Interesting video on electrical outlet orientation...

[K Frame]

I've always wondered about this because I've heard people over the years say "that's upside down" or "that's not installed to code."

I know in my house my outlets are installed ground down, but here in my office, they're installed ground up.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNj75gJVxcE

[zahc]

It seems most appliances with 90 degree plugs, and things like my Netgear WiFi boosters, are universally designed with the ground down. So in a residential context I think you should put the ground downward.

[230RN]

Did not watch the whole 18 friggin minutes.

Mine are all ground down, as well as the recharging outlets for electric carts in every store I've been in.

I would personally prefer they were gound up for two reasons.  It's easier to orient the plug with the ground pin visible as you manipulate it, and if the plug isn't in all the way, a conductor falling on it won't form a short circuit on the "live" terminals. 

I only noticed this recently because of a mix of circumstances in one outlet I have.  Didn't short out because I caught the danger in time, but now I keep an eye on things like that,

I suppose you could say it's "paranoid" (a cheapassed term for anything you don't like), but no less paranoid than the "dictum" that with switches, down must be off.  This, on the theory (I was told) that something falling on the switch would turn it off, rather than turn something on unexpectedly.

I was designing a house for myself in Boulder, and one of my requirements was that outlets had to be about four feet up from the floor.  Didn't get that far with it, but I notice there's a doohicky on the market now which brings floor outlets up to more or less tabletop level.

Sumbinch.  How about that?

Sorry, but I ain't watchin' no 18 friggen minute video for something that can be covered  in about three minutes.

Terry, 230RN

[MechAg94]

Sorry, but I ain't watchin' no 18 friggen minute video for something that can be covered  in about three minutes.

Terry, 230RN

I think there is some sort of thing with Youtube that videos need to be over 10 minutes.  I have noticed plenty of videos before where a 30 second comment is milked for several minutes of pointless background before getting to the point. 

My youtube feed at work was recommending videos on Voyager that had eye catching titles.  If you tried to watch them, you get 30 minutes or more of the history of it and then the attention grabber title is never even addressed.  Most of the video seems to be rehashed History Channel style content. 

[K Frame]

"Sorry, but I ain't watchin' no 18 friggen minute video for something that can be covered  in about three minutes."

And yet, you spent 20 minutes typing out that screed?




There's a LOT of background discussion and information not directly relating to the Up/Down orientation question. Actually, some surprisingly good information.



But, there's one thing I'm discovering from this guy's other videos...

He's banging the drum REALLY REALLY REALLY hard for the ELECTRIFY EVERYTHING, YOU STUPID BASTARDS!

[230RN]

Three words:  Bait, and, and switch.

I've noticed the same thing with a lot of clicky articles myself.  A petty violation of Commandment 09 (depending on source), but is a telling symptom of overall ethical code.

[K Frame]

No. Not bait and switch.

FFS... 

The additional information supports the discussion of the up/down orientation, but again, isn't directly related to the primary question that starts the discussion.

It's not a question of well, "we started on this topic, I'm bored, *expletive deleted*ck you, I'm going to talk about something completely unrelated now, and again, *expletive deleted*ck you, it's my Utoob channel."

[cordex]

Kids these days have such short attention spans.

[Ben]

Perfect example of the internet rewiring our brains. Terry is older than dirt and comes from a time before the Internet when stuff like this 18 minute video might have been on the TV as an hour long show, and we never thought anything of spending that hour watching. Now, 18 minutes means you're losing time in which you could watch six 3 minute "executive summary" style videos on six different subjects.

We're definitely in a time of "learning via headlines". 

[Hawkmoon]

Ground up didn't "supposedly" start in hospitals. It did begin in hospitals.

50-something years ago an engineer I knew built his own house. He mentioned once that the town building inspector made him reverse all the outlets in the house to the ground-up orientation. This is not something new yet, except for health care wiring, the NEC doesn't require it.

