Author Topic: Question and looking for suggestions (Read 7764 times)

cassandra and sara's daddy · « **on:** June 24, 2016, 01:30:03 PM »

From this August body

Have a kawasaki mule in fairly shallow water but under water in a lake. Weighs about 1400 pounds. How many truck inner tube do you think it will take to float it so I can tow it a couple hundred yards to boat ramp? 8)

Thankfully I am only responsible for recovery. Was not the pilot

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wmenorr67 · « **Reply #1 on:** June 24, 2016, 01:34:22 PM »

Anyway to just get a tow line on it and yank it out.

Hawkmoon · « **Reply #2 on:** June 24, 2016, 01:34:57 PM »

Water weighs around 62 pounds per cubic foot. 1400 divided by 62 tells us you need an air volume of 22.6 cubic feet to bring a 1400-pound lump to neutral buoyancy.

What size truck tubes?

BobR · « **Reply #3 on:** June 24, 2016, 01:35:38 PM »

http://www.wikihow.com/Calculate-Buoyancy

Or you could start with 6 or so (big ones) and see what happens. Good luck.

bob

cassandra and sara's daddy · « **Reply #4 on:** June 24, 2016, 01:39:31 PM »

It should be an adventure. It went in in a spot where yanking it out would be difficult
Hard to get equipment in and near vertical bluff.

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Fly320s · « **Reply #5 on:** June 24, 2016, 01:40:50 PM »

Your using a boat to tow it to shore? Can you place an engine hoist in the boat?

Ben · « **Reply #6 on:** June 24, 2016, 01:41:59 PM »

How deep is it and how far away from shore? Not sure how you will get innertubes down to it. This is usually a lift bag job. Attach deflated bag(s), pump in air till it starts to lift. Lift bags will bleed air as pressure decreases with shallower water. Innertubes will not, and can turn stuff into missiles. Low pressure, high volume is what you want.

BobR · « **Reply #7 on:** June 24, 2016, 01:47:04 PM »

^^^^^

That's where I was going next. It takes a 4 cubic foot bag to lift 200 pounds (+/- a bit). Or an easy way is 100 liter bag will lift 100 Kg, but this is 'Merica and we don't do those metrics.

bob

eta: Do you think your local Fire Department or Search and Rescue would like a training opportunity?

cassandra and sara's daddy · « **Reply #8 on:** June 24, 2016, 06:47:12 PM »

Quote from: Ben on June 24, 2016, 01:41:59 PM

How deep is it and how far away from shore? Not sure how you will get innertubes down to it. This is usually a lift bag job. Attach deflated bag(s), pump in air till it starts to lift. Lift bags will bleed air as pressure decreases with shallower water. Innertubes will not, and can turn stuff into missiles. Low pressure, high volume is what you want.

It's about 8 foot deep and I can attach tubes deflated. I can get a compressor hose to it and fill em then.
First i am gonna get it into one of these and attach tubes to bag
http://m.homedepot.com/p/WM-Bagster-Dumpster-in-a-Bag-775-658/202228840?cm_mmc=Shopping%7cTHD%7cG%7c0%7cG-BASE-PLA-D28I-Cleaning%7c&gclid=CjwKEAjwtLO7BRDax4-I4_6G71USJAA6FjN1mJtXemT4Kov1F_OuQ41WcZeS-72DRrb6HS5DAg5nqBoCCU_w_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

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Ben · « **Reply #9 on:** June 24, 2016, 07:55:17 PM »

Quote from: cassandra and sara's daddy on June 24, 2016, 06:47:12 PM

It's about 8 foot deep and I can attach tubes deflated. I can get a compressor hose to it and fill em then.
First i am gonna get it into one of these and attach tubes to bag
http://m.homedepot.com/p/WM-Bagster-Dumpster-in-a-Bag-775-658/202228840?cm_mmc=Shopping%7cTHD%7cG%7c0%7cG-BASE-PLA-D28I-Cleaning%7c&gclid=CjwKEAjwtLO7BRDax4-I4_6G71USJAA6FjN1mJtXemT4Kov1F_OuQ41WcZeS-72DRrb6HS5DAg5nqBoCCU_w_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

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Okay, just be careful. You've got no real lift control with the innertubes.

seeker_two · « **Reply #10 on:** June 24, 2016, 08:09:26 PM »

Can you get a winch and a block and tackle setup near enough to the site to pull it out that way?

cassandra and sara's daddy · « **Reply #11 on:** June 24, 2016, 09:20:54 PM »

It's like a 65 degree slope maybe more. And it's verticals right near water I definitely could do that but I am likely to tear up more stuff that way.

