Wall to be Emergency

[Andiron]

Are we headed to a "Papers Please" situation with the "Wall"?

I've never considered showing my ID/Passport an unreasonable restriction when entering someone else's country...


Edited to correct spelling

[Ron]

Are we headed to a "Papers Please" situation with the "Wall"?

We’re already there.

Last time I drove up to Canada, 2014, they found a restricted item in my buddies car.

All my papers were in order.

After 15 minutes of sitting in an empty room alone, waiting for them to run my info, the BP guy comes back in and asks me about my arrest in 1983. A case the judge threw out due to it being an obvious case of mistaken identity.

A half hour after that we were back on our way with my buddy getting a warning.

The safe border is policed to the extreme. The unsafe border is purposefully left unprotected and wide open.

Why?

Build the wall!

[Ben]

Are we headed to a "Papers Please" situation with the "Wall"?

Not sure if I'm misunderstanding you. That's exactly what's supposed to happen at a border. I've been to a dozen countries, including Mexico, and they all made me show my passport and in some instances a visa, to get in.

[BobR]

Not sure if I'm misunderstanding you. That's exactly what's supposed to happen at a border. I've been to a dozen countries, including Mexico, and they all made me show my passport and in some instances a visa, to get in.

The same thing has happened to me more times than I can count. Fly in on an obvious military  aircraft, get met by embassy people for transport, stop at the "papers please check" station in the host country and then on your way. Sending people to Saudi Arabia in 1989 was even more complicated, we had to send the host nation a list of people we were sending in and the ones we were pulling out at least two weeks in advance so they could be checked. I don't consider having to show my passport or other from of ID when entering a foreign country legally a nuisance. It is the way things are done in civilized (and some not so civilized) countries.

bob

[charby]

Not sure if I'm misunderstanding you. That's exactly what's supposed to happen at a border. I've been to a dozen countries, including Mexico, and they all made me show my passport and in some instances a visa, to get in.

At ports of entry yes, supposed to be that way, but anytime you are stopped by leo or have interactions with government workers you'll have to show proof of us citizenship.

[BobR]

I possibly see where you are coming from. Maybe as you are driving along minding your business about 98 miles from the Southern border and you get stopped at checkpoint manned by armed men and they ask for your proof of citizenship rather than just ask or look at you. If "asking for papers" is upheld there where will it stop? I don't see this happening in my lifetime, but in someone else's lifetime it could surely be a possibility as the need for national security overrides the due process we are so fond of now. Things that make you think outside the box.

bob

[MillCreek]

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/15/us/politics/trump-national-emergency-congress.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

More concern over the use of emergency powers by a President.

[bedlamite]

The proper time to declare an emergency and build a wall has come and gone. It was when the dems were on the beach in Puerto Rico.

[charby]

I possibly see where you are coming from. Maybe as you are driving along minding your business about 98 miles from the Southern border and you get stopped at checkpoint manned by armed men and they ask for your proof of citizenship rather than just ask or look at you. If "asking for papers" is upheld there where will it stop? I don't see this happening in my lifetime, but in someone else's lifetime it could surely be a possibility as the need for national security overrides the due process we are so fond of now. Things that make you think outside the box.

bob

A wall isn't going to work, you can always go around a wall. Trains and trucks cross the border everyday, once this wall is established there are going to be a lot more dead bodies in truck trailers and train cars.

Like I have been saying if Trump, the GOP or Democrats were really serious about illegal immigration they would be going after those who employ illegal aliens. Too much campaign money comes from those who take advantage of the exploitable labor of the illegal aliens.

Also we are willingly asking for more government control and doing it as declaring an emergency (Patriot Act anyone?). This is going to come back full circle when another party is in charge and we are going to lose a lot of freedoms because of this. Don't you think folks like the AOR would love to force everyone into urban centers and force us into the green deal?

[Ben]

but anytime you are stopped by leo or have interactions with government workers you'll have to show proof of us citizenship.

Well, that's a bit wide-ranging.

When I'm out walking down the sidewalk minding my own business, do I want a cop demanding my ID? No, absolutely not. However for certain interactions, like getting my driver's license or voting, I absolutely want them demanding my ID and proof of US citizenship.

[Andiron]

At ports of entry yes, supposed to be that way, but anytime you are stopped by leo or have interactions with government workers you'll have to show proof of us citizenship.

There's this magic new thing that any sane country would employ called profiling.

[MillCreek]

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/16/us/border-migrants-asylum-mexico-aclu.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

Many of the migrant caravan are giving up and either going back home or staying in Mexico.

[Perd Hapley]

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/16/us/border-migrants-asylum-mexico-aclu.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

Many of the migrant caravan are giving up and either going back home or staying in Mexico.

Donald Trump: Slayer of Dreams

[Jamisjockey]

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/15/us/politics/trump-national-emergency-congress.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

More concern over the use of emergency powers by a President.

So they could use the act to enforce current laws?
The president cannot write law. They can enforce current federal law, that's it.
So a future dem could use the act to step up enforcement of straw purchasing?  Firearms trafficking? 

[DittoHead]

So they could use the act to enforce current laws?
The president cannot write law. They can enforce current federal law, that's it.
So a future dem could use the act to step up enforcement of straw purchasing?  Firearms trafficking? 

I think guns would be one of the hardest areas for them to use a national "emergency" although I could certainly see it used to give the CDC a lot of funding to do "research" and pump out anti-gun propaganda. Climate change & the environment is where they seem to have easier targets.

[Jamisjockey]

I think guns would be one of the hardest areas for them to use a national "emergency" although I could certainly see it used to give the CDC a lot of funding to do "research" and pump out anti-gun propaganda. Climate change & the environment is where they seem to have easier targets.

Agreed.
Perhaps they would crack down on illegals passing background checks...

[Perd Hapley]

I have no idea if the above is correct, but huge if true! (Buzzfeed can do it; so can I).

[Ben]

So I guess the new "wall bad" dem talking point is that everyone South of our border is indigenous to this side of the border and can just show up? How far South? Mexico, or all the way down to Chile? How far North are they considered indigenous? Just the Southern border states or all the way to Canada?

https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2019/02/19/kirsten-gillibrand-opposes-border-wall-that-would-cut-off-indigenous-people-from-the-united-states/

[Perd Hapley]

Are we going to have to conquer the Indians and whip the Mexican Army again? 

[freakazoid]

A wall isn't going to work, you can always go around a wall. Trains and trucks cross the border everyday, once this wall is established there are going to be a lot more dead bodies in truck trailers and train cars.

If you have to go around the wall, then clearly the wall is working. Yeah; trains and trucks cross the border, at controlled points of entry.

[charby]

If you have to go around the wall, then clearly the wall is working. Yeah; trains and trucks cross the border, at controlled points of entry.

Not every load is inspected or every train stopped. How about a real cure and not another bandage.

[freakazoid]

Not every load is inspected or every train stopped. How about a real cure and not another bandage.

Well yeah. You can't stop it 100%. But when has that ever been the goal?

[charby]

Well yeah. You can't stop it 100%. But when has that ever been the goal?

Nreds to be, going painfully after every employer who hires illegal aliens would be way more effective than any wall.

[Perd Hapley]

Nreds to be, going painfully after every employer who hires illegal aliens would be way more effective than any wall.

Why would we settle for anything less than both?

[charby]

Why would we settle for anything less than both?

...because we all know neither is going to happen.