[cordex]

Perfect example of the internet rewiring our brains. Terry is older than dirt and comes from a time before the Internet when stuff like this 18 minute video might have been on the TV as an hour long show, and we never thought anything of spending that hour watching. Now, 18 minutes means you're losing time in which you could watch six 3 minute "executive summary" style videos on six different subjects.

We're definitely in a time of "learning via headlines".

Counterpoint:
Media like broadcast TV and radio are so freaking expensive that everything used to be soundbites and headlines.  You'd have panel shows where every panelist might get to have a couple of minutes of total talk time, and expect to convey all the necessary information in that time period.  And now a word from our sponsor. 

Now media is so cheap it is the next thing to free.  To be fair, there's a lot of useless garbage out there, and also lots of people making mind numbing numbers of 30 second videos.  Even so, there's also a market for, and a massive quantity of long-form, deep exploration of subjects available - much of it free for the taking.  Some of it the kind of miseducation that you used to have to pay major universities to get.

Sometimes people don't just want a simple question answered in the shortest possible timeframe, they want to know the history, and why, and some alternatives, and outliers, etc.  Other times we are like Terry and just want our question answered, get a hit of dopamine, and move on.

Some people have become so used to the quick hits either because they grew up with watching the strobing kaleidoscope of content that was broadcast TV or because they're hooked on the strobing kaleidoscope of short-form content that is available on the internet that they can't tolerate "wasting" their time learning more than the bare essentials.

[230RN]

Kids these days have such short attention spans.

As one of those short attention span kids seniors, I wonder where the like button is for that post.



Terry, 230RN

[230RN]

Perfect example of the internet rewiring our brains. Terry is older than dirt and comes from a time before the Internet when stuff like this 18 minute video might have been on the TV as an hour long show, and we never thought anything of spending that hour watching. Now, 18 minutes means you're losing time in which you could watch six 3 minute "executive summary" style videos on six different subjects.

We're definitely in a time of "learning via headlines". 

Actually, in my observation, it's quite the opposite with TV shows... they used to be written within a half-hour format.  Now they seem to take a blech little plot and blow it up into an hour with all kinds of folderol to inflate the running time.  One exception to this, I've noticed, is car chases.  They were always good then and they're always good now and aren't just time sinks... like a couple staring into each others' eyes for thirty seconds of screen time... with largo music.

I cite car chases in "Highway Patrol" (old) and the famous car chase in "The Pink Panther" (new-ish) as enjoyable time user-uppers.

[Brad Johnson]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNj75gJVxcE

Technology Connections is always a fun watch. Decently informative with good backgrounding. SWMBO even likes it because it explains things in ways she can understand. The guy has enough snark and sarcasm he'd fit right in here on the 'PS.

Some people have become so used to the quick hits either because they grew up with watching the strobing kaleidoscope of content that was broadcast TV or because they're hooked on the strobing kaleidoscope of short-form content that is available on the internet that they can't tolerate "wasting" their time learning more than the bare essentials.

Do you want BlipVerts? Because that's how you get BlipVerts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekg45ub8bsk

Brad

[MechAg94]

Counterpoint:
Media like broadcast TV and radio are so freaking expensive that everything used to be soundbites and headlines.  You'd have panel shows where every panelist might get to have a couple of minutes of total talk time, and expect to convey all the necessary information in that time period.  And now a word from our sponsor. 

Now media is so cheap it is the next thing to free.  To be fair, there's a lot of useless garbage out there, and also lots of people making mind numbing numbers of 30 second videos.  Even so, there's also a market for, and a massive quantity of long-form, deep exploration of subjects available - much of it free for the taking.  Some of it the kind of miseducation that you used to have to pay major universities to get.

Sometimes people don't just want a simple question answered in the shortest possible timeframe, they want to know the history, and why, and some alternatives, and outliers, etc.  Other times we are like Terry and just want our question answered, get a hit of dopamine, and move on.

Some people have become so used to the quick hits either because they grew up with watching the strobing kaleidoscope of content that was broadcast TV or because they're hooked on the strobing kaleidoscope of short-form content that is available on the internet that they can't tolerate "wasting" their time learning more than the bare essentials.

