Author Topic: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....  (Read 130981 times)

MechAg94

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1875 on: October 11, 2022, 03:40:06 PM »
Is Putin crazy enough to use a "tactical" nuke on the Ukraine?  I believe he is.  Is he crazy enough to start WW3 ?  I'm not sure but I don't believe so.  What I think may be more likely is that, if he DOES nuke the Ukraine, the ChiComs make seize that opportunity to make their move on Taiwan.  They may not use nukes but with their assets compared to Taiwan's, it won't be much of a fight.  If the U.S. were to get involved in that fight, the ChiComs may lob a couple of tacticals our way to "warn us off".
Taiwan has a lot of their own weapons for defense.  A lot depends on if they will fight effectively.  Won't be easy for them or China. 

I heard China was looking at using civilian ferry ships to bring in troops.  I would think those ships would be pretty vulnerable. 
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sumpnz

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1876 on: October 11, 2022, 03:42:25 PM »
Is Putin crazy enough to use a "tactical" nuke on the Ukraine?  I believe he is.  Is he crazy enough to start WW3 ?  I'm not sure but I don't believe so.  What I think may be more likely is that, if he DOES nuke the Ukraine, the ChiComs make seize that opportunity to make their move on Taiwan.  They may not use nukes but with their assets compared to Taiwan's, it won't be much of a fight.  If the U.S. were to get involved in that fight, the ChiComs may lob a couple of tacticals our way to "warn us off".

2-3 destroyers (plus some support vessels) or just attack subs in the Andaman/Java/Banda Sea region will cut China off from 70% of their oil requirements overnight.  They wouldn’t be able to sustain anything, let alone an invasion force for more than a couple weeks if we go that route.  Within a couple months they’d have famine setting in.

MechAg94

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1877 on: October 11, 2022, 08:02:24 PM »
More than half of Ukraine’s tank fleet now reportedly consists of captured Russian armor
https://taskandpurpose.com/news/ukraine-captures-russian-tanks-fleet-size/?utm_term=Task%26Purpose_Today_10.11.22&utm_campaign=Task%20%26%20Purpose_TPToday_Actives_Dynamic&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email

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The British Ministry of Defense reported in an intelligence update on Friday that Ukrainian troops had likely captured “at least” 440 Russian tanks and an additional 650 armored vehicles, adding that “over half of Ukraine’s currently fielded tank fleet potentially consists of captured vehicles.”

Those tank capture numbers line up with estimates from the open-source research group Oryx, which suggests based on visual evidence that Ukrainian forces have likely captured some 457 tanks since the beginning of the Russian invasion in February.

“Re-purposed captured Russian equipment now makes up a large proportion of Ukraine’s military hardware,” the MoD said. “The failure of Russian crews to destroy intact equipment before withdrawing or surrendering highlights their poor state of training and low levels of battle discipline.”
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Blakenzy

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1878 on: October 12, 2022, 07:47:58 AM »
Considering this Russia has already been soundly defeated. Perhaps de-escalation and negotiations are in order post-haste?
https://www.unz.com/mwhitney/the-crisis-in-ukraine-is-not-about-ukraine-its-about-germany/
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Angel Eyes

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1879 on: October 12, 2022, 11:36:06 AM »
https://www.unz.com/mwhitney/the-crisis-in-ukraine-is-not-about-ukraine-its-about-germany/

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What’s left unsaid is that Russia has not invaded any country since the dissolution of the Soviet Union,

Author conveniently forgets about Georgia.
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Pb

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1880 on: October 12, 2022, 11:44:13 AM »
I haven't read the article (yet) but UNZ is bug%^& nuts in general.

It is a screeching Jew-hating website owned by a Jew, oddly enough.

WLJ

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1881 on: October 12, 2022, 11:47:15 AM »
Author conveniently forgets about Georgia.

And it can be argued Chechen Republic of Ichkeria. Of course that whole thing is a flipping mess to wrap your brain around.
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Angel Eyes

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1882 on: October 12, 2022, 12:10:04 PM »
And it can be argued Chechen Republic of Ichkeria. Of course that whole thing is a flipping mess to wrap your brain around.

