Nikon P-223 scope?

[Gewehr98]

I wonder if Nikon sporting optics (rifle scopes/spotting scopes/binoculars) is a totally different branch than the Nikon optics I'm used to?

I've had nothing but praise for their compound microscopes, SLRs, DSLRs, and camera lenses. 

To be fair, though, I'm not really big on their AF-G lenses with the plastic bodies and lightweight glass, but they still produce good images.   

[charby]

Are they thin? Yes.
However, they neglected to mention that when aiming at a darkish background with this scope, any ambient light is reflected back off of the reticle, making them appear to be a bronze color, quite distinguishable from everything else.

I have one on my new build mounted with a Burris P.E.P.R quick release forward canted mount that I'm quite pleased with. (So far  )
Mount info here:  http://www.midwayusa.com/product/1548141657/burris-ar-pepr-1-piece-extended-scope-mount-picatinny-style-with-integral-rings-flattop-ar-15-matte

I looked through mine and yes it thin but I can also put crosshairs on smaller targets that way. With my heavy duplex scope anything smaller than a softwall gets hidden at 200 yards.

[dm1333]

What about an Aimpoint PRO for $408 with a mount?

http://swfa.com/Aimpoint-Patrol-Rifle-Optic-C4246.aspx

[AJ Dual]

What about an Aimpoint PRO for $408 with a mount?

http://swfa.com/Aimpoint-Patrol-Rifle-Optic-C4246.aspx

Aimpoint is solid for sure. Nobody questions that. And I really like the 2moa dot. Even 4moa dots are "fat" to me. As long as I can find it I want it as tiny as possible. I don't seem to follow the industry wisdom that fat dots are "fast". Monochromatic red backgrounds aren't found much outdoors in any part of the world, save maybe at Target stores. Small red dot moa's are the epitome of "aim small, miss small".

However, I find the separate 3-4x tip off magnifier systems klunky. And the magnified view is really odd as compared to a dedicated one piece scope.

[Fitz]

That primary arms 3x job is what I think i'm gonna go with. It keeps with the spirit of my "budget AR" build, and I read very good things about it on teh webz.

I will probably shell out extra for the quick detach mount, so I can, in a pinch, get rid of it and use irons.

[brimic]

Aimpoint is solid for sure. Nobody questions that. And I really like the 2moa dot. Even 4moa dots are "fat" to me. As long as I can find it I want it as tiny as possible. I don't seem to follow the industry wisdom that fat dots are "fast". Monochromatic red backgrounds aren't found much outdoors in any part of the world, save maybe at Target stores. Small red dot moa's are the epitome of "aim small, miss small".

I used to be the same way, but I've eventually come around to liking big dots- mainly because my eyes aren't as good as they were 20 years ago. The size of the dot doesn't particularly matter for accuracy so long as the sight picture and everything else is consistent.

[dm1333]

That primary arms 3x job is what I think i'm gonna go with. It keeps with the spirit of my "budget AR" build, and I read very good things about it on teh webz.

I will probably shell out extra for the quick detach mount, so I can, in a pinch, get rid of it and use irons.

I'd like to hear what you think of it.  I like that it is compact and simple.  I'd like to compare it to something like the Aimpoint PRO but the nearest gun shop is 1.5 hours away and they don't have a big selection of anything like red dots or 1-4 scopes.

However, I find the separate 3-4x tip off magnifier systems klunky. And the magnified view is really odd as compared to a dedicated one piece scope.

The only expensive red dot I ever used was on an M240, an Aimpoint with no magnification.  I've also used shotguns and the M14T with an EOTech but no magnifier.  I like the red dots but have no idea if I would like the magnifier.

[stevelyn]

Now, the bad; WOW.......the pictures of the crosshairs didn't do them justice....they're TINY.    Light starts going duskish you're not going to see squat.   The crosshairs are SUPER-thin, half the size of any my others, the hash-marks are the same.   Even the duplex portion of the crosshairs are thin, about 1/4 the width of any of my 1-4X scopes.

That's kinda disappointing. I'm thining of putting one on my Mini-Mauser for wolves at night. I need to be able to pick up the crosshair with an obnoxiously bright, retina-searing spotlight out to a couple hundred yards or so. Mostly on a snow background.

