Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident

[WLJ]

I would add to that:
4) Multiple people screwed up

I actually thought about adding that but intentionally left it out because there are things that could have happened in the chain of events we're not aware of.
It's sitting at 90% in my mind though

[Hawkmoon]

https://popculture.com/movies/news/alec-baldwin-rust-accident-gun-used-shooting-allegedly-used-off-set-target-practice/

According to this article, prop guns were also used for recreational shooting when not being used for filming. Not sure, but I think that's a no-no in the industry. Also, there was live ammunition on the set, and that is definitely a no-no in the industry.

Several other articles I saw this morning said that there had been THREE other "misfires" on the set prior to the one that killed Ms. Hutchins. By "misfires," I think they mean negligent discharges. Those are not really "misfires," since the guns apparently discharged when the trigger was pulled. I don't know if it's the people from the production crew who are calling these incidents "misfires," or the media, but they aren't "misfires."

[RocketMan]

Look at the training Hally Berry and her co-star undertook when prepping for one of the 007 movies. If she can do it, so can a prima donna like AB.

Woody

John Wick 3, not Bond

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idf6nb6FF74

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Unp4PaMKezY

Halle Berry was in the Bond film "Die Another Day" with Pierce Brosnan.  I could not find any references to what firearms training she might have had in preparation for that film, however.  If she had any training in that film, I doubt it was a thorough as what she underwent for "John Wick 3".

[bedlamite]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDHtHWyvbMM

[Angel Eyes]

Unsurprisingly, the call to ban guns from film sets has begun:

https://apnews.com/article/entertainment-business-movies-gun-politics-prop-gun-shooting-16b511c9dd479b06d9f63fe763445698

[HeroHog]

The most BASIC of gun safety, the 4 rules, would have prevented this.

The Four Rules
1. Always treat a gun like it's loaded and when handed one, check for yourself to ensure it's not, then still treat it like it's loaded!
2. Never point the gun at anything you are not willing to destroy.
3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on target (and you have made the decision to shoot).
4. Be sure of your target and what is beyond it!

Addendum:
a. Keep your guns out of the reach of others, unless under your personal supervision. Retention holsters are a MUST when wearing a gun in public!
b. Idiots, alcohol and firearms. You get one and only one at a time. Otherwise there are ambulance rides.

[Ben]

A couple of interesting articles that may shed some light regarding not following procedures. I found this especially interesting:

Souza said three people were handling the gun for the scene. Armorer Hanna Gutierrez Reed reportedly handled three prop guns left on a cart outside the structure they were shooting in due to coronavirus restrictions. Assistant director Dave Halls handed one of those guns to Baldwin. According to a Santa Fe court, Halls announced that it was a "cold gun" before giving it to the actor, lingo meaning that the firearm was unloaded.

It's not totally clear from the quote, but it appears that because "covid" the gun cart was outside the work area. That barrier could easily cause a lapse in custodial procedures.

The second link points the finger further at the assistant director, who seems to have had some safety incidents in the past.

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/alec-baldwin-accidental-shooting-details-halyna-hutchins-death

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/alec-baldwin-prop-gun-crew-member-safety-complaint

[Ben]

This one has a lot of emotional finger pointing, but the, "gun was also used for target practice" could be damning if true.

https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2021/10/25/robert-davi-adam-baldwin-and-nick-searcy-respond-to-the-latest-news-on-the-alec-baldwin-shooting/

[cordex]

An actual prop guy's take:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TP1X5L-AufQ

Fewer dad jokes than his normal videos.

[MechAg94]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O40-d07A2GE
Mr H mentions they had an inexperienced prop master that had safety issues prior to the shooting and may not have known much about the firearms.  Saying it was a low budget film, people had walked off the set recently, and they may have been cutting corners.  A lot of speculation so far with whatever sources people can dig up.  We will see. 

I also heard typical procedures call for 3 people to check the gun before it is handed to the actor.  Apparently this wasn't done.  Either way, Baldwin is the producer of the movie and he is responsible for the set.  He may not be criminally liable, but financial liability is another matter.

I haven't followed the discussion over the weekend so I may be repeating what someone else said.

[Ben]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O40-d07A2GE
Mr H mentions they had an inexperienced prop master that had safety issues prior to the shooting and may not have known much about the firearms.  Saying it was a low budget film, people had walked off the set recently, and they may have been cutting corners.  A lot of speculation so far with whatever sources people can dig up.  We will see. 

I'm only spouting off based on what I've been reading, much of which seems to be speculation. Speculating though, I think the gun girl might be getting somewhat set up. Right now it's looking to me like the assistant director that called the gun "cold" appears to be a pompous ass - almost comedically like the stereotypical Hollywood person that thinks their *expletive deleted*it don't stink and everybody better do what they say and not look them in the eye or they're fired.

I can easily see him circumventing rules because "I'm the boss". I might have missed it, but I have seen no statements by him as of now, which might be on the advice of his attorney.

[Boomhauer]

So it turns out there had already been several serious incidents of gun safety on the set…at what point do you say “no we can’t continue until this is addressed?”

