Author Topic: We need to stop calling men boys!  (Read 1898 times)

makattak

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We need to stop calling men boys!
« on: October 11, 2016, 09:12:48 AM »
https://www.bustle.com/articles/182414-why-we-need-to-stop-calling-women-girls

Oh, sorry. It's the other way, so somehow, it isn't stupid.

For all her insipid points, here's the one that particularly sticks out:

Quote
4. There Is No Male Equivalent

Some might try to argue that we address men as "guys" all the time, but that's not the equivalent to women being called girls. Merriam-Webster defines guy as "man, fellow." There's nothing age-specific about it, so when the word is used on men, it doesn't bear the same patronizing, infantilizing undertones. For women, though, there is no term out there that can serve as a stand-in for "guy." We're simply referred to as girls or women, while men are called boys, then guys, then men.

After high school graduation, you likely won't hear your brother and his friends being called "boys" by anyone other than your mother.1 Have you ever heard your male co-workers called "boys" in an important meeting by their boss, for instance? Doubt it.2 They're called guys or men, neither of which carry a loaded history of sexism.

In fact, if you were to call a group of grown-ass men "boys" when they're going about their lives as adults, they would probably take offense and demand that you take it back.3 Yet they'll turn around a second later and ask "the girls" what they want to drink.4  It's a senseless exchange,5 and it's one that men will never truly understand until it's explained to them6, which is why parents should raise the boys of this next generation to never use this term when talking about women.7


1. Really? No one ever refers to groups of men as "boys"?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Boys_of_Summer_(book)

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/films/boys36/

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0112442/

Can I get you boys something?

And those are just off the top of my head that I can provide documentation for quickly. Seriously, ma'am, get over yourself.


2.  I also doubt that female co-workers are called girls by ANYONE other than other females, given the fear of sexual harassment charges.

3.  You think they would? What world does this woman live in?

4.  Right. EXACTLY after being called out in this fantasy world you live in, the waiter would call a bunch of women girls. Or the imaginary men that objected to being called boys, would immediately call women girls. Of course.

5.  Oh, hey, we agree on something... oh, you weren't meaning the entirety of what you've been typing.

6.  No, no. I understand perfectly that you're looking for something innocuous to be offended by since real sexism has been driven from the public square.

7.  I'll be raising my boy not to be an idiot, which doesn't entail any kind of stupidity about avoiding offending the perpetually offended.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

Fly320s

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2016, 09:14:54 AM »
Just another person SJW trying to find something to be outraged about.  Nothing to see here; move along.
Islamic sex dolls.  Do they blow themselves up?

RoadKingLarry

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2016, 09:15:58 AM »
Boys rule, girls drool.


=D


If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

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Perd Hapley

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2016, 09:31:26 AM »
What was it Reagan called those men/guys/boys who scaled the cliffs at Pointe du Hoc?

Also, if she wanted a female equivalent to "guy," why not "gal"? (Or "doll"?  :laugh:) Either English isn't this girl's first language, or she's a very stupid girl, or the girl's having us on. Or all three. And why isn't this "grown-a** woman" worried about using the backside as a synecdoche for the whole person?  ;)
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Hawkmoon

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2016, 12:10:27 PM »
Quote
For women, though, there is no term out there that can serve as a stand-in for "guy."

???  What ever happened to the female counterpart for guys, "gals"?


Males ==> Females

Men <==> Women

Boys <==> Girls

Lads <==> Lassies

Blokes <==> Sheilas

Guys <==> Gals


I fail to perceive any problem of correlation.
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makattak

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2016, 12:13:33 PM »
Incidentally, I DID find evidence of a man take umbrage at being called a boy.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/warren-sapp-stiffs-waitress-for-horrible-service-waitress-responds/

Warren Sapp got angry and stiffed a waitress for it. And, as far as I can tell, most people think he's a thin-skinned moron for it, ESPECIALLY men.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

HeroHog

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2016, 12:37:40 PM »
Never heard of the "Old Boy" network I suppose? Here in the South "Boy, you done feked up!" is REAL popular, usually heard just before a butt whoopin. There's also the ever popular "that boy jus ain't rite."
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KD5NRH

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2016, 01:23:07 PM »
Hanging out with the boys.

And yet, girls' night out is a pretty common term among women.

makattak

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2016, 01:27:42 PM »
And yet, girls' night out is a pretty common term among women.

