Author Topic: Backlash in NY & Penalties?  (Read 37974 times)

lee n. field

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,534
  • tinpot megalomaniac, Paulbot, hardware goon
Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« on: February 02, 2013, 05:47:46 PM »
From a new thread at Illinoiscarry.

Quote from: some guy in the Youtube vid
And I get a sense from the audience here, that there is not a lot of enthusiasm for compliance

You could say that.

le YouTube vid
In thy presence is fulness of joy.
At thy right hand pleasures for evermore.

SADShooter

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5,242
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2013, 06:06:43 PM »
 :O :cool:
"Ah, is there any wine so sweet and intoxicating as the tears of a hippie?"-Tamara, View From the Porch

Blakenzy

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2,018
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2013, 06:34:21 PM »
I think it's a safe bet that penalties will be the standard "Men of violence kick your door in and shoot your dog, flashbang your children" followed up by liberal doses of "10 years behind bars" for possession of a piece of molded plastic.

Funny how the State initiates violence on the non-violent to keep the non-violent safe from violence. War is Peace huh?
"Knowledge will forever govern ignorance, and a people who mean to be their own governors, must arm themselves with the power knowledge gives. A popular government without popular information or the means of acquiring it, is but a prologue to a farce or a tragedy or perhaps both"

RoadKingLarry

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 21,841
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2013, 08:55:04 PM »
The chest beating and rhetoric is getting even more intense than usual.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

AJ Dual

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 16,162
  • Shoe Ballistics Inc.
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2013, 10:16:43 PM »
To me, the real threshold would be spontaneous gatherings of armed neighbors/friends forming up whenever an arrest is attempted on the new NY laws and then possibly even more people arriving from outside the immediate area than local law enforcement is willing to deal with.

If the courts don't strike down these laws in the post-Heller/McDonald era of case law and precedent, that's the last resort.

I promise not to duck.

Scout26

  • I'm a leaf on the wind.
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 25,997
  • I spent a week in that town one night....
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2013, 01:03:02 AM »
What truly caught my attention in that video was the number of people there that most would normally be considered to be "FUDDS".  Several older gentlemen including one wearing the old red and black checkered wool hunting hat and coat.

Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help.


Bring me my Broadsword and a clear understanding.
Get up to the roundhouse on the cliff-top standing.
Take women and children and bed them down.
Bless with a hard heart those that stand with me.
Bless the women and children who firm our hands.
Put our backs to the north wind.
Hold fast by the river.
Sweet memories to drive us on,
for the motherland.

AZRedhawk44

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,948
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2013, 01:46:07 AM »
Good on them.

Frankly, I hope the NY politicians get scared of this movement.  Truly scared.  And step back from the brink, and repeal this.
"But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist."
--Lysander Spooner

I reject your authoritah!

Jamisjockey

  • Booze-fueled paragon of pointless cruelty and wanton sadism
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 26,580
  • Your mom sends me care packages
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2013, 07:20:53 AM »
I think it's a safe bet that penalties will be the standard "Men of violence kick your door in and shoot your dog, flashbang your children" followed up by liberal doses of "10 years behind bars" for possession of a piece of molded plastic.

Funny how the State initiates violence on the non-violent to keep the non-violent safe from violence. War is Peace huh?

This.
JD

 The price of a lottery ticket seems to be the maximum most folks are willing to risk toward the dream of becoming a one-percenter. “Robert Hollis”

seeker_two

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 12,922
  • In short, most intelligence is false.
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2013, 08:21:16 AM »
I think the likely threshold will be when the "men of violence" start receiving the violence they dish out on their own home doorsteps. Remember the part in ENEMIES: FOREIGN & DOMESTIC when they published Fed agents' personal info on the Internet?......
Impressed yet befogged, they grasped at his vivid leading phrases, seeing only their surface meaning, and missing the deeper current of his thought.

p12

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 988
  • I SEE NOISES!!
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2013, 08:51:34 AM »
What I find encouraging is the sheer number of people that are "chest thumping" who there doing it to and that it's being done publicly. I also find it encouraging that the push back is in the heart of the eastern liberal stronghold.

