Author Topic: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine  (Read 2016 times)

vaskidmark

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Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« on: December 03, 2014, 06:43:52 PM »
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=117970

Quote
A federal panel is considering overturning a ban on blood bank donations by gay men — a rule implemented 15 years ago out of fear of AIDS.

The 1985 ban declares that any man who has had sex with another man even once since 1977 cannot give blood. Now, blood bank officials say it’s time to change the rule, and the Federal Drug Administration’s Blood Products Advisory Committee is meeting today and Friday to discuss it.

The new rule will allow gay men (how come not lesbian women or bisexuals of either stripe?) to donate if they have been celibate for 12 months.

Last time I had checked folks exposed to blood/bodily fluids of those known to be HIV+ were being tested for 24 months before they were told the could stop obsessing on a daily basis if they were going to die and just be concerned for the rest of their life.

IIRC the HIV virus (yes, I know that's a tautology) can lie dormant for years, and the body does not produce any antibodies or other biological indicators until it goes active.

I admit I'm woefully ignorant on the subject, so school me.

No. I'm not planning any surgery that would involve blood transfusions, but it could be an unplanned possibility if I need another bypass.

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Balog

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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2014, 07:07:16 PM »
Risking people's lives in the interest of "fairness."

We should really end the ban on IV drug addicts not being able to donate, junkies are people too!
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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2014, 07:21:29 PM »
Currently there's a whole host of folks that cannot donate.  Diabetics, Cancer patients, Malaria and Tuberculosis and the one that got me booted right after I hit the 3 Gallon mark:  vCJD.

Quote
You were a member of the of the U.S. military, a civilian military employee, or a dependent of a member of the U.S. military who spent a total time of 6 months on or associated with a military base in any of the following areas during the specified time frames

    From 1980 through 1990 - Belgium, the Netherlands (Holland), or Germany
    From 1980 through 1996 - Spain, Portugal, Turkey, Italy or Greece.
    From 1980 through 1996 - UK
http://www.redcrossblood.org/donating-blood/eligibility-requirements/eligibility-criteria-alphabetical-listing


There has yet to be a case of "Mad Cow" disease in humans that was acquired from a Mad Cow.   No documented case of it jumping the species barrier, yet several hundred thousand folks (who generally are of the volunteering bent) are prohibited from donating and now they want to open it up to those that are most at risk and the "carriers" (for lack of a better term) for HIV, for what medical reason again?

 :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
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mtnbkr

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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2014, 08:13:39 PM »
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=117970

The new rule will allow gay men (how come not lesbian women or bisexuals of either stripe?) to donate if they have been celibate for 12 months.
Gay men are much more likely to have been exposed to HIV than lesbians or bisexuals.

Last time I had checked folks exposed to blood/bodily fluids of those known to be HIV+ were being tested for 24 months before they were told the could stop obsessing on a daily basis if they were going to die and just be concerned for the rest of their life.


IIRC the HIV virus (yes, I know that's a tautology) can lie dormant for years, and the body does not produce any antibodies or other biological indicators until it goes active.
How old is that info?  They can detect HIV as soon as 4 weeks (6 is the official minimum).  HIV is active almost immediately, but can take years to degrade the body to the point you have symptoms.  Dormant for 24 months?  Not likely.  The "celibate for 12 months" limit makes sense if there is testing somewhere in that 12 month time frame.


Risking people's lives in the interest of "fairness."
Not really.  Gay guys who have been celibate for 12 months (and tested clean within that period) aren't likely to have the virus.  Even if they did, the testing done to blood would catch it.  Remember, hetero folks catch HIV and give blood.

We should really end the ban on IV drug addicts not being able to donate, junkies are people too!
Junkies have other health issues that make them less than ideal donors.


Currently there's a whole host of folks that cannot donate.  Diabetics, Cancer patients, Malaria and Tuberculosis and the one that got me booted right after I hit the 3 Gallon mark:  vCJD.
http://www.redcrossblood.org/donating-blood/eligibility-requirements/eligibility-criteria-alphabetical-listing
Except for vCJD, all of those people have something a celibate gay man doesn't: a medical diagnosis.  Even the vCJD concern makes *some* sense as blood tests for it are relatively recent (2011?).

There has yet to be a case of "Mad Cow" disease in humans that was acquired from a Mad Cow.   No documented case of it jumping the species barrier, yet several hundred thousand folks (who generally are of the volunteering bent) are prohibited from donating and now they want to open it up to those that are most at risk and the "carriers" (for lack of a better term) for HIV, for what medical reason again?

IIRC, they don't know *where* vCJD originates in humans, but do know it's similar to "Mad Cow".  A gay guy who hasn't had sex in 12 months is of no risk.  They test the blood anyway.  So, they're not really increasing risk.  The article makes a good point about not restricting straight women who sleep with HIV infected partners, but permanently blocking a gay man who has been celibate for decades.

Why open it up to  this group?  Simple, there's a need, as stated by the article.  The article also says the FDA is likely to go with a 5 year celibacy requirement.

Chris

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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2014, 08:18:57 PM »
1. I'm sure no one will lie about being celibate.
2. If you're so confident in the tests, why exclude anyone? Just test the blood before you ship it out.
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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2014, 08:38:04 PM »
The new rule will allow gay men (how come not lesbian women or bisexuals of either stripe?) to donate if they have been celibate for 12 months.

