect of being really stocked until maybe sometime in 2014 if not later, it was never a bad idea to take a short time out and assess one's business model for the long haul.  Inconvenient to panicked consumers, yes.  I'm still flabbergasted by the $1.00/round XM193 55gr ammo at the last gun show I attended, and the flocks of people scrambling to buy it at that price.

"Suspend" always meant "temporary" in my understanding of the term. Magpul will probably suspend sales while they transition to their new digs outside Colorado, too.  It may be a couple days, or a couple weeks.

As for Dick's, well, I never liked them to begin with. They are a sports clothing and shoe store that dabbles in boomsticks on the side.  It wasn't their big revenue generator.

Wait until the next school shooting.  There won't be anything left to buy, IMHO.

I don't know.  I think part of what is happening now is a whole bunch of people who never bothered to stock up before are buying all the ammo they can until they feel they have enough.  I guess there are others stocking up for the Great Ban also.  The question for me is when will those people feel they have enough and who is coming up behind them to stock up after the next shooting. 

[cordex]

I don't know.  I think part of what is happening now is a whole bunch of people who never bothered to stock up before are buying all the ammo they can until they feel they have enough.  I guess there are others stocking up for the Great Ban also.  The question for me is when will those people feel they have enough and who is coming up behind them to stock up after the next shooting. 

It isn't about having "enough".  Scarcity or perceived scarcity can itself provide reason to continue to buy long after you have a sufficient amount.  For me, anyway.

[drewtam]

State of the Industry, March 2013

As I type this it is almost 3AM at my desk and it is still polluted with 4473's, invoices and all sorts of hardware of the Hoi Polloi so I needed a break.
Few quick notes:
I have talked with MANY manufacturer reps. Factories are AT CAPACITY. A year ago, the factory was at capacity and the order books have just gotten larger.
The week of Sandy Hook - LWRCI booked $10,000,000 in orders in ONE WEEK. That's a lot of black rifle.
Bushmaster, DPMS, all of Freedom Group - way behind. I don't think it's quantifiable by integer but they are at capacity.
ATK - I talked to them and they are currently backlogged THREE YEARS with the current size of the order book. If the order book gets larger, the backlog goes up.
This is no different than an airline calling up Boeing and saying - Hi, we need 10 737's. You can build one every week so that should take 10 weeks tops, right? Wrong. Everyone is ahead of you in line. You've got to wait your turn.
I'm seeing some distributors play favorites and allocate product to their big accounts - Academy, Gander, Bass Pro, et al but I do not see a lot of smaller dealers getting anything to sell. Everything is still tight across the board.
With Magpul doing a Boulder Airlift, that is going to play with magazine prices but if Colorado gets their ban - magazine prices will rise into the legislative effective date and a lot of people will cash in on Colorado residents because they are willing to pay to get mags before the window closes just like the Californians did.
Barrett - 10 months on all rifle orders. Non-essential productiction rifles are being shelved, so REC7 is indefinite and M82A1 is 10 months out.
HK - Moving some 7.62 piston rifle production stateside, should mean more product but I am skeptical.
Colt - At capacity.
I don't know what prices are going to do because demand is perpetually in flux but a LOT of people went overboard at Christmas and Tax Refund season so lets see how things play out.

http://www.reddit.com/r/guns/comments/19iivg/state_of_the_industry_march_2013/

[Gewehr98]

Yup.

If you don't have it already, you ain't gonna get it anytime soon.

Magazines, to me, used to be "wear items".  I have a goodly stash, but knowing the supply chain issues, I am scaling way back on my shooting activities until things settle down.

Well, that, and I don't want to burn through my reloading components - since they are also unobtanium at present.   

[280plus]

So I saw my Wilson Arms owner friend last night (Wilson ARMS makes gun barrels for all of the above) I said tii him, "How's the backorders?" he says, "I'm thinking I should send Obama a bonus check for salesman of the year!" 

[MechAg94]

Yup.

If you don't have it already, you ain't gonna get it anytime soon.

Magazines, to me, used to be "wear items".  I have a goodly stash, but knowing the supply chain issues, I am scaling way back on my shooting activities until things settle down.

Well, that, and I don't want to burn through my reloading components - since they are also unobtanium at present.   