Putin also committed paratroopers to Kazakhstan earlier this year.  Since this was at the request of their president, I suppose it's not technically an invasion.
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dogmush

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1883 on: October 12, 2022, 12:48:30 PM »
Syria as well.  Invited in by Assad, but definitely has boots on ground.

WLJ

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1884 on: October 12, 2022, 01:25:05 PM »
Putin is green

Politico Europe congratulates Vladimir Putin for ‘[doing] more than almost any other single human being to speed up the end of the fossil fuel era’
https://twitchy.com/sarahd-313035/2022/10/12/politico-europe-congratulates-vladimir-putin-for-doing-more-than-almost-any-other-single-human-being-to-speed-up-the-end-of-the-fossil-fuel-era/
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Angel Eyes

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1885 on: October 12, 2022, 02:26:03 PM »
Putin is green

Politico Europe congratulates Vladimir Putin for ‘[doing] more than almost any other single human being to speed up the end of the fossil fuel era’
https://twitchy.com/sarahd-313035/2022/10/12/politico-europe-congratulates-vladimir-putin-for-doing-more-than-almost-any-other-single-human-being-to-speed-up-the-end-of-the-fossil-fuel-era/

Hmm ... not The Babylon Bee ...
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MechAg94

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1886 on: October 12, 2022, 04:01:58 PM »
Syria as well.  Invited in by Assad, but definitely has boots on ground.
Tehnically, you could count the previous invasion of the Ukraine in the Crimean peninsula.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

MechAg94

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1887 on: October 12, 2022, 08:25:05 PM »
Considering this Russia has already been soundly defeated. Perhaps de-escalation and negotiations are in order post-haste?
https://www.unz.com/mwhitney/the-crisis-in-ukraine-is-not-about-ukraine-its-about-germany/
Reinforces my opinion that the better response would be to encourage or help bring other natural gas sources into Europe to reduce the dependency and/or importance of Russian gas.  Tying this into US elites trying to maintain control isn't such a far fetched idea.  Might explain some of the odd actions.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Blakenzy

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1888 on: October 13, 2022, 01:01:19 PM »
So OPEC went and cut oil production which will cause energy prices to rise and cause damage supposedly. Even after Biden had gone and asked them pretty please to do the opposite. Does this mean that they are signaling that they are siding with Russia as an energy producing entity in response to the Biden administration's moves to influence energy supply?

So we now have a Ukraine-Russia-EU-NATO-USA-OPEC kerfuffle. Doesn't that kinda officially make this a world war? Are we looking at a strike to the petrodollar?

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/10/05/energy/opec-production-cuts/index.html (cnn link for illustrative purposes only)
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Ben

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1889 on: October 15, 2022, 07:05:30 PM »
Sweden will not participate in a joint investigation of the Nord Stream leaks. They are keeping their evidence to themselves, apparently for national security concerns.

Premium article, but here's the gist:

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Sweden has opted out of a proposal to set up a formal joint investigation team with Denmark and Germany to investigate the recent leaks of the Russian-owned pipelines Nord Stream 1 and 2.

Mats Ljungqvist, the Swedish prosecutor involved in the country’s criminal investigation of the leaks in the Swedish economic zone, told Reuters that the country would not join a Joint Investigation Team from the judicial co-operation agency Eurojust.

According to Eurojust, a Joint Investigation Team is “one of the most advanced tools used in international cooperation in criminal matters, comprising a legal agreement between competent authorities of two or more States for the purpose of carrying out criminal investigations.” Such teams are established for a fixed period that’s typically 12–24 months.

Doing so would mean that Sweden would have to share information from its own probe into the Nord Stream leaks that it has withheld saying the information is confidential. Ljungqvist told Reuters that the information subject to confidentiality is “directly linked to national security.”

https://www.theepochtimes.com/sweden-opts-out-of-joint-probe-into-nord-stream-leak-refuses-to-share-findings-citing-national-security_4798122.html
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dogmush

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1890 on: October 15, 2022, 09:50:05 PM »
I wonder if they have a version of SOSUS that they don't want to share it's capabilities.

