Author Topic: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore  (Read 1166 times)

Ben

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Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« on: September 30, 2019, 08:53:20 AM »
I realize this is an extreme example, but I kinda cracked up when I read it. I've always thought it was ridiculous for colleges to take functional illiterates simply because they can throw a ball around. At least force them to get a degree majoring in "sports". This guy will probably walk away with a degree in engineering, basically making it of less worth to those who are qualified for the degree.  ;/

https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2019/09/29/antonio-brown-needs-a-prof-reader-for-his-english-paper-thats-do-by-tonight-12am-a/
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Fly320s

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #1 on: September 30, 2019, 09:08:08 AM »
That is pretty bad, but not surprising.

MY view as to why college degrees don't mean anything anymore is because everyone has one now.  They are so common, their value has been diluted.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #2 on: September 30, 2019, 09:22:17 AM »
"My English paper do by tonight 12am need a prof reader..."

And how!
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230RN

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #3 on: September 30, 2019, 09:24:11 AM »
There seems to be a lot of people generally ticked off about the whole tertiary educational system nowadays.  Son1 was livid over the business of "forgiving" college loans.  He (and a couple of his friends) had recently paid them off.

I myself am browned off a bit about how the four-year application of my soft pink ass to hard oak chairs has been so cheapened by on-line courses* and various undeserved assistance to folks who can't read.

Terry

* Yeah, technological "progress," but...
« Last Edit: September 30, 2019, 09:50:42 AM by 230RN »
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MechAg94

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #4 on: September 30, 2019, 09:41:54 AM »
I have heard of people hiring typists to do papers back in the day.  Generally the typist was expected to do some editing and corrections and make it look presentable.  I guess I don't see it as all that unusual.  
This was back before everyone had computers and printers (or things were turned in electronically).

That said, considering the deadline, it sounds like he is looking for someone to take dictation and write half of the paper.
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Brad Johnson

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2019, 09:56:47 AM »
Give the lower education system's government-mandated mission of teaching-to-test rather than teaching-to-learn, the use of participation-based grading rather than result-based, and a generational shift towards ridiculously over-protective parenting, I'm not surprised.

One of my best friends works at Student Legal here on campus. Her stories of student illiteracy are not only appalling, they are in the multiples per day. The problem isn't students' ability to read and write in cursive, it's whether or not they can read or write at all.

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MillCreek

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2019, 10:01:42 AM »
I have heard of people hiring typists to do papers back in the day.  Generally the typist was expected to do some editing and corrections and make it look presentable.  I guess I don't see it as all that unusual.  
This was back before everyone had computers and printers (or things were turned in electronically).

Back when I was in chemistry grad school in 81-82, there were a ton of 'typist available' ads on the bulletin boards of the student union and chemistry buildings.  I typed my master's thesis myself on a Smith Corona electric typewriter that I received as a high school graduation gift.
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makattak

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2019, 10:20:58 AM »
Give the lower education system's government-mandated mission of teaching-to-test rather than teaching-to-learn (1), the use of participation-based grading rather than result-based (2), and a generational shift towards ridiculously over-protective parenting (3), I'm not surprised.

One of my best friends works at Student Legal here on campus. Her stories of student illiteracy are not only appalling, they are in the multiples per day. The problem isn't students' ability to read and write in cursive, it's whether or not they can read or write at all.

Brad

(1) Thank you, Common Core
(2) Thank you, continuing feminization of the education system. (Oh, competition is icky and how boys best learn! We need to make it more cooperative!)
(3) When you have fewer children, you are far more invested in your one child's future success.



Add to that the purposeful stealing of the future from "gifted" children born into poorer families.1 We can't allow those children to ever be challenged because they would leave behind the less capable students, so we will trap them in classes with students who will never be able to keep up with them, leaving the bored at best and often leaving them in a situation where their fellow student actively sabotage them.

Our education system is just peachy.


1: I say poorer families because the more well-off families will most often ensure their children get the proper education they require either through private schooling, homeschooling, or tutoring. Poorer families don't generally have the ability to make those choices.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

230RN

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2019, 10:50:15 AM »
makattak lamented,

Quote
Add to that the purposeful stealing of the future from "gifted" children born into poorer families.

We can't allow those children to ever be challenged because they would leave behind the less capable students, so we will trap them in classes with students who will never be able to keep up with them, leaving the bored at best and often leaving them in a situation where their fellow students actively sabotage them.

Amen.  "+me too"

On the other hand, overcoming the boredom and social challenge is another learning experience all on its own.

« Last Edit: September 30, 2019, 11:39:24 AM by 230RN »
WHATEVER YOUR DEFINITION OF "INFRINGE " IS, YOU SHOULDN'T BE DOING IT.

Pb

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2019, 12:26:21 PM »
College is getting dumbed down to please the students.

MechAg94

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2019, 12:32:41 PM »
Give the lower education system's government-mandated mission of teaching-to-test rather than teaching-to-learn, the use of participation-based grading rather than result-based, and a generational shift towards ridiculously over-protective parenting, I'm not surprised.