I know what you mean.  I just got more mags and another drum for my Suomi.  I am not even sure if I want to shoot it as I don't have a great deal of 9mm.

[cosine]

Borepatch chats with a Glock marketing guy.

Glock is, basically, a year behind in US orders:

Also note this about the "NY boycott" thing:

If Glock is going to unveil a bunch of new models in June... I'm hoping that one of them is a single-stack 9mm.

j/k 


However, as one of the commenters at Borepatch pointed out, a Glock 9mm carbine would be really sweet.

[AJ Dual]

If Glock is going to unveil a bunch of new models in June... I'm hoping that one of them is a single-stack 9mm.

j/k 


However, as one of the commenters at Borepatch pointed out, a Glock 9mm carbine would be really sweet.

No, it's going to bee the new Glock carbine, the... Garbine. 

[lee n. field]

Yup.

If you don't have it already, you ain't gonna get it anytime soon.

Magazines, to me, used to be "wear items".  I have a goodly stash, but knowing the supply chain issues, I am scaling way back on my shooting activities until things settle down.

I got an "it's in now" notification from Midway, about Glock 19 magazine springs.  I ordered in enough to rebuild most of my Korean G19 magazines.

I confirmed graphically, something I've noticed.  KCI uses crappy springs.  See attached.  There's barely enough strength to get the follower to the feed lips.

[bedlamite]

I received a notification for an AR-15 mag catch at Midway. I just checked and they are sold out already. Total elapsed time: 13 minutes.

[Scout26]

Wheaton Gun Show today: 

Got there at 9am.  There was ammo here and there so we'd figure that we swing thru see what there is to see and find the "deals".   

First it was packed.  Wall to wall humanity.

AR's (about 10 total in the whole place)  Anywhere from $1600-$3000 (All were labeled as "Rare" ).  AR mags Magpul-$45 and up, crappy aluminum GI ones-$30

Looked like everyone had emptied out their basement of anything and everything gun related, put ridiculous prices on it and dropped it on a table.   (No Beanie- Babies, but lots of jerky, WWII/Nazi stuff, BBQ sauces, the usual political types passing out fliers and leaflets.)

Doors opened at 9am we got there about 9:30.   Reloading guys had almost no primers (saw some Magnum large rifle and lots of shotgun), very little powder, save BP substitutes.   

By the time we left at 11:00 the guy near the front selling reloaded pistol ammo was down to .40S&W.  Most other folks only had a a box or three of non-hunting rifle ammo going for on average $1.00 a round.  Pistol ammo was averaging $.50 per round.

Lots of revolvers, shotguns and bolt/lever guns.   A few semi-pistols.  And one guy asking $695 for an Ishapore SMLE No1. MkIII*. 

I bought a rare earth magnet and two road flares.   

[French G.]

Well, my gunshow was a bit better. Chatted with a guy who was privately selling an AR, Plum Crazy plastic lower, but good upper, mags, and 400 rds of ammo for $1250. Thought it was a great deal, I somehow kept my money in my pocket. I assume he sold it, but I did see him still with it after an hour, damn near bought it. I don't think the panic is off, just people have run out of money. I off-loaded my Saiga-12 for a good deal, I did see one dealer with a Saiga 20 for sale at 1,200+.  I think the black rifle crowd in my area has reached fatigue, there were not many takers on the $1/rd 5.56 several dealers had. I had P-mags for sale at $35 no takers, would have taken 30, didn't need to sell them, but if someone really needed them... Sold a 1911 I didn't think I would, not the most in demand gun, but found someone who wanted one. Primers? What's that? Several dealers had $2,500 ARs and 1,100 stock AKs. The guys with the big nazi flags, can we set them on fire yet?

Biggest WTF was component bullets. I bought 500 230gr Berrys for $85, meaning my loaded cost for 500 will be about $125 and 2 hours. If I ever get my new loading bench up... I saw a bag of pulled SS109 projectiles, crappy for loading IMO, $185 for 500? Huh?

[lee n. field]

I got a notification today from Midway that Glock OEM G19 magazines were back in stock.  Well, they're back out of stock.

[Balog]

I can get OEm Glock 19 mags locally. Limit 2 a day, with tax about $40 apiece. I'm happy to ship them to APS'ers in need.