Author Topic: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?  (Read 1968 times)

SAK

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In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« on: February 05, 2023, 10:43:25 PM »
Well, I am curious what people think about this country and freedom and personal responsibility (and collective/community responsibility).

Are we going backwards towards worsening despotism?

Are we going forwards towards constitutional governance?

How fast?

On one hand we have broached something very close to martial law with "COVID 19 lockdowns."  We have a deep state pulling off crimes and censorship, likely to include the crime of rigging elections.  We have a gulag holding political prisoners in DC after police mercilessly attacked crowds of unarmed people...killing at least 2 but likely more.  Cities were set ablaze continually and allowed to burn.  Criminals were purposely released while political adversaries were put into prison.  We no longer have a border, and have socialism and taxation draining the life and choices from the citizens of this country.  I could keep going, but you all weren't born yesterday so you have seen it all these past few years.

On the other hand, we have a huge group of great individuals doing 1st and 2nd amendment "audits" and winning the PR game and winning in court.  Policing has been continually improving as far as the rights of citizens to be unmolested and detained, and subject to wanton violence under the color of law.  Obviously it still happens, but policing and the rights of citizens is improving.  Major victories in 2nd Amendment court rulings and overturning prohibitions against ownership and carry.  This appears it will continue and a major cascade effect will change gun laws nationwide.  This can open the door to actually having militia - as is an implied duty in the 2nd Amendment.  It's fun to just talk about rights, but with rights come a duty.  How many of us have taken steps to form and practice in militias, thereby living up to this duty?  The Internet and alternative media are going gangbusters with independent journalism.  Information is easily accessible, though sometimes difficult to sift through.  Bitcoin has opened up instant transfers that can be pseudo-anonymous, can't be frozen, confiscated, held, reversed, etc.  It is like digital gold but even better since we know how much exists.  The number of guns and amount of ammo in private hands keeps rising each day.

RoadKingLarry

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2023, 10:47:16 PM »
Why is it so hot and why are we all in this hand basket?
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

Nick1911

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2023, 11:05:07 PM »
I think there is a fair bit of evidence that suggests the US is trending in a negative direction.  That said, I'm a bit predisposed to negativity around our political, cultural and economic situation.

RoadKingLarry

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2023, 11:33:36 PM »
Hard times create strong men
Strong men create good times
Good times create weak men
Weak men create hard times  <----we are about here.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

French G.

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2023, 05:32:00 AM »
Move to the country, have kids, raise your own food, enjoy life, find jesus on your own... etc.

Yeah we are probably in a handbasket. So what? On this board, right wing talk radio or wherever I have to tune out the doomer talk. What good is your whining doomers? Either make your little sliver of America look like you think America ought to look or just shut up.
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I'm so contrarian that I didn't respond to the thread.

Ron

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2023, 06:39:29 AM »
We're already at the end stage of a terminal decline. As a lifelong hardcore political junkie it's been very hard for me to come to terms with the realization the system of lies and perversion is not redeemable. On the other hand coming to terms with that reality has freed me from the perpetual outrage. I no longer parse the lies of the powerful movers and shakers of the world. If it can be demonstrated they have lied previously, I now reject whatever they say out of hand. I neither have the time, inclination or resources to unpack the shipping the containers full of lies we're flooded with. As I've applied that standard over the last two years I've been left with no political or media "home" lol.

Doomer talk? Yes, if you believe the system is redeemable. Otherwise it's just an accurate description of where we're at at this point of time. The system is doomed but I'm not.

The best advice one could offer is what French said above. Now I have more time and energy to invest in making my little circle of influence in the world a little better.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2023, 08:34:18 PM by Ron »
For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse. Because knowing God, they didn’t glorify him as God, and didn’t give thanks, but became vain in their reasoning, and their senseless heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.

MechAg94

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2023, 09:58:44 AM »
I have to agree.  Don't worry about what you cannot control.  Work on your personal sphere.  If you must get involved in politics, work on improving things locally.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Nick1911

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2023, 10:23:47 AM »
Agree with others - create your own island of tranquility and competence.  Isolate and buffer what you can.

MechAg94

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2023, 11:01:17 AM »
Hard times create strong men
Strong men create good times
Good times create weak men
Weak men create hard times  <----we are about here.

What I think is forgotten or needs to be clear to folks is that last step might last decades or generations and hard times might range from a depression to full on collapse. 
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Ben

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2023, 11:03:28 AM »
Agree with others - create your own island of tranquility and competence.  Isolate and buffer what you can.

I also agree. While my rationalization for having done so now is that "I'm too old for this *expletive deleted*it", the way things are going, I think I would make the same choice if I were 20 years younger.

