Incredible historic resources online for gun guys...

[K Frame]

Anyone who knows me knows that I am absolutely fascinated with the history and development of metallic cartridges. I collect cartridges and love reading and talking about them.

Recently I came across an incredible resource from the International Ammunition Association...

Scans of American cartridge (and some firearms, in combined books) catalogs, price lists, flyers, etc., going back into the 1800s.

These gems are located at: http://cartridgecollectors.org/ammunition-catalogs

Just this morning I learned something important.

In a discussion about the origins of the .38 Special, a poster on another board said that while the cartridge had been developed with black powder, it had only ever been offered commercially in smokeless loadings.

I knew that was incorrect, so I started digging into the UMC (that company developed the round with S&W) and later the Remington-UMC catalogs.

I easily showed that as early as 1901 UMC was offering ONLY black powder .38 Special rounds, and by 1903 had added smokeless selections.

But what I learned is just how long back powder .38 Specials were marketed... I had originally thought that sacred black was dropped right around World War I, but I'm well into the 1930s catalogs and Remington-UMC is still offering a single black powder .38 Special load.

I had no idea that it went on that long.

[AJ Dual]

I would assume it followed the preponderance of black-powder-only guns, which were probably in the majority until well after 1900, so it makes sense. (And the better safe than sorry mantra for even longer after that...) But it's nice to have actual proof documented.

[K Frame]

Actually, it really doesn't make sense because there were no "black powder only" .38 Specials revolvers ever made.

The Model of 1899, the first .38 Special, was more than strong enough to make the transition to smokeless powder with no material changes.

Colt quickly began chambering the round in its Model of 1903 Army & Navy, an updated of the Model 1901 (and both based on the original 1892).

The only change Colt made to the 1901 was to straight bore the cylinder so that it would accept .38 Special cases.

[TommyGunn]

IIRC the load for the .38SP was 22½ grains of BP.   
I suspect that blackpowder loadings lasted up into the 1930s was because ammunition manufacturers buy powder by the ton-load and the blackpowder they had on hand simply lasted up until the 1930s.

[K Frame]

Ammo companies aren't going to load a round that doesn't have a certain level of sales and customer support/interest. Especially in the middle of the worst economic depression in the country's history.

Through the years the BP loadings offered by Remington continued to dwindle, starting with the oldest cartridges, primarily the rimfire ones.

I suspect it has more to do with the hidebound nature of some shooters.

[K Frame]

"IIRC the load for the .38SP was 22½ grains of BP."

Close. 21.5

[MechAg94]

Weren't some older 38 pistols capable of firing the 38 special.  Or perhaps that was part of its development to use in some older pistols?

[K Frame]

Weren't some older 38 pistols capable of firing the 38 special.  Or perhaps that was part of its development to use in some older pistols?

Yes. Older Colt revolvers had bored through cylinders. Some of them would chamber .38 Special, or even .357 Magnum, cartridges. Frightening prospect.


Ask Mtnbkr what it's like to fire a .357 through a .38 Special revolver...