[geronimotwo]

has anyone mentioned vortex optics?   i am also looking for a budget optic, and they seem well liked (as highly recomended as primary arms), and an allegedly lifetime warrenty.  the sparc is their red dot, and it comes with a screw in 2x multiplier. 

http://www.opticsplanet.com/vortex-sparc-red-dot-sight-sprc.html

The difference is in the warranty. I've got a Nikon paperweight on the shelf, the zoom locked up after I owned it for 6 months and they wouldn't fix it.

are zoom scopes in the budget range less reliable than single power?  is it better to buy the best scope from a lesser brand, or the cheapest scope from a top brand (in the same price range)?

[dm1333]

has anyone mentioned vortex optics?   i am also looking for a budget optic, and they seem well liked (as highly recomended as primary arms), and an allegedly lifetime warrenty.  the sparc is their red dot, and it comes with a screw in 2x multiplier.

I've been reading some of the reviews of the Sparc and it seem like their red dots are not as well sorted out as their scopes.  For $100 more you can pick up an Aimpoint with a mount.  The batteries on the Sparc are evidently hard to find, among other things.  I've sort of narrowed down my search to the Primary Arms 3X and the Aimpoint PRO.  I may have to drive over to Sacramento some weekend and start looking at scopes and red dots in person.

[dm1333]

Fitz,

Did you ever buy that Primary Arms fixed power scope?  I just put a Bushnell TRS-25 on mine and somebody who works for me just bought a Burris AR332.  After both of them are sighted in we are going to go shooting together and do a little comparison.  If I go with a red dot it will probably be an Aimpoint PRO and the Bushnell will go onto one of my .22s.

[Fitz]

Not yet. Funds tied up. Had to buy some
Bass gear

So it's probably gonna wait

Was amazed at how nice it shoots even with just MBUS

[dm1333]

I just put an MBUS on my rifle to replace the non folding rear sight that was on there.  Friday afternoon I'm going to sight it in, both the irons and the red dot.  I was surprised at how useful the 3 moa dot seemed.  I looked through the red dot at a couple of known ranges, 175 and 575 yards, it didn't obscure nearly as much of  what I was looking at as I was expecting.

[Fitz]

I'm used to clapped out army issue garbage that's been scraped and improperly cleaned for years. Imagine my surprise when I got better groups at 50y with my rifle than I get at 25m with the army's

[dogmush]

I've been reading some of the reviews of the Sparc and it seem like their red dots are not as well sorted out as their scopes.  For $100 more you can pick up an Aimpoint with a mount.  The batteries on the Sparc are evidently hard to find, among other things.  I've sort of narrowed down my search to the Primary Arms 3X and the Aimpoint PRO.  I may have to drive over to Sacramento some weekend and start looking at scopes and red dots in person.

Can't speak for the SPARC, but my Strikefire is a solid red dot.  for $150.  I keep wanting to grab an EOtech, but the Strikefire keeps working really well.  I wanna say it uses a CR-123, but it's a standard easy to find batt.

The magnifier is useless.

[dm1333]

Dogmush,

I like the Strikefire and have considered buying one.  You are right about the battery, I can't remember if it is CR123 or CR 2 but they can be found all over.  I ruled the Sparc out because you basically had to order the batteries online.  I have been looking at the Lucid HD7 too. 

[dm1333]

Got to do a side by side comparison today of AR's with a red dot and the Burris AR332.  I was surprised at how easy it was to hit stuff out to 75 yards or so (the gravel pit doesn't get much bigger) with the red dot.  I had some problems with the AR332 while trying to shoot both eyes open.  I was seeing double a couple of times.  My one complaint about the red dot, the 3 MOA dot can be a little hard to pick up sometimes, not because of the sunlight but there was a lot of stuff there and the dot was small.  Now I understand the donut and dot concept on some of the less expensive red dots.

[bedlamite]

Got to do a side by side comparison today of AR's with a red dot and the Burris AR332.  I was surprised at how easy it was to hit stuff out to 75 yards or so (the gravel pit doesn't get much bigger) with the red dot.  I had some problems with the AR332 while trying to shoot both eyes open.  I was seeing double a couple of times.  My one complaint about the red dot, the 3 MOA dot can be a little hard to pick up sometimes, not because of the sunlight but there was a lot of stuff there and the dot was small.  Now I understand the donut and dot concept on some of the less expensive red dots.

The EOTech has a donut dot too, It's just that the dot in the center is even smaller at 1 MOA.

I was planning a range trip today and just took my bull barrel AR with a 6-24x50 AO out. I'll be finding out just how good the Vortex warranty is. It won't focus.