Ve haf RULZ!

[Hawkmoon]

http://www.newser.com/story/250728/girl-golfer-defeats-boys-is-denied-trophy.html

High school has no girls' gold team, so girl plays on boys golf team. Girl wins regional tournament -- boy wins trophy.

So much for Title whatever-it-was that was supposed to equalize opportunities for females in school sports.

[Fly320s]

If they have two teams, then she can’t complain.  Otherwise, the boys get to play in the girl’s tournament.

[dogmush]

If they have two teams, then she can’t complain.  Otherwise, the boys get to play in the girl’s tournament.

They don't have two teams, that's why she was in the male tournament.

I think it's worth noting as well that SHE isn't complaining.  That's important.  Her quote:

The male runner-up, who was given the first-place trophy, even offered it to Nash. She refused to take it, however. "I understand that there are rules in place," she says.

She got an exemption to the rules to play as a member of a team, but not as an individual.  The team didn't make it, and she's not allowed individual awards.  Disappointing, sure.

Both the young lady and the runner up seem to be good sports about it though I'm sure an adult will be along soon to throw a conniption fit.

[230RN]

Nah, somehow the SJWistas will turn it into Trump's fault.  You wait.  You'll see.

And Emily will be turned into a victim of the white male supremacy.  You wait.  You'll see.

And the boy who tried to give her the trophy will be a guilt-ridden condescending white male supremacist.  You wait.  You'll see.

And there'll be another "Fearless Girl" statue on Wall street. You wait.  You'll see.

Just you wait. You'll see.

[Fly320s]

They don't have two teams, that's why she was in the male tournament.

From the article:

Nash, who can play in the girls state championships next spring.

Looks like they do have a girl’s tournament.

[dogmush]

Fly 320's, I may be wrong, and the article was thin but here's what I got:

This was a regional (i.e. feeder to the state level) team competition. Her school has no girls team.  (that's explicit in the article)

The Worcester Telegram explains her high school has no girls' team, so MIAA rules let her play on the fall boys' team, but only as a member of the team, not as an individual.

Her team didn't make it, despite her help, so they're out and cant go to the next level.  This tournament ALSO had individual competitors going to the next level, but she can't be one of those since her exemption only allowed being part of a team.  So she can't win as an individual or advance as an individual because her exemption doesn't cover that.  Had her team not sucked, they all could have advanced.

There is a Girl's individual competition/season in the spring, and she can compete in that no problem.  One assumes the spring set-up will be the same with team and individual parts for the girls, and she'll still have no team*, but can compete as an individual.

Honestly it seems pretty fair.  Apparently high school golfers each have a chance to compete in two events.  team and individual.  since she had no team they let her on her school's Boy's team and kept her in the Girl's individual.  That makes sure she also get's the two event model.  Would be a non-event, except that she beat the boy's winner.**

* I wonder if the her team can get a mirror exemption and compete in the girl's team event in the spring?  Her and her teammates might get another shot.

** If she's that good, she's probably pro level, and will be on tour soon making way more than all of us, and the event directors making the rules.  She'll be fine.

[Hawkmoon]

They don't have two teams, that's why she was in the male tournament.

I think it's worth noting as well that SHE isn't complaining.  That's important.  Her quote:

She got an exemption to the rules to play as a member of a team, but not as an individual.  The team didn't make it, and she's not allowed individual awards.  Disappointing, sure.

Both the young lady and the runner up seem to be good sports about it though I'm sure an adult will be along soon to throw a conniption fit.

Not quite. Her playing in the tournament wasn't an exemption, it's what the rules allow. But the rules allow her to compete in the boys' tournament only as a member of the team, not as an individual. If her team had qualified for the state tournament, she would be allowed to compete. As an individual, she can't compete because of her gender. That strikes me as a very strange rule, and if tested in court under the applicable federal law I doubt the rule would survive.

Obviously, the solution is for her to "self-identify" as a male for the duration of the golf season.

[Hawkmoon]

Just you wait. You'll see.

You left out " 'enry 'iggins."

[Fly320s]

Fly 320's, I may be wrong, and the article was thin but here's what I got:

This was a regional (i.e. feeder to the state level) team competition. Her school has no girls team.  (that's explicit in the article)

Her team didn't make it, despite her help, so they're out and cant go to the next level.  This tournament ALSO had individual competitors going to the next level, but she can't be one of those since her exemption only allowed being part of a team.  So she can't win as an individual or advance as an individual because her exemption doesn't cover that.  Had her team not sucked, they all could have advanced.

There is a Girl's individual competition/season in the spring, and she can compete in that no problem.  One assumes the spring set-up will be the same with team and individual parts for the girls, and she'll still have no team*, but can compete as an individual.

Honestly it seems pretty fair.  Apparently high school golfers each have a chance to compete in two events.  team and individual.  since she had no team they let her on her school's Boy's team and kept her in the Girl's individual.  That makes sure she also get's the two event model.  Would be a non-event, except that she beat the boy's winner.**

* I wonder if the her team can get a mirror exemption and compete in the girl's team event in the spring?  Her and her teammates might get another shot.