I didn't think the video above fit what I was talking about.  For the few minutes I listened, it seemed related.

An example I can think of is a channel that keeps getting recommended with vidoes about old TV shows.  Video titles like "What happened to this show when she found out about XX".  It has 10 minutes just talking in general about the show before about 10 seconds finally mentioning what the title said.  It wasn't a bad video, but if you were expecting to just hear the answer to the title question, you would be disappointed.  There are plenty of click bait title videos about space or aliens that have no new information at all.

On the other side, I love drachinifel's long videos doing deep dives into naval topics.  Even his long Q&A videos can be pretty good.  WW2TV is another channel that has good long conversations about WWII topics.  These conversations wouldn't work so well on TV with commercial breaks every 5 minutes.  It is almost the equivalent of a non-fiction book on tape. 
Other channels like Midnight's Edge do long conversations about movies and entertainment topics that can be a good discussion.  Depends on what topics you like. 

[MechAg94]

Non-traditional entertainment might be a good thread.  Youtube channels like The Why Files, MrBallen, The Chieftain, Brothers of the Serpent, NetNarrator to name only a few.  That stuff dominates my entertainment these days along with a few movies.  I probably miss a lot of stuff I just run out of time for.

It is amazing how easy it is to just listen to someone tell stories when they are very good at doing it. 

[Ben]

Counterpoint:
Media like broadcast TV and radio are so freaking expensive that everything used to be soundbites and headlines.  You'd have panel shows where every panelist might get to have a couple of minutes of total talk time, and expect to convey all the necessary information in that time period.  And now a

I'll concede some of that. I mean, back when there were three networks to watch (plus PBS) 60 Minutes was a Sunday night staple - certainly every Sunday at my house when I was a kid, and it was all 12 minute segments. On the other hand, you had PBS science shows, Cosmos, etc, that were an hour long and interesting for the whole hour, and I never was thinking "there's a ton of other stuff I could be doing in this hour".

I can't speak for others, but these days I tend towards the short videos, to the detriment of longer videos that are very interesting. As an example, last night I watched Tulsi Gabbard's speech at Turning Point. Super well done, but when I first saw it pop up on my feed, I was like, "20 minutes!?! Do I really want to watch that long?" I about had to force myself to set aside the lousy 20 minutes.

I've done the same with stuff like Jack Carr's Danger Close videos, which often run 1-2 hours. I'm pretty sure that 20 years ago, that wouldn't have bothered me, but now I keep thinking about the 20 five minute videos on 20 different subjects that I could be watching instead, even if they just give me a very incomplete view of a topic. Had I not forced myself to sit down for the entire videos (admittedly, often in two or three viewing sessions), I would have missed some really informative and interesting interviews.

I think Youtube Shorts makes this attention span thing ten times worse. Everybody wants to do these 30 second videos, often of total nonsense, for clicks and monetization. I probably could have watched quite a few hour long videos with superior content with all the time I've wasted clicking on worthless youtube shorts. 

[WLJ]

I didn't think the video above fit what I was talking about.  For the few minutes I listened, it seemed related.

An example I can think of is a channel that keeps getting recommended with vidoes about old TV shows.  Video titles like "What happened to this show when she found out about XX".  It has 10 minutes just talking in general about the show before about 10 seconds finally mentioning what the title said.  It wasn't a bad video, but if you were expecting to just hear the answer to the title question, you would be disappointed.  There are plenty of click bait title videos about space or aliens that have no new information at all.

On the other side, I love drachinifel's long videos doing deep dives into naval topics.  Even his long Q&A videos can be pretty good.  WW2TV is another channel that has good long conversations about WWII topics.  These conversations wouldn't work so well on TV with commercial breaks every 5 minutes.  It is almost the equivalent of a non-fiction book on tape. 
Other channels like Midnight's Edge do long conversations about movies and entertainment topics that can be a good discussion.  Depends on what topics you like.