I agree that I think most of the fudds have seen the light.

lee n. field

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,534
  • tinpot megalomaniac, Paulbot, hardware goon
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2013, 09:20:44 AM »
To me, the real threshold would be spontaneous gatherings of armed neighbors/friends forming up whenever an arrest is attempted on the new NY laws and then possibly even more people arriving from outside the immediate area than local law enforcement is willing to deal with.

If the courts don't strike down these laws in the post-Heller/McDonald era of case law and precedent, that's the last resort.



So the arrests happen at inconvenient and unexpected times and places.  On a road somewhere.  Five thirty in the morning. 
In thy presence is fulness of joy.
At thy right hand pleasures for evermore.

Perd Hapley

  • Superstar of the Internet
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 61,333
  • My prepositions are on/in
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2013, 09:49:15 AM »
Good on them.

Frankly, I hope the NY politicians get scared of this movement.  Truly scared.  And step back from the brink, and repeal this.


If they're going to repeal it, I think it's more likely to result from finding out just how many voters it affects. If not, it will probably take a lot of politicians losing their jobs to get the point across.
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

geronimotwo

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 3,796
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2013, 10:48:31 AM »
much as i am at odds with the current and previous ny awb, part of me would like to see a case brought before the supreme court so that we can clarify the term "in common use" in regards to mag capacity, etc.
make the world idiot proof.....and you will have a world full of idiots. -g2

Monkeyleg

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 14,589
  • Tattaglia is a pimp.
    • http://www.gunshopfinder.com
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2013, 11:41:06 AM »
Quote
much as i am at odds with the current and previous ny awb, part of me would like to see a case brought before the supreme court so that we can clarify the term "in common use" in regards to mag capacity, etc.

By the time it reaches the SC, Obama may have appointed a couple of new justices.

slingshot

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1,031
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2013, 11:48:03 AM »
I don't know what I would do with certainty if I lived in NY state.  Those Woolrich coats are an institution!  "Fudds" aren't the only people that wear them.
It shall be as it was in the past... Not with dreams, but with strength and with courage... Shall a nation be molded to last. (The Plainsman, 1936)

Tallpine

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 23,172
  • Grumpy Old Grandpa
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2013, 01:35:33 PM »
I don't know what I would do with certainty if I lived in NY state.  Those Woolrich coats are an institution!  "Fudds" aren't the only people that wear them.

Kevlar vest under the coat ?  =|
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

freakazoid

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,243
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2013, 04:51:39 PM »
So the arrests happen at inconvenient and unexpected times and places.  On a road somewhere.  Five thirty in the morning. 

Something like a phone network needs to be set up to counter something like this. If something like that did happen to where the word couldn't of gotten out in time, spontaneous gathering at wherever he is being held.
"so I ended up getting the above because I didn't want to make a whole production of sticking something between my knees and cranking. To me, the cranking on mine is pretty effortless, at least on the coarse setting. Maybe if someone has arthritis or something, it would be more difficult for them." - Ben

"I see a rager at least once a week." - brimic

AJ Dual

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 16,162
  • Shoe Ballistics Inc.
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2013, 05:18:19 PM »
So the arrests happen at inconvenient and unexpected times and places.  On a road somewhere.  Five thirty in the morning. 

Exactly what I was thinking, OTOH, if the person was being held at a small enough police station...

Shades of "The Battle of Athens"...
I promise not to duck.

De Selby

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,818
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #18 on: February 03, 2013, 05:30:04 PM »
All this talk of resistance is a bit misguided.

If you can't organise the votes to do this politically, any campaign to intimidate lawmakers into changing their minds will fail miserably. 

Such behaviours and talk will only have the effect of pushing more voters away.
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

Perd Hapley

  • Superstar of the Internet
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 61,333
  • My prepositions are on/in
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2013, 05:33:48 PM »
All this talk of resistance is a bit misguided.

If you can't organise the votes to do this politically, any campaign to intimidate lawmakers into changing their minds will fail miserably. 

Such behaviours and talk will only have the effect of pushing more voters away.


