Is the New Upcoming Batman Already a Flop??

[Perd Hapley]

"New" and "Upcoming"? Redundancy is overly redundant. 

[freakazoid]

THAT Batman is the Batman by which I judge all Batmans.

Keaton and Nicholson were perfect in that.

I still contend it was Jack that whacked Heath, and made it look like suicide.  No one reprises Jack's roles while he's alive.

Bale was okay, but the Dark Knight trilogy was way too dark.  There's some societal-level psychological problems going on and the proof is how well those movies did in the box office.  The Japanese may have a culture developed where it's healthy for them to express all their repressed id manias in manga and remain mostly stable in the rest of their lives, but the same does not translate to the US.  The Dark Knight series crossed a messy boundary that shouldn't have been breached.

I don't want to see Batman pull back to the Clooney/Schwarzenegger days of raw stupidity or the West days of POWSOCKCHOW! goofiness, but it does need to pull back from the constant flaying and flagellation going on in those movies.  And the fictional villains need to stop representing topics that resonate with our real vox populi.

Way to dark? They have been the best out of all of them. What messy boundary did they breach exactly?

[TommyGunn]

A local movie critic has said that the fans were far more outraged at the choice of Beetlejuice Michael Keaton, to play Batman.

But I don't think Affleck is going to redeem himself.

That was a strange thing for me; I'd heard Keaton was to play batman and the villian was to be the Joker but didn't read who was going to play that role -- perhaps it had been uncast.  I thought to myself that Keaton was not a good choice for the Batman but they HAD to get Jack Nicholson for the Joker.
Of course, they did get Nicholson and I was right, he was great.
But as right as I was about that I was wrong about Keaton -- he did very well as the Batman.
Oh well.

[Levant]

Affleck won't be Batman if Obama fans have anything to do with it.

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2013/08/23/ben-affleck-as-batman-thousands-sign-petition-to-remove-him/

[freakazoid]

Reading through some of the comments, apparently there is a counter petition.

[AZRedhawk44]

What messy boundary did they breach exactly?

Presenting popular issues in a way that causes psychopathic sympathy with a villain.

The role model then shifts from the hero to the psychopath, and you get psychopathic behavior out of people likely to be influenced by such things.

[Jamisjockey]

Affleck won't be Batman if Obama fans have anything to do with it.

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2013/08/23/ben-affleck-as-batman-thousands-sign-petition-to-remove-him/

File that under the "you can't make this *expletive deleted*it up if you tried" header!

[freakazoid]

Presenting popular issues in a way that causes psychopathic sympathy with a villain.

The role model then shifts from the hero to the psychopath, and you get psychopathic behavior out of people likely to be influenced by such things.

The villain being the psychopathic Joker? Who sympathizes with him? Or maybe Bane or Ra's al Ghul? Again, no body is sympathizing with him. I can see people feeling sorry for Mr. Freeze from Batman & Robin, and that's about as far as it goes, feeling sorry for him. Certainly none of these people are considered role models.

[BlueStarLizzard]

Presenting popular issues in a way that causes psychopathic sympathy with a villain.

The role model then shifts from the hero to the psychopath, and you get psychopathic behavior out of people likely to be influenced by such things.

Yet Batman was orginally written as an anti hero (which was fully realized in the comic book world with the Punisher)

Emulating Batman or his enemys is counterproductive, because the lot of them are actually Villians.

Furthermore, to censor art (and yes, I said art) for the sake of hippy dippy feel good morals is BS. Fictional characters are not role models and turning everything into PG rated family flicks that don't require thought for the sake of a few disturbed induvidials is retarded.

[erictank]

I haven't heard much about the film other than the Ben Affleck angle.  Is it based on Frank Miller's comic?

It's titled "Batman Vs. Superman" (or vice versa, I can't be bothered to look it up); the intro at ComicCon last month was read by Harry Lennix, and came from Miller's comic: "I want you to remember, Clark. In all the years to come. In all your most private moments. I want you to remember my hand at your throat. I want you to remember the one man who beat you."

Actual confirmation that it's based on TDKR has not come out yet. Just rumors.

[AZRedhawk44]

Yet Batman was orginally written as an anti hero (which was fully realized in the comic book world with the Punisher)

Emulating Batman or his enemys is counterproductive, because the lot of them are actually Villians.