** If she's that good, she's probably pro level, and will be on tour soon making way more than all of us, and the event directors making the rules.  She'll be fine.

I reread the article and I think you are correct.

[Fly320s]

That strikes me as a very strange rule, and if tested in court under the applicable federal law I doubt the rule would survive.

Obviously, the solution is for her to "self-identify" as a male for the duration of the golf season.

I would love to see her identify as male just to watch the heads explode (I know now is too late though).

As for the lawsuit, if she were to win and be allowed to play on the boy's team, wouldn't that mean boys would be allowed to play on the girl's team?  And hasn't this been covered already in court?

[Hawkmoon]

I would love to see her identify as male just to watch the heads explode (I know now is too late though).

As for the lawsuit, if she were to win and be allowed to play on the boy's team, wouldn't that mean boys would be allowed to play on the girl's team?  And hasn't this been covered already in court?

Team sports seems to be more or less the athletic equivalent of the now-discredited segregation policy of "separate but equal" schools for blacks and whites. The federal law (Title whatever) basically requires "equal opportunity" for women to engage in sports to the same degree as men. If a school has a boys' golf team, then that school has to allow girls to compete in golf. If the school doesn't have enough girl golfers to create a team, or they don't have enough money to field a girls' team -- they have to allow the girls to try out for the boys' team.

And that's what led to this situation. The young lady was a member of the boys team, and the boys team was entered in the tournament so she had to be allowed to play -- as a team member. But ... it was a boys tournament, so she couldn't win an individual trophy even though she beat all the boys.

Bizarro.

[KD5NRH]

Team sports seems to be more or less the athletic equivalent of the now-discredited segregation policy of "separate but equal" schools for blacks and whites.

In some sports, there are legitimate reasons for gender segregation; need for full-change locker rooms, as well as sports that require certain levels of more-intimate-than-some-may-be-comfortable-with contact like wrestling.  Other sports would make more sense to stick with only weight/age/skill classes. 

Then there's golf.  Sounds to me like some of the other schools' coaches just don't like the idea of their boys being beat by a girl.

I've played a few sports where a person alone in their category was allowed at their own discretion, either by a regular rule or one-time decisions at tournaments, to compete in a similar category rather than "win" by default.  Generally, it was the next tougher category (by weight class or skill level) with two or more contenders, so they weren't likely to win, but if they did, the opponents were supportive and understood that it meant they really needed to step up their own game, not complain about the decision. 

[Mannlicher]

Title IX was a political joke from the git go.  Boys and girls should play on different teams.   Period.

[lupinus]

Title IX was a political joke from the git go.  Boys and girls should play on different teams.   Period.

In the case of something like golf, why?

It makes perfect sense in highly physical sports, like wrestling and football. Buts it's friggin golf. I can't think of a reason to separate the players out on basis of sex, other than just cause.

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[RoadKingLarry]

I gotta agree with Lupinus. I don't know jack about golf but does physical strength make a serious difference when both players are at about the same competence level? From the results of the tournament in the OP I'd have to say it probably doesn't.
 

[Scout26]

Thanks Obama !!!

1.  If we can have mixed sex bathroom, then why not mixed sex locker rooms ??

2.  Did she play from the Red tees or the White/Blue tees that they boys played from ?

3.  The reason there are different tees, is that women generally* can't hit the ball as far as men (again that entire biology/physiology/upper body strength).




* - Do note the word "Generally".  Are there some women that can hit the ball farther then most men.  Yes, see the LPGA, but it you have LPGA go up against PGA players, then the men will generally hit the ball farther.

[Northwoods]

In the case of something like golf, why?

It makes perfect sense in highly physical sports, like wrestling and football. Buts it's friggin golf. I can't think of a reason to separate the players out on basis of sex, other than just cause.

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Then why is there an LPGA as well as the PGA?  If women could effectively compete with men, even in golf, there'd be no reason to have a separate professional league for them. 

[KD5NRH]

Why is there a Women's Chess Federation?  Do women lack the upper body strength to move the pieces as effectively as men?

Or is it just a matter of having more divisions so more people can claim to be "the best?"

[BlueStarLizzard]

There are sports that don't segregate men and woman into different teams. Equestrian, many of the shooting sports, ect.

I don't see why golf should be segregated.

The only reasons I can see are because boys not wanting to get beat by woman and, like KD5NRH, more opportunities for people to be "the best".

*shrug* and as far as individual types of athletics, ones were physical differences do matter, I don't see why we don't have everyone compete on the same field and just award for top overall, top male and top female. I'm betting in some things the overalls would be a mixed bag, at least occasionally, and it would be amusing.

[Northwoods]

At the PGA level the difference between winning and losing is a couple shots over 72 holes.  If women tried to complete with men (including driving from the same tees) they'd probably average 3-8 shots more per 18 holes.  Par 5 holes especially would put them at a disadvantage due to men being able to hit farther and therefore need fewer shots to reach the green.  Over 72 holes the best women golfers would be lucky to be within 10 shots of the lead, and likely would be 20+ back.

[Northwoods]

http://golftips.golfweek.com/lpga-women-played-pga-tour-20647.html