"Stay under the radar" is a legitimate response nowadays.
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Pb

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2023, 11:04:13 AM »
Bruen is great.  It is also going to be reversed when the Democrats replace some supreme court justices, which inevitable.

Immigration, both legal and illegal are pushing the USA in a leftwords direction.

The elites have also become viciously hostile to conservatism, white people, and Christian values.

The USA is moving in the direction of the Roman empire, with perversion, killing children, financial insanity and debasement of the currency being the norm.

Oh look, the Grammys just had a Satanic performance.    ;/

https://notthebee.com/article/yo-pastors-who-said-it-was-unloving-to-warn-the-culture-about-hell-stare-directly-at-this

Perd Hapley

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2023, 02:08:24 PM »
Red states are getting redder, and blue states are getting blue-er. That gets lost, as we tend to think of politics, and social trends, as being national or international. We forget (or don’t see) the trends at the state level. The question is whether the red-staters across the country can keep the blue regime in Washington from extending their hegemony to the local level, and forcing red states to fall in line.

On gun laws, most states have gotten less restrictive on firearms. Half of US states no longer have a general prohibition on concealed carry. Meanwhile, the other half of the country is banning “assault weapons” and magazines, gun kits, etc, while they keep trying to keep Bruen out of their carry ban schemes.

The same seems to be happening on the abortion issue. Many red states have enacted partial or complete bans, while some blue states are shoring up their pro-abortion positions in various ways. This has yet to really get underway, though. I expect the differences between red and blue states to grow, on that subject.

I’m sure we could find other examples of red-blue divergence on areas of law I know less about. And other examples of the red or blue persuasion prevailing across the 50 states. Possibly marijuana legalization in red states is an example of the latter.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2023, 02:35:24 PM »
Agree with others - create your own island of tranquility and competence.  Isolate and buffer what you can.


I agree that for some of us that’s going to be the only workable response, depending on our circumstances. I still think someone needs to point out that if that’s all we have, it’s a losing proposition.

Maybe that's the reason why it's so important for unHolywood to put rainbow-colored transvestites in every TV show, and slag us all with non-stop messages about race and climate, etc. They want us to think we’re outnumbered and outgunned, and all we can do is hide from the world. Don’t get involved at the local level or the state level or the national level. Don’t start a business, or an advocacy group, or a social media campaign, or a charter school. They would undoubtedly prefer we all stick with the defensive posture, instead of rebuilding.
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French G.

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2023, 02:53:55 PM »

I agree that for some of us that’s going to be the only workable response, depending on our circumstances. I still think someone needs to point out that if that’s all we have, it’s a losing proposition.

Maybe that's the reason why it's so important for unHolywood to put rainbow-colored transvestites in every TV show, and slag us all with non-stop messages about race and climate, etc. They want us to think we’re outnumbered and outgunned, and all we can do is hide from the world. Don’t get involved at the local level or the state level or the national level. Don’t start a business, or an advocacy group, or a social media campaign, or a charter school. They would undoubtedly prefer we all stick with the defensive posture, instead of rebuilding.

I see the problem here. I left out the first part of the folk song. Blow up your TV, move to the country....

I had cable for almost a year around 2008. Apart from that, not since 1999. I usually have a TV for dvds but I moved it early covid for a project and it hasn’t been plugged in since. I get enough doom from the hour or so online a day. Stop importing the mind control feed. Sportsball can’t be woke if no one cares to watch.
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I'm so contrarian that I didn't respond to the thread.

Ben

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2023, 03:08:15 PM »

I agree that for some of us that’s going to be the only workable response, depending on our circumstances. I still think someone needs to point out that if that’s all we have, it’s a losing proposition.

Maybe that's the reason why it's so important for unHolywood to put rainbow-colored transvestites in every TV show, and slag us all with non-stop messages about race and climate, etc. They want us to think we’re outnumbered and outgunned, and all we can do is hide from the world. Don’t get involved at the local level or the state level or the national level. Don’t start a business, or an advocacy group, or a social media campaign, or a charter school. They would undoubtedly prefer we all stick with the defensive posture, instead of rebuilding.

These are good points.

I, or someone, could argue that I simply gave up and fled California. I (or someone) could also argue that I made a tactical retreat to more defensible ground. While I still like to use my "under the radar" mantra, that doesn't mean I don't vote here or otherwise try and participate in freedom oriented activities. In fact I write my representatives, both state and federal,  a lot more here than I ever did in CA, because I don't feel like my issues will simply be ignored.

Of course 30% of the population here in Idaho feels as ignored and helpless as I did when I was in California.
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

Perd Hapley

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2023, 03:20:04 PM »
These are good points.

