NC cuts welfare due to shutdown.

[roo_ster]

Goatee Spock for House Speaker!  You know it would be logical!

You know that in that universe, to get a promotion you would have to kill to get the job.

[peanutgallery]At least we'll know he can kill something other than his party's grassroots turnout![/peanutgallery]

The shutdown accomplished nothing. It wasn't even a Pyrrhic victory. It was forcing a battle that couldn't be won, with no plan for what would be gained by doing so. It was the ultimate in "But they have to do SOMETHING!!!!" We mock liberals for saying that in the wake of a shooting when they propose "solutions" that wouldn't have prevented the incident they cite as justification. But that's exactly what the R's did here. Obamacare is starting, we can't stop it, BUT WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING!!!!!!

What are the negatives that came from this? Conflated debt ceiling increase with Obamacare rollout and the shutdown. Gave the WH an easy out and distraction for the massive failure of O-care, a fundamental violation of never interrupt your enemy when he's making a mistake. And reinforced the impression inthe minds of low information voters that the GOP has nothing to offer. The only positive was the unbelievable pettiness and stupidity of the administration with Barrycades etc. But that was a happy accident rather than a planned thing.

Goatee Spock it is.

[Balog]

So taking actions that actively harm your stated goals is preferrable to letting your enemy hurt himself and preparing to fight on ground of your choosing. Got it.

[Scout26]

Okay, I'll play.

What exactly should the GOP have done or be doing to "chip away at what can be achieved'?

[Balog]

Okay, I'll play.

What exactly should the GOP have done or be doing to "chip away at what can be achieved'?

If you can't directly, immediately harm the enemy, shooting yourself just to be "doing something" still doesn't make sense.

O-care is a giant cluster. They could be beating the wardrums on that, harping on the lack of a budget, talking up the debt ceiling, hammering on the expansion of NSA spying, putting up pictures of all the innocent children Obama has blown up with drones etc.  They could (this is shocking I know) actually develop and sell reasonable solutions and alternatives that are realistically achievable. Instead they managed to make themselves look foolish and impotent by trying to accomplish something that was not politically possible.

Politics, like it or not, is largely about image and perception and trust. The GOP can't message to save its life, and no matter how stupid and evil the administration is they somehow manage to handle their response so badly that they look like the bad guys. It's not that hard, if they're too stupid to manage it on their own just copy everything the left did to Bush.

[brimic]

I think the shutdown was enormously fruitful.
Obama's and the democrats' contempt for the masses was open and on display for all to see.

[AZRedhawk44]

I think the shutdown was enormously fruitful.
Obama's and the democrats' DC's contempt for the masses was open and on display for all to see.

Fixed.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

I think the shutdown was enormously fruitful.
Obama's and the democrats' contempt for the masses was open and on display for all to see.

You give too much credit to the masses. Free phones and healthcare yeah


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[Scout26]

If you can't directly, immediately harm the enemy, shooting yourself just to be "doing something" still doesn't make sense.

O-care is a giant cluster. They could be beating the wardrums on that, harping on the lack of a budget, talking up the debt ceiling, hammering on the expansion of NSA spying, putting up pictures of all the innocent children Obama has blown up with drones etc.  They could (this is shocking I know) actually develop and sell reasonable solutions and alternatives that are realistically achievable. Instead they managed to make themselves look foolish and impotent by trying to accomplish something that was not politically possible.

Politics, like it or not, is largely about image and perception and trust. The GOP can't message to save its life, and no matter how stupid and evil the administration is they somehow manage to handle their response so badly that they look like the bad guys. It's not that hard, if they're too stupid to manage it on their own just copy everything the left did to Bush.

I retort that the GOP isn't allowed to message. The MSM won't allow them.   Did you hear anything about the GOP's counter-proposal to Obamacare? They had one.  (do a google search on GOP Alternative to Obamacare.  The only one I saw from anything close to the MSM was a Yahoo article.)

What about all the bills the passed funding various parts of the .gov except Obamacare?

Rand Paul filibustered about Drones calling on Obama to promise not to drone Americans.  He was labeled a 'nutjob" for that.

My congressman has been hammering Obama on the lack of budgets.

They even tried to hammer him on not be willing to negotiate unless he gave them everything he wanted first.

I saw where the were 142 MSM reports on the shutdown.  121 blame Republicans, 21 were neutral (not blaming either side) and ZERO blamed the Democrats.  ZERO  And that does NOT include the NYT, Chicago Tribune or LA Times, et al.

[Balog]

That's a pretty pathetic excuse. "Oh wah wah, the enemy is opposing me!" Of course they are. The media is hard left and always will be. Doing something stupid and pointless that accomplishes nothing is a way to remedy the media's bias how again? Obama didn't have to manufacture a distraction from his failures, the GOP handed him one. Reagan, for all his faults, knew how to message. The media was just as biased in his day, and there was no Fox News or internet alternatives. But instead of bitching and moaning about how those big ole meanies in the press weren't fair he put on his goddamn big boy pants and made it happen in spite of them.

Again, I don't really see how "Well the media won't report if we do smart stuff so let's just do dumb stuff instead" is a sound battle plan.

[seeker_two]

I think the problem is that the GOP "leadership" was listening to the wrong media....

While the MSM (FOX included) preached that the GOP were losing the fight, the Internet and social media showed a drastically different view. Ted Cruz's tweets and FB posts got more likes than the MSM evening news got viewers. Add Rand Paul, Sarah Palin, Mike Lee, and all the pages & blogs devoted to their positions....and you can't ignore the loudness of those voices. And the blogs....Obama couldn't drum up near that much support even if he could raise all the dead in Illinois....

Unfortunately, the old fogeys leading the GOP can't even check their e-mail without help, much less keep up with the Internet. When they think "journalist", they think of Helen Thomas...not Breitbart. And it will keep happening as long as the GOP is led by people who look for acceptance from liberal-controlled media instead of looking at the media that is open to all....

...and the only way that will change would be a sudden mass die-off of all GOP members over the age of 60......BTW, does anyone have a few vials of Spanish Flu saved for a rainy day?.....