One of my best friends works at Student Legal here on campus. Her stories of student illiteracy are not only appalling, they are in the multiples per day. The problem isn't students' ability to read and write in cursive, it's whether or not they can read or write at all.

Brad
Star Trek TOS had that one episode where the people on this planet had the "Constitution" but couldn't read it.  I was thinking it was because it was in cursive.  Maybe not.
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WLJ

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #11 on: September 30, 2019, 12:33:05 PM »
Back when I was in chemistry grad school in 81-82, there were a ton of 'typist available' ads on the bulletin boards of the student union and chemistry buildings.  I typed my master's thesis myself on a Smith Corona electric typewriter that I received as a high school graduation gift.

Reminds me of how my mother just could not keep up with changes in tech. Just a few years she couldn't understand why my daughter didn't want her old typewriter to do her school papers on. Mom, we have a three computers at home all networked with a printer. "But How is she going to do them without a typewriter???" Finally I took the typewriter and put it in the basement just to get her to stop bugging me.
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Ben

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #12 on: September 30, 2019, 12:50:50 PM »

1: I say poorer families because the more well-off families will most often ensure their children get the proper education they require either through private schooling, homeschooling, or tutoring. Poorer families don't generally have the ability to make those choices.

While I was making fun in the OP, this really does grind my gears.

Really rich kids always get into college if they want in.
All kinds of morons get into college via "diversity".
All kinds of morons get into college on athletic scholarships, and often to the best schools.
Morons like David Hogg get into Harvard because they are popular with the academia philosophy.

Working through upper middle class kids have to actually work at getting into college. They have to excel in High School. They have to ace their SATs. Even then,  many of the best schools are off limits to them and they end up in a state college in BFE. Not that there's anything wrong with state college.  I can think of a lot of state colleges where I would go instead of going to Harvard. These days you can often get a better education outside the Ivy league and places like the UC system (UC grad here). The only thing you lose is a lot of the networking.

The idea that someone like the 3rd grade equivalent moron in the OP is actually in college (I guess he got to bypass the SAT) while some carpenter's kid with a 150 IQ and great SAT scores might not be accepted, is a bit infuriating.
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makattak

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2019, 01:44:13 PM »
While I was making fun in the OP, this really does grind my gears.

Really rich kids always get into college if they want in.
All kinds of morons get into college via "diversity".
All kinds of morons get into college on athletic scholarships, and often to the best schools.
Morons like David Hogg get into Harvard because they are popular with the academia philosophy.

Working through upper middle class kids have to actually work at getting into college. They have to excel in High School. They have to ace their SATs. Even then,  many of the best schools are off limits to them and they end up in a state college in BFE. Not that there's anything wrong with state college.  I can think of a lot of state colleges where I would go instead of going to Harvard. These days you can often get a better education outside the Ivy league and places like the UC system (UC grad here). The only thing you lose is a lot of the networking.

The idea that someone like the 3rd grade equivalent moron in the OP is actually in college (I guess he got to bypass the SAT) while some carpenter's kid with a 150 IQ and great SAT scores might not be accepted, is a bit infuriating.


While that situation is bad, it's honestly not the worst one.

The worst one are the intelligent inner-city kids who go to public schools and are often attacked for "acting white" because they want to learn. And, if they happen to make it through all that bullying and get into a college, they find that although they may be smart enough, they were woefully unprepared and end up dropping out of engineering or medicine that would have been their first choice. (Generally because of the difficulty of the "weeding out courses" of upper level math.)

And then they get told it's because of white supremacy that they weren't able to do the math that their horrid schooling failed to prepare them for.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

lee n. field

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #14 on: September 30, 2019, 02:20:00 PM »
I have heard of people hiring typists to do papers back in the day.  Generally the typist was expected to do some editing and corrections and make it look presentable.  I guess I don't see it as all that unusual.  


Yep.  Older lady I knew, back in my Screw of IL drone worker days, made good money on the side doing that.  $10 a page kind of rings a bell in my memory.  Not trivial money in the '80s.
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Brad Johnson

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #15 on: September 30, 2019, 02:59:09 PM »
I was really good money in the day. I was a mediocre typist at best and I still managed to make decent beer money transcribing written documents to typed for the guys on my dorm floor.

My grandmother could type faster than you could read it to her. Frikking amazing. Strike that... friggin astonishing. She could do it without looking, and with an accuracy that I couldn't hope to match even if I looked at every letter and took all the time in the world. I vividly remember many evenings at their house hearing the constant rapid-fire rata-tat-tat of her banging out History of Foard County printer's proofs on her old blue SCM. She would have gone event faster but the machine couldn't keep up. She was always griping about having to slow down because the hammers would bind up if she went too fast. I also remember the sound it made; clunk-whirrrrrrr when turn on and whirrrr-!THWAP! when you pressed a key.

Brad
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fifth_column

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #16 on: September 30, 2019, 03:24:55 PM »
She would have gone event faster but the machine couldn't keep up. She was always griping about having to slow down because the hammers would bind up if she went too fast.