BECAUSE THEY'VE INTERNALIZED THE PATRIARCHY!!11!1!111!
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

HeroHog

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2016, 01:30:41 PM »
Also, "guys" is/can be all inclusive as in "hey guys, let's go to the club" said to a mixed group. I use it that way all the time. Have for YEARS.
I might not last very long or be very effective but I'll be a real pain in the ass for a minute!
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makattak

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2016, 01:41:12 PM »
Also, "guys" is/can be all inclusive as in "hey guys, let's go to the club" said to a mixed group. I use it that way all the time. Have for YEARS.

Which is a microagression.

Because grammar is sexist.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

HeroHog

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2016, 02:05:23 PM »
Which is a microagression.

Because grammar is sexist.

Something about "if they can't take a joke" and the equine they rode in on...
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BlueStarLizzard

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2016, 02:34:04 PM »
I refer to men as boys all the time. Most woman I know do.

And the thing is, when we do it, it isn't age neutral.  :lol:
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Perd Hapley

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2016, 03:06:39 PM »
I refer to men as boys all the time. Most woman I know do.

And the thing is, when we do it, it isn't age neutral.  :lol:


Men do it, to. It's common in the English-speaking world, and isn't seen as derogatory (unless you're talking about racially-specific usage).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boy#Uses_of_the_term_.22boy.22_and_related_terms
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makattak

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2016, 03:52:12 PM »

Men do it, to. It's common in the English-speaking world, and isn't seen as derogatory (unless you're talking about racially-specific usage).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boy#Uses_of_the_term_.22boy.22_and_related_terms

Even without the racial connotations, it can be used derogatorily or at least with disapproval. But, of course, so can the word "girl".

THANKFULLY, we have such wonderful things as context and speech tone and other cues to know whether something is meant negatively, positively, or innocuously.

That requires critical thinking and reading, though, which I have been told is sexist and racist.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

Perd Hapley

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #15 on: October 11, 2016, 04:13:53 PM »
Oh, yeah, it can be negative. As you say, context, etc.
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grampster

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #16 on: October 11, 2016, 04:24:11 PM »
Check that chick  :lol: writer out at Bustle for more SJW stupidity. [barf]

I always enjoy the waitress girls who come to your table and use the term "Yooz Gyz" or "What would Yooz Gyzis like to order".   :lol:

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cambeul41

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #17 on: October 11, 2016, 05:15:55 PM »
My wife often refers to "boy behavior" as a positive usually in reference their ability to learn things through hacking, experiment, tinkering.
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KD5NRH

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #18 on: October 11, 2016, 05:20:23 PM »
My wife often refers to "boy behavior" as a positive usually in reference their ability to learn things through hacking, experiment, tinkering.

As opposed to women's inability to learn or even believe what's explained to them?

"Ok, I need you to turn on the computer"
"Are you sure?"
"Well, I've been doing this for ten years, and have quite a bit of specialized training, but now that you mention it, the most important factor is that I'm 800 miles away on the other end of a phone line and well out of the blast radius."

Hawkmoon

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2016, 05:38:22 PM »
Also, "guys" is/can be all inclusive as in "hey guys, let's go to the club" said to a mixed group. I use it that way all the time. Have for YEARS.

The first time I encountered that was in a restaurant somewhere in Virginia, not too far from Dulles Airport. I was there on business, with two other men and two women. The waitress came by and asked "What would you guys like to drink?"

This was about 1993, plus or minus a year. I was shocked.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #20 on: October 11, 2016, 06:23:31 PM »
The first time I encountered that was in a restaurant somewhere in Virginia, not too far from Dulles Airport. I was there on business, with two other men and two women. The waitress came by and asked "What would you guys like to drink?"

This was about 1993, plus or minus a year. I was shocked.


I hear it all the time, even when no men/guys/boys/oppressors are part of the group.
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cambeul41

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #21 on: October 11, 2016, 08:28:40 PM »
Quote
My wife often refers to "boy behavior" as a positive usually in reference their ability to learn things through hacking, experiment, tinkering.

Quote
As opposed to women's inability to learn or even believe what's explained to them?

She has her PhD in Engineering, 20 years experience, an MBA, and teaches university statistics on the side. Are you really sure that you want to go there?
?It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance.?
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HeroHog

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Re: We need to stop calling men boys!
« Reply #22 on: October 11, 2016, 08:31:32 PM »
She has her PhD in Engineering, 20 years experience, an MBA, and teaches university statistics on the side. Are you really sure that you want to go there?

"Those who can, do..." (ducks and wheels quickly away)
I might not last very long or be very effective but I'll be a real pain in the ass for a minute!
MOLON LABE!