I, or someone, could argue that I simply gave up and fled California. I (or someone) could also argue that I made a tactical retreat to more defensible ground. While I still like to use my "under the radar" mantra, that doesn't mean I don't vote here or otherwise try and participate in freedom oriented activities. In fact I write my representatives, both state and federal,  a lot more here than I ever did in CA, because I don't feel like my issues will simply be ignored.

Of course 30% of the population here in Idaho feels as ignored and helpless as I did when I was in California.

And again, there's no one answer that fits everyone. What I always think about in connection with this are the Christians that tell other Christians they have to keep their kids in public school, because it's a mission field. Which might be a good outlook if your kid is David Livingstone, but it sure won't be the right answer for everybody.
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MechAg94

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2023, 04:15:39 PM »
And again, there's no one answer that fits everyone. What I always think about in connection with this are the Christians that tell other Christians they have to keep their kids in public school, because it's a mission field. Which might be a good outlook if your kid is David Livingstone, but it sure won't be the right answer for everybody.
It is asking a lot put that on your kids.  Especially when the school spends more time with your kids on weekdays than you do. 
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

MechAg94

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2023, 04:19:44 PM »
I see the problem here. I left out the first part of the folk song. Blow up your TV, move to the country....

I had cable for almost a year around 2008. Apart from that, not since 1999. I usually have a TV for dvds but I moved it early covid for a project and it hasn’t been plugged in since. I get enough doom from the hour or so online a day. Stop importing the mind control feed. Sportsball can’t be woke if no one cares to watch.

Good point.  I guess it doesn't work well for everyone, but one factor is not funding the decline of our country with your money.  There are limits to that considering how many big corporations are involved in this stuff or owned by a bigger corporations.  Just something to keep in mind. 
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Nick1911

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #18 on: February 06, 2023, 06:13:46 PM »

I agree that for some of us that’s going to be the only workable response, depending on our circumstances. I still think someone needs to point out that if that’s all we have, it’s a losing proposition.

Maybe that's the reason why it's so important for unHolywood to put rainbow-colored transvestites in every TV show, and slag us all with non-stop messages about race and climate, etc. They want us to think we’re outnumbered and outgunned, and all we can do is hide from the world. Don’t get involved at the local level or the state level or the national level. Don’t start a business, or an advocacy group, or a social media campaign, or a charter school. They would undoubtedly prefer we all stick with the defensive posture, instead of rebuilding.

I admire your optimism, and wish I could share it. 

To your point though - I don't fund Hollywood or media.

Boomhauer

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2023, 06:20:59 PM »
None of us can really effect it so it’s not worth fretting so much over it.

I used to stress heavily but when I realized my vote doesn’t matter worth a damn and the political creatures in Washington are going to do what they are going to do no matter what we do I stopped caring. 2020 was sure proof that our wishes, desires and votes mattered not a bit on the national scale.

I simply adapt and overcome to my local conditions and events that affect me. I work my job, to home to my wife and dogs, enjoy my hobbies, and spend time with my family when I can. *expletive deleted*ck the rest of the world let it burn.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #20 on: February 06, 2023, 09:43:10 PM »
I admire your optimism, and wish I could share it. 

To your point though - I don't fund Hollywood or media.

I'm not talking optimism, or about funding media.

I'm saying despair is what we're being programmed for. Don't go along with it. That doesn't make you an optimist. It just means, if we're being part of the problem by letting the sickos take over, while we check out; we should own up to it, and at least admit we're wrong. And quit bragging about how black-pilled we are, and quit promoting that viewpoint to others. Let's quit discouraging other people, who could make a difference.


None of us can really effect it so it’s not worth fretting so much over it.

I used to stress heavily but when I realized my vote doesn’t matter worth a damn and the political creatures in Washington are going to do what they are going to do no matter what we do I stopped caring. 2020 was sure proof that our wishes, desires and votes mattered not a bit on the national scale.

I simply adapt and overcome to my local conditions and events that affect me. I work my job, to home to my wife and dogs, enjoy my hobbies, and spend time with my family when I can. *expletive deleted*ck the rest of the world let it burn.

That's what the Right has been doing for a long time, and it's just what the sickos want us to do. Do something else.

It's good to take responsibility for what's directly under your control, but that's small stuff. If we don't take responsibility for our whole country (talking to myself here), we're just going along with the anti-American program.
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JTHunter

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #21 on: February 06, 2023, 10:16:18 PM »
Hard times create strong men
Strong men create good times
Good times create weak men
Weak men create hard times  <----we are about here.

This is a clip from a thread I started in The Roundtable that goes along with what you said here.