Brad

This is actually the reason for the QWERTY keyboard.  It's designed to slow down the typing to prevent the hammers (apparently they're called typebars) getting tangled.
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makattak

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #17 on: September 30, 2019, 04:24:08 PM »
This is actually the reason for the QWERTY keyboard.  It's designed to slow down the typing to prevent the hammers (apparently they're called typebars) getting tangled.

Urban Legend.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/arts-culture/fact-of-fiction-the-legend-of-the-qwerty-keyboard-49863249/
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

TommyGunn

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #18 on: September 30, 2019, 07:55:58 PM »
Huh .... I remember a science teacher in my high school asking us to answer why the typewriter keys were arranged as they are.  The idea that the arrangement was to minimize keys jamming together seemed the most popular but we were told it wasn't right.
I don't think we were ever given that history ......
I recall jamming many keys together on those old typewriters.

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kgbsquirrel

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #19 on: September 30, 2019, 08:30:02 PM »
(1) Thank you, Common Core
(2) Thank you, continuing feminization of the education system. (Oh, competition is icky and how boys best learn! We need to make it more cooperative!)
(3) When you have fewer children, you are far more invested in your one child's future success.



Add to that the purposeful stealing of the future from "gifted" children born into poorer families.1 We can't allow those children to ever be challenged because they would leave behind the less capable students, so we will trap them in classes with students who will never be able to keep up with them, leaving the bored at best and often leaving them in a situation where their fellow student actively sabotage them.

Our education system is just peachy.


1: I say poorer families because the more well-off families will most often ensure their children get the proper education they require either through private schooling, homeschooling, or tutoring. Poorer families don't generally have the ability to make those choices.

I experienced this first hand.

They discontinued the Talented and Gifted when I was in the 3rd grade after only a few weeks of instruction.  In the 7th grade they intentionally put me in the class with the dullards and bullies.

I learned to read at three, I wrote my own name at four, I signed myself into kindergarten in cursive...and I graduated public high school after five years with a 1.5 GPA.

kgbsquirrel

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #20 on: September 30, 2019, 08:37:47 PM »
I was really good money in the day. I was a mediocre typist at best and I still managed to make decent beer money transcribing written documents to typed for the guys on my dorm floor.

My grandmother could type faster than you could read it to her. Frikking amazing. Strike that... friggin astonishing. She could do it without looking, and with an accuracy that I couldn't hope to match even if I looked at every letter and took all the time in the world. I vividly remember many evenings at their house hearing the constant rapid-fire rata-tat-tat of her banging out History of Foard County printer's proofs on her old blue SCM. She would have gone event faster but the machine couldn't keep up. She was always griping about having to slow down because the hammers would bind up if she went too fast. I also remember the sound it made; clunk-whirrrrrrr when turn on and whirrrr-!THWAP! when you pressed a key.

Brad

And that is how I took notes in crypto school.  Instructor gave his lecture, I closed my eyes and just let it flow.  You really can't take better notes than having a verbatim transcript.   =D

ETA: her typewriter was an IBM 80's digital deal which could store one line of text allowing some basic proof reading for, well, me.  Then you hit carriage return and the thing would go full teletype on you with the spherical print bar.  Even included a serial port to be used as a teletype.

MechAg94

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #21 on: September 30, 2019, 09:53:31 PM »
While I was making fun in the OP, this really does grind my gears.

Really rich kids always get into college if they want in.
All kinds of morons get into college via "diversity".
All kinds of morons get into college on athletic scholarships, and often to the best schools.
Morons like David Hogg get into Harvard because they are popular with the academia philosophy.

Working through upper middle class kids have to actually work at getting into college. They have to excel in High School. They have to ace their SATs. Even then,  many of the best schools are off limits to them and they end up in a state college in BFE. Not that there's anything wrong with state college.  I can think of a lot of state colleges where I would go instead of going to Harvard. These days you can often get a better education outside the Ivy league and places like the UC system (UC grad here). The only thing you lose is a lot of the networking.

The idea that someone like the 3rd grade equivalent moron in the OP is actually in college (I guess he got to bypass the SAT) while some carpenter's kid with a 150 IQ and great SAT scores might not be accepted, is a bit infuriating.

I thought the original article said he was signed up for an online class.  I really don't think it takes much to enroll in one of those.  He might be trying to take classes to finish his degree.  Assuming he didn't graduate while still in school.

Another route to take is go to community college or Junior College, make sure you get good grades and then transfer into the school you want.  Also, there are lots of smaller 4 years universities.  You can still get a good job and be successful going to a school like Texas State instead of MIT.  The student loan debt will likely be less as well. 
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230RN

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Re: Why College Doesn't Mean Anything Anymore
« Reply #22 on: October 01, 2019, 07:23:28 PM »
"The best cure I've found .... is the COMPUTER KEYBOARD."

<snarkassed aside>

Yeah, with its flying caps and skipped characters.

I always had to go back to correct COlorado to Colorado until I added the correction to the dictionary / spellcheck thingie stuff.  Other examples abound.  And no, it wasn't me using the post office code for COlorado out of habit or me not releasing the shift key on time.

</snarkassed aside>

TErry
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