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RoadKingLarry · « **Reply #12 on:** June 24, 2016, 10:42:29 PM »

Det cord.

Smaller pieces are easier to lift.

Ben · « **Reply #13 on:** June 24, 2016, 11:00:12 PM »

CSD - I dug out my old dive manual from work and scanned the section on lift bag recovery. It might have a few tips for you, especially regarding rigging, staging, and breaking suction if you have to.

https://db.tt/R2UHL7F3

cassandra and sara's daddy · « **Reply #14 on:** June 25, 2016, 05:09:10 PM »

Thanks. It was on its side in 15 feet. In my infinite wisdom i rolled it upright. It rolls real good underwater. It's now in 30 feet. Outside my ability to dive and have any reasonable bottom time to rig it. On one attempt I seriously overstayed my welcome while locating it's new resting place and communed with my higher power for a few seconds on way up. Sunlight looked real good. Copd and diving are a poor mix. Gonna get someone with tanks to it and hook it up. Was considering using some real heavy duty trash bags for lift. Turns out it's only a bit over 1000 pounds and with the existing tires it's surprisingly easy to move

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Jamisjockey · « **Reply #15 on:** June 25, 2016, 05:14:33 PM »

http://www.rentaltoolsonline.com/Rental-Tools-Online-Underwater-Lift-Bags-Salvage-Pontoons-s/346.htm

lupinus · « **Reply #16 on:** June 25, 2016, 05:15:30 PM »

Pft. You're supposed to fill it with ping pong balls.

Don't you watch mythbusters?

TommyGunn · « **Reply #17 on:** June 25, 2016, 05:28:20 PM »

Quote from: lupinus on June 25, 2016, 05:15:30 PM

Pft. You're supposed to fill it with ping pong balls.

Don't you watch mythbusters?

Someone once proposed filling the hull of the sunken liner R. M. S. Titanic with ping pong balls to raise it.....it ought to work on the OP's Kawasaki.....

Kingcreek · « **Reply #18 on:** June 25, 2016, 05:54:32 PM »

If curb weight is 1000 pounds it weighs a lot less at 30 feet under water. Maybe half.
What I want most is the backstory of HOW it got there.
And video of the recovery.
Work at 30 feet is tank zone unless you are one hell of a lunger. I might consider some corner attachments with surface floats to help manage a lift. Keep in mind my dive experience was almost 40 years ago- the gas laws of chemistry and physics have probably been updated since then.

Ben · « **Reply #19 on:** June 25, 2016, 06:30:55 PM »

Dude, please DO NOT use trash bags. You might get lucky, but more likely something will go wrong that puts you in a worse predicament at best, and threatens your safety at worst.

You are really at the point where you need real lift bags with proper mounting hardware for rigging. Also an experienced diver. I would help you out for a beer if I were closer. That kind of recovery is actually kinda fun to do.

grampster · « **Reply #20 on:** June 25, 2016, 06:33:45 PM »

Why did you drive it in the water in the first place?

cassandra and sara's daddy · « **Reply #21 on:** June 25, 2016, 06:36:00 PM »

Yea. Believe me that one dive today cured me. I have to line up a diver. Once it's rigged I have a big pontoon boat I rigged with 2 2000 pound winches. Gonna rig it four corners hoist it drive it to boat ramp hook a cable to a truck and pull it up ramp.

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Ben · « **Reply #22 on:** June 25, 2016, 06:39:41 PM »

Quote from: cassandra and sara's daddy on June 25, 2016, 06:36:00 PM

Yea. Believe me that one dive today cured me. I have to line up a diver. Once it's rigged I have a big pontoon boat I rigged with 2 2000 pound winches. Gonna rig it four corners hoist it drive it to boat ramp hook a cable to a truck and pull it up ramp.

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Okay, that sounds much safer. :)

Fly320s · « **Reply #23 on:** June 25, 2016, 07:22:27 PM »

Where does the detcord come in?

Perd Hapley · « **Reply #24 on:** June 25, 2016, 08:43:31 PM »

Suggestions? OK, have them try one of these next time they want to drive on the lake.

Hope that helps.

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Author Topic: Question and looking for suggestions (Read 7764 times)