From Bondage to spiritual faith;
From spiritual faith to great courage;
From courage to liberty;
From liberty to abundance;
From abundance to complacency;
From complacency to apathy;
From apathy to dependence;
From dependence back into bondage.”
“I have little patience with people who take the Bill of Rights for granted.  The Bill of Rights, contained in the first ten amendments to the Constitution, is every American’s guarantee of freedom.” - - President Harry S. Truman, “Years of Trial and Hope”

Pb

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #22 on: February 06, 2023, 10:27:20 PM »
Short term doom aside, I will say that I believe that over the long term, the pendulum will swing back in a more conservative direction, due to the differential reproduction- conservatives and the religious have more children than leftists and seculars.

Being a religious conservative increases evolutionary fitness.

There is a theory that this is why Christianity took over the western world... Pagans practiced lots of birth control, abortion, infanticide, homosexuality and lost interest in getting married and having children at rates sufficient to sustain themselves.  Christians had lots of children, which they reared instead of killing, and adopted abandoned infants which they raised as children.  Christians outbred pagans, rather than converted them.  I know that low roman birthrates were a major worry of some of the Roman emperors.

Traditional religions generally enforce morality that increases successful reproduction by encouraging marriage, childrearing, marital fidelity, and heterosexual sex.

Unfortunately, this is going to take generations to come to pass.  In the future, North America may be occupied primarily by the Amish, Hutterites, fundamatalist LDS and trad Catholics among others.  If  you want to see a SJW you will need to go to the zoo... and look for them in a cage next to the chimps.

Imagine the little Amish kids throwing peanuts through the bars for the gibbering feminists...

zahc

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #23 on: February 06, 2023, 10:40:27 PM »
Red states are getting redder, and blue states are getting blue-er. That gets lost, as we tend to think of politics, and social trends, as being national or international. We forget (or don’t see) the trends at the state level. The question is whether the red-staters across the country can keep the blue regime in Washington from extending their hegemony to the local level, and forcing red states to fall in line.

On gun laws, most states have gotten less restrictive on firearms. Half of US states no longer have a general prohibition on concealed carry. Meanwhile, the other half of the country is banning “assault weapons” and magazines, gun kits, etc, while they keep trying to keep Bruen out of their carry ban schemes.

The same seems to be happening on the abortion issue. Many red states have enacted partial or complete bans, while some blue states are shoring up their pro-abortion positions in various ways. This has yet to really get underway, though. I expect the differences between red and blue states to grow, on that subject.

I’m sure we could find other examples of red-blue divergence on areas of law I know less about. And other examples of the red or blue persuasion prevailing across the 50 states. Possibly marijuana legalization in red states is an example of the latter.

They are not diverging in all ways, more like orbiting or precessing as the definitions of what is red and blue generationally change. One example I can think of is green energy and public transport. "Red" states like Texas are becoming world leaders in green energy, with more wind energy than most countries and surpassing California in grid scale solar. And the most encouraging gains in passenger rail are coming from Florida right now. Meanwhile the left have decided to take up the torch from the religious right and become the new moral busybodies, as well as decided it's cool to be pro-megacorp now. The previous generation of people who wanted things to be made in America because of American jobs have been replaced by people who want things to be made in America because they think it's better for the planet. Neither red nor blue looks very much like what it did a generation ago, and the new generation will just grow up in a world where democrat presidents bust rail strikes, democrats cities are full of racist moral busybodies, etc. and the only question is how strongly allegiances will follow policy vs. Geographical/historical inertia.
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fifth_column

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Re: In which direction are we headed? At what rate?
« Reply #24 on: February 07, 2023, 08:40:43 AM »
Short term doom aside, I will say that I believe that over the long term, the pendulum will swing back in a more conservative direction, due to the differential reproduction- conservatives and the religious have more children than leftists and seculars.

Being a religious conservative increases evolutionary fitness.

There is a theory that this is why Christianity took over the western world... Pagans practiced lots of birth control, abortion, infanticide, homosexuality and lost interest in getting married and having children at rates sufficient to sustain themselves.  Christians had lots of children, which they reared instead of killing, and adopted abandoned infants which they raised as children.  Christians outbred pagans, rather than converted them.  I know that low roman birthrates were a major worry of some of the Roman emperors.

Traditional religions generally enforce morality that increases successful reproduction by encouraging marriage, childrearing, marital fidelity, and heterosexual sex.

Unfortunately, this is going to take generations to come to pass.  In the future, North America may be occupied primarily by the Amish, Hutterites, fundamatalist LDS and trad Catholics among others.  If  you want to see a SJW you will need to go to the zoo... and look for them in a cage next to the chimps.

Imagine the little Amish kids throwing peanuts through the bars for the gibbering feminists...

Very good points. I would add muslim to your list of future occupiers.
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