HankB

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1891 on: October 15, 2022, 10:33:02 PM »
I wonder if they have a version of SOSUS that they don't want to share it's capabilities.
Or they just got an answer they weren't expecting which would complicate international relations. Sort of like the USA keeping a lid on Russian pilots flying MiGs against the USA during the Korean war.
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WLJ

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1892 on: October 16, 2022, 08:56:47 AM »
Meanwhile on the Russian side of the border
Trouble among the troops

Death toll in 'terrorist' shooting at Russian military base near Ukraine border rises to 22, reports claim: Two gunmen 'from Tajikistan' opened fire 'in row over religion' as local governor says no civilians were killed in massacre
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11320743/Death-toll-terrorist-shooting-Russian-military-base-near-Ukraine-border-rises-22.html
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HankB

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1893 on: October 16, 2022, 09:58:33 AM »
Meanwhile on the Russian side of the border
Trouble among the troops

Death toll in 'terrorist' shooting at Russian military base near Ukraine border rises to 22, reports claim: Two gunmen 'from Tajikistan' opened fire 'in row over religion' as local governor says no civilians were killed in massacre
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11320743/Death-toll-terrorist-shooting-Russian-military-base-near-Ukraine-border-rises-22.html
Exactly what you'd expect if you're conscripting people as cannon fodder, feeding them with little or no training into a meat grinder they're not expected to survive. They probably figure "We're dead if we obey orders, so I may as well take some of the people responsible with me. If I get a few zampolits before they get me, so much the better."

Let's hope this spreads.  =D
Trump won in 2016. Democrats haven't been so offended since Republicans came along and freed their slaves.
Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it. - Mark Twain
Government is a broker in pillage, and every election is a sort of advance auction in stolen goods. - H.L. Mencken
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain

Ben

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1894 on: October 17, 2022, 10:48:58 AM »
So Musk was going to stop providing free Starlink to Ukraine, as he wanted our/their govs to start picking up the cost, which they didn't do. He's going to keep providing it for free, but he kinda has a point here:

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Elon Musk
@elonmusk
The hell with it … even though Starlink is still losing money & other companies are getting billions of taxpayer $, we’ll just keep funding Ukraine govt for free

Every time I turn around, the US gov has thrown another billion dollars at Ukraine, seemingly weekly. Our gov has paid tons of dough to our defense contractors for stuff like switchblades, just like they pay tons of incentives to all the electric car makers except for Tesla. You have to give Musk credit for continuing on, even though the establishment stuck a "kick me" sign on his back.
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Blakenzy

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1895 on: October 17, 2022, 11:26:49 AM »
It's funny how they can do war with out declaring war.
"Knowledge will forever govern ignorance, and a people who mean to be their own governors, must arm themselves with the power knowledge gives. A popular government without popular information or the means of acquiring it, is but a prologue to a farce or a tragedy or perhaps both"

Angel Eyes

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1896 on: October 17, 2022, 12:08:15 PM »
It's funny how they can do war with out declaring war.

That goes back to at least 1950.
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Ron

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1897 on: October 17, 2022, 06:01:31 PM »
https://www.newsweek.com/neocons-woke-left-are-joining-hands-leading-us-woke-war-iii-opinion-1748947
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Warping the debate in this way allows delusional and contradictory thinking to go unchallenged. Thus, we get the argument that Putin is a madman who will kill indiscriminately to achieve his aims—but he is also somehow definitely bluffing about using nuclear weapons. And he's only using that bluff because he's losing the war—but if he's not stopped in Ukraine, he will go on to conquer the rest of Europe. Putin's regime must fall because he has killed or jailed all the liberal reformers and yoked himself to a hardline Far Right, but somehow he will be replaced by a liberal reformer when his regime collapses.

It's nonsensical, and a real debate would expose some of the delusions in this thinking. But we aren't allowed to have one.

I can hardly believe this opinion piece was in Newsweek!
For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse. Because knowing God, they didn’t glorify him as God, and didn’t give thanks, but became vain in their reasoning, and their senseless heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.

Angel Eyes

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Blakenzy

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #1899 on: October 18, 2022, 06:42:26 AM »
Attacking (recognized) Russian territory may give some tactical gains but in the end will probably just give Putin more strategic options. Like being able to declare war with no internal political opposition and full mobilization with a more motivated population.

What the hell is anyone trying to accomplish over there anyway ;/
"Knowledge will forever govern ignorance, and a people who mean to be their own governors, must arm themselves with the power knowledge gives. A popular government without popular information or the means of acquiring it, is but a prologue to a farce or a tragedy or perhaps both"