Furthermore, to censor art (and yes, I said art) for the sake of hippy dippy feel good morals is BS. Fictional characters are not role models and turning everything into PG rated family flicks that don't require thought for the sake of a few disturbed induvidials is retarded.

Bane's policies validated a lot of the FSA's sentimentality.

I'm not saying to censor it.

I'm saying that it's deep, dark, dangerous stuff that can trigger flotsam in weak minds.  As such, not EVERY movie needs to get made in that tradition. 

[BlueStarLizzard]

Bane's policies validated a lot of the FSA's sentimentality.

I'm not saying to censor it.

I'm saying that it's deep, dark, dangerous stuff that can trigger flotsam in weak minds.  As such, not EVERY movie needs to get made in that tradition.  

But Batman movies do.

The whole premise of Batman is that he doesn't even need to fight criminals cause half the time he SCARES them into surrendering!


This isn't the interveiw I was looking for, but it does touch on my earlier point that Batman is a disturbed chatacter who is not entirely sane.
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11SbcG9UdIs&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[Angel Eyes]

Still a better choice than Affleck.

[BryanP]

I really can't believe people are actually getting worked up over this.  He either does a good job or he doesn't.  I recall a few people griping about Heath Ledger being chosen to play the Joker, but that seems to have worked out pretty well.

[AJ Dual]

I really can't believe people are actually getting worked up over this.  He either does a good job or he doesn't.  I recall a few people griping about Heath Ledger being chosen to play the Joker, but that seems to have worked out pretty well.

Once.   

[Hawkmoon]

This isn't the interveiw I was looking for, but it does touch on my earlier point that Batman is a disturbed chatacter who is not entirely sane.
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11SbcG9UdIs&feature=youtube_gdata_player

But he's not supposed to be evil.

From the interview: "He's a crusader fighting against all the injustices in the world."

That sums up Batman. The recent movies are totally screwing it up. (So, I suppose, are the current comic books.)

[freakazoid]

But he's not supposed to be evil.

From the interview: "He's a crusader fighting against all the injustices in the world."

That sums up Batman. The recent movies are totally screwing it up. (So, I suppose, are the current comic books.)

I don't think anyone is saying Batman is evil, he is a crusader fighting against all the injustices in the world. He is also a very complex person. The recent movies are not screwing it up.

[Perd Hapley]

This is for Hawkmoon:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9DDCKVrZfU

 

[Hawkmoon]

This is for Fisty

http://tv.msn.com/video/tv/?g=8859a114-81fe-4f9b-9cff-d861a2ae812b

And:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkoTq-GZcak

[Perd Hapley]

I could watch that before school, if I got up early enough. That, and Superman.

[RoadKingLarry]

Fictional characters are not role models  .

Heretic!
You take that back or I'm gonna tell John Wayne. 

[BlueStarLizzard]

But he's not supposed to be evil.

From the interview: "He's a crusader fighting against all the injustices in the world."

That sums up Batman. The recent movies are totally screwing it up. (So, I suppose, are the current comic books.)

As Bob Kane orginally wrote him, he fought evil by scaring the *expletive deleted*it out of it

The most recent three movies are the most accurate psychological portral of Batman as he was orginally conceved and written by Bob Kane in the late 30's.
Oh, and he had guns back then.

The three inflances for batman are:
Di vinci's glider
Zorro
and an old movie called The Bat and the villian in that movie.

For future refrence do not try to argue golden age comics with the daughter of the ultimate fanboy. I swear, I've been indoctrinated by this crap since I was 7.

[freakazoid]

Was not aware about the influences. That's pretty interesting.

[Hawkmoon]

For future refrence do not try to argue golden age comics with the daughter of the ultimate fanboy. I swear, I've been indoctrinated by this crap since I was 7.

Liz, I'm pretty certain I had already grown up on Superman, Batman, et alia, long before you were even born ... never mind since you were seven.

[BlueStarLizzard]

Liz, I'm pretty certain I had already grown up on Superman, Batman, et alia, long before you were even born ... never mind since you were seven.

I've noticed that older folks often think that growing up during a certain time period makes them experts on whatever happened during that time period.

It's really not the case.

And I'm pretty sure Batman predates almost every member of this board, including you.