Even if you don’t believe Baldwin has culpability as an actor he definitely has it as producer to put a stop to stuff until safety issues have been addressed. He has blood on his hands from being the dumb *expletive deleted*ck who pointed a gun at another person and pulled the trigger and from being one of the head guys who should have put a stop to stuff. *expletive deleted*ck him, let him hang but no in Hollywood we don’t believe in any kind of personal responsibility whether it’s raping kids or starlets or literally killing through gross negligence

[TechMan]

John Wick 3, not Bond

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idf6nb6FF74

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Unp4PaMKezY

Looks like she broke the 180 a couple of times in one of those training videos.

[Angel Eyes]

This one has a lot of emotional finger pointing, but the, "gun was also used for target practice" could be damning if true.

https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2021/10/25/robert-davi-adam-baldwin-and-nick-searcy-respond-to-the-latest-news-on-the-alec-baldwin-shooting/

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/gun-fired-alec-baldwin-accidental-death-halyna-hutchins-fired-crew-off-set-fun

The gun, which was fired by Alec Baldwin on the set of the movie "Rust," may have even been loaded with live rounds when it was used for what was essentially target practice, TMZ reported.

Multiple sources connected to the production of the film told TMZ that the gun was fired at off-the-clock gatherings – which could explain how a live round found its way into the gun’s chamber.

Another source who was on set told the outlet that when cops arrived they found live ammo and blank rounds stored in the same area, where the fatal mix-up could have occurred.

Wow.  Just ... wow.

[WLJ]

New version of what we know 100% for sure

1) Something went bang
2) Someone is dead
3) Alec pulled the trigger
4) It was a cluster *expletive deleted*ck

[MechAg94]

The main concrete info I think we found out over the weekend is this was a working pistol, not what we would call a prop gun.  And it was a real cartridge that was fired, not a blank or some other alternative. 

[WLJ]

The main concrete info I think we found out over the weekend is this was a working pistol, not what we would call a prop gun.  And it was a real cartridge that was fired, not a blank or some other alternative.

A lot of people are harping on that but since it was being used as a prop I'm not getting too bent out of shape over the matter.

[Brad Johnson]

What the ever-loving frak??!!

Multiple sources connected to the production of the film told TMZ that the gun was fired at off-the-clock gatherings – which could explain how a live round found its way into the gun’s chamber.

Another source who was on set told the outlet that when cops arrived they found live ammo and blank rounds stored in the same area, where the fatal mix-up could have occurred.

Fail #1: They shouldn't have been using a functional firearm in the first place. There are plenty of letter-perfect replicas available that will only chamber and fire blanks. At the very least, have any real firearms modified by the several competent movie-industry gunsmiths so they function with blank cartridges only. 

Fail #2: If a real firearm was allowed on set, there should have been only two people allowed to handle it... the armorer and the actor during the scene. At all other times it should be locked securely away and access strictly limited to one or two qualified and experienced individuals.

Fail #3: If a functional firearm was being used on set, the gun shouldn't have been loaded with live ammo at all, for any reason, at any time during production.

Fail #4: If the gun really was being used for target practice, the prop master should have cleared it at least three times after use. Once before it went back into the production inventory, second when it was pulled from inventory and readied for a scene, and third when it was assigned to the actor for that scene.

Fail #5: At no time should live rounds be allowed anywhere on the set. For any reason. Ever.

Sounds like this wasn't a simple single point of failure, but rather an entire three-ring circus of it. Absolutely inexcusable.

Brad

[Ron]

A lot of people are harping on that but since it was being used as a prop I'm not getting too bent out of shape over the matter.

What do you call a prop gun that chambers and fires live ammunition?

You call it a GUN

Most people hear "prop gun" on TV and think of something like a starter pistol.

[WLJ]

What do you call a prop gun that chambers and fires ammunition cartridges?

You call it a GUN

True and I agree. Just stated I'm not getting bent out of shape over it.

[WLJ]

Could it be we also have a young inexperienced armorer afraid to say no to Mr. Baldwin?

[Brad Johnson]

Could it be we also have a young inexperienced armorer afraid to say no to Mr. Baldwin?

Absolutely. There are plenty of producers, directors, and actors known for being pushy, demanding prima donnas who expect their orders be carried out Right Effing Now!!, ethics or safety concerns be damned.

Brad

[RoadKingLarry]

Could it be we also have a young inexperienced armorer afraid to say no to Mr. Baldwin?

Got to have some peon to throw under the bus and take the fall.

[230RN]

My natural "paranoia" still thinks two incidents weeks apart of finding real ammo in a "property gun" smacks strongly of a put up job designed by someone to create a "gun incident."

This, even though the guns were used for target practice a few times.

And let's not fixate on the "prop gun" thing. "Property" used in theatrical scenes are called "props."  A "prop gun" does not imply it is necessarily non-functional. 

[RocketMan]

I wonder if what would have been normal safety practices were modified because of covid?  Could covid safety be taking precedence over gun safety?
There was a mention in one story that the guns were kept on a cart outside of the set where the fatal scene was being filmed.  This was supposedly due to covid restrictions, though I can't imagine exactly how that would keep folks from catching the bug.