First, clarification of the rule:  Gay men are not banned from donating.  They just need to have never had sex with another man.  Bisexuals of the masculine persuasion would be banned as well.

Second:  Lesbians are NOT banned because it's actually medically based, not because 'we hate teh gays'.  Homosexual men are drastically more likely to be infected with HIV.  Homosexual women are drastically LESS likely to be infected.

Quote
Last time I had checked folks exposed to blood/bodily fluids of those known to be HIV+ were being tested for 24 months before they were told the could stop obsessing on a daily basis if they were going to die and just be concerned for the rest of their life.

A quick google search says that 6 months is the new standard, with going that long pretty much restricted to those who are already immune-compromised in some way.

Risking people's lives in the interest of "fairness."

Actually, it's a risk either way.  The vampires need blood in order to save people, and more conditions keep coming up to knock people out of the donation pool.

Quote
We should really end the ban on IV drug addicts not being able to donate, junkies are people too!

What if they've been clean for a decade and tested negative for blood-bornes and all the other disqualifiers?

1. I'm sure no one will lie about being celibate.
2. If you're so confident in the tests, why exclude anyone? Just test the blood before you ship it out.
1.  I'm sure none of them will lie about having had sex with another man.
2.  There's still a 1-6 month window where the test might not show positive, but still be infectious.

mtnbkr

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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2014, 09:19:57 PM »
1. I'm sure no one will lie about being celibate.
2. If you're so confident in the tests, why exclude anyone? Just test the blood before you ship it out.

Because people are liars, they already test the blood.  We're really only stopping the honest folks.  This new standard just loosens the standard a bit so folks don't have to lie quite as much.  Remember, this ruling doesn't affect the straight women who's husband stepped out on them with a junkie prostitute from Craigslist.  They were already giving blood while infected.  What it does allow for are the gay men who are at a much lower risk than the norm for their community.

Chris

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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2014, 10:39:39 PM »
Yeah but what about freaks who *expletive deleted*ck horses and corpses? They are "people" too.



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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2014, 10:50:14 PM »
Yeah but what about freaks who *expletive deleted*ck horses and corpses? They are "people" too.

They're currently, for the most part, let through.  I don't remember any questions about that.

Most likely it's that there's so few who mess with corpses in that way that it's not worth it to ask the question(the questionnaires are already long enough), and you're actually at less risk of catching a blood-born pathogen screwing around with a horse than a human, because for the most part the diseases are incompatible between the two species.  Those that are tend to be easy to treat.

Remember, this isn't about morality.  It's about the safety of the blood.

edit:  Or to be more specific, it's about ensuring the safest blood supply possible while also making sure that it's an adequate supply.  In other words you can't disqualify people willy-nilly and expect to have enough blood available for medical needs.

Ron

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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #9 on: December 03, 2014, 10:55:16 PM »
Yeah but what about freaks who *expletive deleted*ck horses and corpses? They are "people" too.

I've heard of those folks, they are going to save us from religion and the State!  :laugh:
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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #10 on: December 03, 2014, 11:23:29 PM »
Never gonna happen they represent a theoretical system that has never ever been implemented. Heck even the socialists have cuba


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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #11 on: December 03, 2014, 11:31:18 PM »
I was broke and sold plasma finally - ugh - a horrible experience.
The place in reno is called grifols, its real close to the homeless shelter and its obvious their clientele are at least half junkies if not more ....
I'd say its a safe bet that gays, junkies, and other assorted banned folks donate daily.
They asked me if I had been to west Africa lately though -
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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2014, 09:31:23 AM »
For once, it really is teh gayzors!!!!1111elventy!
http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/statistics/basics/ataglance.html
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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2014, 09:54:46 AM »
I was broke and sold plasma finally - ugh - a horrible experience.
The place in reno is called grifols, its real close to the homeless shelter and its obvious their clientele are at least half junkies if not more ....
I'd say its a safe bet that gays, junkies, and other assorted banned folks donate daily.
They asked me if I had been to west Africa lately though -

There's huge differnce betwen selling plasma and donating whole blood.
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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #14 on: December 15, 2014, 02:09:58 PM »
There's huge differnce betwen selling plasma and donating whole blood.

is "donating" plasma safer for the recipient than whole blood?
I have no idea, I thought plasma was blood- they take blood out ???

I do not recommend this as a means of getting extra cash!
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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #15 on: December 15, 2014, 02:22:40 PM »
is "donating" plasma safer for the recipient than whole blood?
I have no idea, I thought plasma was blood- they take blood out ???

I do not recommend this as a means of getting extra cash!

Plasma is the "Liquid" part of the blood, plus white blood cells.  They drain you, give you your red blood cells back, drain you again, and repeat until they have "enough".  You get paid plasma and doit every 3 or 6 days (I disremember, haven't done it since college).  Whole blood you donate, they take a pint and you don't get paid,except for all the free cookies and orange juice.
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wmenorr67

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Re: Need APS Medical Center staff to opine
« Reply #16 on: December 15, 2014, 03:06:44 PM »
Plus a lot of states they really aren't paying you for the plasma, they are paying you for your time.

The reason being is that blood is considered an organ and you can't profit off of selling your organs.
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