If you like WW-2 history particularly the Pacific War you'll love these

Unauthorized History of the Pacific War Podcast
https://www.youtube.com/@UnauthorizedHistoryPacificWar

[Tuco]

Too long.
Didn't read

Counterpoint:
Media like broadcast TV and radio are so freaking expensive that everything used to be soundbites and headlines.  You'd have panel shows where every panelist might get to have a couple of minutes of total talk time, and expect to convey all the necessary information in that time period.  And now a word from our sponsor. 

Now media is so cheap it is the next thing to free.  To be fair, there's a lot of useless garbage out there, and also lots of people making mind numbing numbers of 30 second videos.  Even so, there's also a market for, and a massive quantity of long-form, deep exploration of subjects available - much of it free for the taking.  Some of it the kind of miseducation that you used to have to pay major universities to get.

Sometimes people don't just want a simple question answered in the shortest possible timeframe, they want to know the history, and why, and some alternatives, and outliers, etc.  Other times we are like Terry and just want our question answered, get a hit of dopamine, and move on.

Some people have become so used to the quick hits either because they grew up with watching the strobing kaleidoscope of content that was broadcast TV or because they're hooked on the strobing kaleidoscope of short-form content that is available on the internet that they can't tolerate "wasting" their time learning more than the bare essentials.

[cordex]

Too long.
Didn't read

[dogmush]

It's funny he made an 18 min video on a subject that he says in the first minute and a half no one cares about.

It's funnier I watched the whole thing.

[K Frame]

It's funny he made an 18 min video on a subject that he says in the first minute and a half no one cares about.

It's funnier I watched the whole thing.

So, like every one of your posts at APS?

[K Frame]

The guy actually makes a very good point. Compared to other designs around the world, American plugs are rather crap. My guess is that it's more a case of we've become so used to what is essentially a first generation plug design that we've become complacent with it. The US adopted 110 as standard wall power early on and we've never had to completely rebuild our power grid as much of Europe has had to do.... twice.

The fact that we use 110 power instead of 240 is a large part of it, as well. It is safer. You'll get a jolt, but it's not nearly as likely to kill you as European 220 volt power is. It's unpleasant as hell (I've been hit twice in my life), but generally not much else.

[230RN]

I didn't think the video above fit what I was talking about.  For the few minutes I listened, it seemed related.

An example I can think of is a channel that keeps getting recommended with vidoes about old TV shows.  Video titles like "What happened to this show when she found out about XX".  It has 10 minutes just talking in general about the show before about 10 seconds finally mentioning what the title said.  It wasn't a bad video, but if you were expecting to just hear the answer to the title question, you would be disappointed.  There are plenty of click bait title videos about space or aliens that have no new information at all.

On the other side, I love drachinifel's long videos doing deep dives into naval topics.  Even his long Q&A videos can be pretty good.  WW2TV is another channel that has good long conversations about WWII topics.  These conversations wouldn't work so well on TV with commercial breaks every 5 minutes.  It is almost the equivalent of a non-fiction book on tape. 
Other channels like Midnight's Edge do long conversations about movies and entertainment topics that can be a good discussion.  Depends on what topics you like. 

That's exactly the kind of thing that triggered my interest in  the matter.  After you become sensitized to that BS it kind of jumps out at you whenever some clickbaiter does it and it gets freaking annoying.

I'm not condemning well done informative videos, but too often there's too much fiddly-fartin' before the crux is presented.

[Hawkmoon]

Ground up didn't "supposedly" start in hospitals. It did begin in hospitals.

50-something years ago an engineer I knew built his own house. He mentioned once that the town building inspector made him reverse all the outlets in the house to the ground-up orientation. This is not something new yet, except for health care wiring, the NEC doesn't require it.

Slight correction to the above. I chatted up the electrical inspector about this question at work today. He said it has become more or less customary for outlets to be installed with the ground terminal up in hospitals, but it's NOT required by the NEC (National Electrical Code) even in hospitals. My electrical inspector actually thinks it's better (overall) to install them ground down.