It may be premature now. We'll see whether the politicians listen to the voters.
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

AJ Dual

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 16,162
  • Shoe Ballistics Inc.
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #20 on: February 03, 2013, 05:36:02 PM »
All this talk of resistance is a bit misguided.

If you can't organise the votes to do this politically, any campaign to intimidate lawmakers into changing their minds will fail miserably.  

Such behaviours and talk will only have the effect of pushing more voters away.

1. To a degree voting is irrelevant. The whole "Democracy is two wolves and sheep voting on what's for dinner", and America is a Republic etc.

2. The concept of retribution and those who may or may not have earned stands independently whether or not it will change their votes.

3. By your way of thinking, the entire American Revolution was extralegal in nature. And counting the nominal 1/3rd of loyalists, 1/3rd of neutrals, and the 3% who actually fought/died actively, needing a majority to do what is right is irrelevant as well. (See #1 back up top about "democracy")
I promise not to duck.

dogmush

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,671
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #21 on: February 03, 2013, 05:43:37 PM »
All this talk of resistance is a bit misguided.

If you can't organise the votes to do this politically, any campaign to intimidate lawmakers into changing their minds will fail miserably. 

Such behaviours and talk will only have the effect of pushing more voters away.

Practically speaking not true.

Campaigns to intimidate lawmakers into making laws that wouldn't pass a popular vote happen effectevly all the time.  Prohibition, Gay Marriage (see CA for popular vote on that one), Gun Control.... It happens all the time.  Normally the intimidation is the loss of the politicians job, or income.

Frankly I don't give a damn what they're afraid of as long as they are afraid enough of something to not pass laws restricting liberty.  Fear of an uprising is as effective as fear of not being elected in this case.

Add to that AJ's point.  However effective (or not) any planned resistance to tyranny, if the majority of this country votes to remove peoples natural rights, they should be fought with words, ballots or, if need be, rifles.  That would be the duty of free people.

De Selby

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,818
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #22 on: February 03, 2013, 07:07:23 PM »
Dog mush, those are good examples - look at how positions on each were reversed.   It wasn't because of gay marriage protestors blocking ceremonies, or people gathering for drinks at the White House.   They mustered enough opposition to get those laws repealed.  Gun control is an even better example....30 years of political activism is why so many states have CCW laws.  Not because the ATF got scared of gun owners.

AJ, revolutions against monarchs are not the same thing as disagreeing with a representative process.

It's all well and good to ignore democracy when it violates what you think are natural rights, but consider how many people think food and healthcare are natural rights...how would you like them adopting your methods to take it?    We have a representative government specifically to handle those kinds of disagreements.

I remember well the militia movement of the 90's, and all the talk about how that was going to undo Clinton's gun laws.   As far as I can tell, all the talk of resistance did was retard the very real gains being made by political activists.
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 27,199
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #23 on: February 03, 2013, 07:57:41 PM »
What I find encouraging is the sheer number of people that are "chest thumping" who there doing it to and that it's being done publicly. I also find it encouraging that the push back is in the heart of the eastern liberal stronghold.

I agree that I think most of the fudds have seen the light.

Some of them have, at any rate.

I think when they woke up to the realization that if "ten" could magically become "seven," "seven" could just as magically become "five" ... and then "four," and then "three," and finally "one" (which, incidentally, has already been proposed in Connecticut), that's when the mental light bulbs started to click on.
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
100% Politically Incorrect by Design

RoadKingLarry

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 21,841
Re: Backlash in NY & Penalties?
« Reply #24 on: February 03, 2013, 08:06:31 PM »
Quote
It's all well and good to ignore democracy when it violates what you think are natural rights, but consider how many people think food and healthcare are natural rights...how would you like them adopting your methods to take it?    We have a representative government specifically to handle those kinds of disagreements.

We've already seen what "they" have done along those line with things like the occupy wall street bunch and the "peaceful" protests we've seen at various G8 type events.
We've also seen how our representative government still managed to pass the ACA when it was pretty clear that the majority of Americans did not support it.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams