Let's all talk about why this is a bad idea: E85 Conversion kits!

[Nitrogen]

Lets pretend that the increased alcohol content won't eat away at your fuel lines.
Let's also pretend that this is probably a violation of federal laws.

So let's take a look at this thing:
http://www.abcesso.com/

It's a kit that supposedly sits between the o2 sensor, injectors, and ECU to allow a non-Flex Fuel vehicle to run on E85.

So why ELSE is this a bad idea.  Because if I don't get enough reasons, I might actually try it.

[Bigjake]

pointless as E85 without .gov subsidies. But denouncing ethanol is like trying to tell paulistinians that Ron Paul isn't their ideal guy, so YMMV.

[Nitrogen]

Well, I also am not an ethanol booster.
(see my post here for instance: http://www.armedpolitesociety.com/index.php?topic=7892.msg129467#msg129467)
But since its significantly cheaper, I'd like to take advantage of it anyway, since my tax dollars are subsidizing it.

I'm also a horrible tinkerer and would like to give it a shot just to say that I did it.

[Bogie]

Is it cheaper per mile, or just per gallon?

What gets me are the folks who drive diesel trucks, who talk about getting a gas one because the fuel is cheaper... they've got a one ton dually, and they're getting nice mileage with diesel - when they get their gas truck, they'll be lucky to get 10-11mpg, without the torque.

[Bigjake]

Based on your post, go for it.  Definitely cheaper, for now.

Also running at a higher compression ration can increase greenhouse gases, so isn't a good idea.

Given that global warming/climate change is a farce/scheme, you have little to worry about in that dept.

added, because I thought of it after bogie's post, Soy blended Biodiesel is utter crap in cold weather, and our local station (town & country) has discontinued use of it til' temps come up in spring.

[Manedwolf]

I thought E85 would pretty much eat the engine seals of an older high-compression engine as well?

[Boomhauer]

I thought E85 would pretty much eat the engine seals of an older high-compression engine as well?

I'm pretty sure that this is so.

Anybody who puts one of these kits on their vehicle isn't very smart. And is wasting a perfectly good vehicle. You car isn't flex-fuel. Don't try to make it unless you know exactly what your are doing, and also, trying to modify today's vehicles with their heavily computerized engine managment is only asking for trouble, unless, again, you know exactly what you are doing.

Now, Popular Mechanics did take an old Chevy truck and rebuild it completely, with the capability to run off of ethanol.

[mfree]

I'm 90% sure this is a scam. The biggest reason is knowing that modern O2 sensors are tuned for a particular amount of oxygen and really don't read for anything *but* that level... it gives a reading that's essentially summed up as "low-on the mark-high".

I'll bet you that you open the precious little "control box" and you find a resister that fools the car into thinking it's 40 below outside and that's ALL that's in there. ECU thinks it's cold, dumps more fuel, car runs (poorly).

[charby]

I thought E85 would pretty much eat the engine seals of an older high-compression engine as well?

They way I understand it, is that E-85 will erode fuel lines and fuel injector/carburetor gaskets ans seals over time unless they are replaced with alcohol resistant ones. The motor also needs to be tuned to run E-85 also. I believe intake manifold and down will work just fine with E-85.

On flex fuel engines the fuel deliver systems are designed with that in mind and the on board computer can adjust the engine to match what fuel is being burnt.

I have been running 10% ethanol since 1990 here in Iowa, I have never had a problem due to fuel. I will not run ethanol based fuel in my 2 cycle or air-cooled engines because ethanol acts as a oxidizer and increases burn temps.

I still think corn based ethanol is a stop gap feel good solution and once cellulose ethanol production is economically viable we will see more ethanol available at the pumps and straight fuel will go the way of leaded gas.

[Marvin Dao]

Is it cheaper per mile, or just per gallon?

According to E85Prices.com, E85 is 15% cheaper than unleaded on average. The cheapest E85 is 28% cheaper than gasoline. According to EPA figures, E85 gives ~ 70% of the mileage of gasoline in American flex fuel vehicles. Do out the math and on average, E85 is 18% more expensive per mile. Even at the greatest differential, E85 is barely break even right now.

Really, the only reason flex fuel vehicles exist is that ethanol in E85 consumption doesn't count against CAFE mileage figures. Only the gasoline content in E85 is counted. The EPA also assumes the car will be driving on E85 50% of the time and calculates fuel economy accordingly. So even though E85 gets only 70% of the mileage, on paper, only 15% of the fuel used is counted... There are set limits to how much of a CAFE contribution E85 can make, but hey, an E85 Tahoe has a CAFE rating of 33 mpg, compared to a CAFE rating in the teens for the regular gasoline only version. Plenty of incentive there for car makers that need a bit of help.

[Gewehr98]

It depends on where you are in the corn belt. I lose about 10% mileage in my 2.2L FlexFuel truck.  I filled up on E-85 this morning just down the street at the BP, it was $2.49/gallon.  Regular unleaded is $3.10/gallon at the same gas station.  I'm cool with a 20% reduction in cost for a 10% reduction in mileage.  BTW, 40 cents of every gallon of E-85 is taxed here...

Just make sure you have either a real FlexFuel system, or build a totally committed E-85 vehicle.  They even nitride the crankcase internals on FlexFuel motors, plus there's a fuel composition sensor to adjust the injection and ignition timing for the 105 octane E-85. 

My '53 Chevy pickup is having a 383 stroker installed, with compression boosted to make better use of the higher octane ethanol.  I'm using all stainless fuel lines to feed the Edelbrock E-85 4-barrel, no rubber hoses anywhere.