Special Parking

[griz]

This is one of the enormous handicap spots in front of the local Walmart.  My questions are:
1. Is it legal?
2. Is it OK?

My take, I doubt the law is specific enough to saw which vehicle can park in which spot, so it isn't illegal.  But it isn't right.  If you're going to have spaces big enough for big vans and small buses, you shouldn't be using them with little cars.

[dogmush]

Meh.

Were there any other Handicap spots even available when that person got there?

Perhaps their Handicap is they need that much room to park?

Looking at some of the spots behind it, they don't all have extra space to get out, and maybe that person or their passenger needed the space.

Lots of stuff we don't know to start acting like a parking lot Karen.

[WLJ]

It's a one size fits all space

[BobR]

That's nothing. We have a Facebook group here, "Nye County, You Park or Drive like an A-Hole", we get some real gems there!

bob

[HankB]

So long as the vehicle DOES have an appropriate handicap plate or placard and is being used by the individual it was issued to . . . it's not something that would upset me.

[Tuco]

The ADA (Americans with Disabilities Act) is the law that says how may barrier free parking spaces are required in a parking lot.  It's a ratio of the total parking spaces.   The Act also requires a portion of the required barrier free spaces to be van accessible.

The difference (under the ADA) between a typical barrier free space and a van accessible space is the size of the loading zone- the 4' clear area adjacent to the vehicle to accommodate a person's walker or crutches, or 8' for van's ramp or lift.

The ADA will allow ALL provided barrier free spaces to be van accessible. The sections of the ADA that I'm familiar with are mute as to which type of space a permitted vehicle must use, but it follows that if all barrier free spaces can be van accessible, those spaces are available for any permitted vehicle. 

[grampster]

I like the handicap parking law in Florida.  If you have a handicap parking placard you can park in any municipal pay parking spot and not have to pay.  My wife has a placard and when we went to Florida we never parked in a handicap spot.  We always just looked for a regular parking slot close to where we were going.  She said their were probably folks worse off than her who could use the designated spots.  Florida's law is a great law in my view.

[griz]

I like that Florida idea.  Virginia has a somewhat related benefit; Handicap plates qualify you for free entry into state parks. 

[Perd Hapley]

Lots of stuff we don't know to start acting like a parking lot Karen.

Yeah, but we could be parking lot sheepdogs, though. When that handicapable wolf comes back for his car, flash your jin-u-wine CCW badge and do a citizen's arrest. You'll be a hero!

[230RN]

^  Oh, yeah, fer shore. ^

I pulled into a van accessible space recently without realizing it until I started hobbling away and noticed the "VAN ACCESSIBLE" warning on the pavement. I pulled out and drove around until another regular handicapped space was available.

I'm not that bad off, but of course I'm maybe a little more sensitive for the hobblers among us who might need a van space

When I came out of the store I noticed a compact  car in that spot.  I guess it was no big deal for that hobbler..

People vary.

I just put my groceries in my car and drove the electric shopping cart back to the "cart parking" spot and hobbled back to my car.  I was hale and hearty when the handicapped parking issue (ADA) became law, so really didn't give a chit.

But now, at going-on 86, you bet your sweet lithe little ass I like it.  Glad there's a $250 Tow-away penalty for violating it hereabouts.  But I'm armed, so I keep my stupid trap shut.

Terry, 230RN

[HeroHog]

If I see a standard slot open that is just as close as a gimpy spot, I will normally park there. Yeah, my wife and I are gimpy as Hogan's Goat but there are people out there who have it worse.

In Lousyanner, we are issued a "Gimpy Card" along with our plate/tag and yer SUPPOSED to have BOTH to legally park in a gimpy spot. This keeps the kids from using Me-Maw's ride and blocking up valuable slots.

[230RN]

^ Sounds redundant, but if it works, great.

There's a consistent HC problem at my post office which I use sometimes twice a week.  That is, there is a school next door where every day a gazillion² people pick up their kids and all the street parking is used up for a half hour.  Soooo there's occasionally someone in the HC spot waiting for their kid(s).

I often forget that until I turn into the street at around 3 - 3:30 PM and find it filled with cars.   So if all the spots are occupied, I go do the rest of my errands and come back later.

But it's often prompted the question, who enforces that illegal HC parking on Post Office federal property?  FBI?  Secret Service?  Federal Marshals?  National Guard?  Local PD?

Terry, 230RN

[HeroHog]

Local PD, I would think.

[K Frame]

Apparently there are laws or restrictions that say that van accessible spots are only for vans with wheelchair lifts. I didn't know that.

https://disabledparking.com/disabled-parking-blog/van-accessible-disabled-parking-spot/#:~:text=Van%20accessible%20handicap%20spaces%20can%20only%20be%20used,an%20accessible%20entrance%20to%20the%20amenity%20they%20serve.

[Tuco]

ADA states (with reference to new construction) at least one of every eight accessible spaces must be designed with adequate space for a lift used with a van.

"These spaces must have a sign indicating that they are van accessible, but they are not to be reserved exclusively for van users."

Sec. 4.1.2 Accessible Sites and Exterior Facilities: New Construction

[K Frame]

""These spaces must have a sign indicating that they are van accessible, but they are not to be reserved exclusively for van users.""


Equally interesting.

No matter what, Griz, maybe you should have gotten in touch with your inner Karen and demanded to see the parking lot's manager.

[Hawkmoon]

In Lousyanner, we are issued a "Gimpy Card" along with our plate/tag and yer SUPPOSED to have BOTH to legally park in a gimpy spot. This keeps the kids from using Me-Maw's ride and blocking up valuable slots.

Good for you.

Years ago, the executive secretary for the owner of the firm I worked for was married to a guy who rated a handicapped parking placard. She carried it in her car and she was actually proud of using it, even though she wasn't at all disabled. (At least, not physically. Morally, perhaps ...) She regarded it as being oh so clever.

[Hawkmoon]

ADA states (with reference to new construction) at least one of every eight accessible spaces must be designed with adequate space for a lift used with a van.

"These spaces must have a sign indicating that they are van accessible, but they are not to be reserved exclusively for van users."

Sec. 4.1.2 Accessible Sites and Exterior Facilities: New Construction

Correct. Anyone with a handicapped parking placard can use the van space. In small lots that only require one accessible space, the only accessible space will be van accessible.

[Hawkmoon]

ADA states (with reference to new construction) at least one of every eight accessible spaces must be designed with adequate space for a lift used with a van.

"These spaces must have a sign indicating that they are van accessible, but they are not to be reserved exclusively for van users."

Sec. 4.1.2 Accessible Sites and Exterior Facilities: New Construction

Section 4.1.2 was from the now-superseded 1991/1994 ADA Architectural Guidelines https://www.corada.com/documents/1991ADAStandards/4-1-2, and they did not include the statement you quoted regarding use of the van accessible spaces. They also don't make any statement to the effect that van accessible spaces may be used only by vans.

The feds issued new ADA technical criteria in 2010, and the new guidelines likewise do not include s statement of who may use van-accessible parking spaces.

[HankB]

. . . In Lousyanner, we are issued a "Gimpy Card" along with our plate/tag and yer SUPPOSED to have BOTH to legally park in a gimpy spot. This keeps the kids from using Me-Maw's ride and blocking up valuable slots.

Back when I was working, some of us used to go out for lunch from time to time. Once the guy driving was using his wife's car which had handicapped plates - we absolutely DID NOT park in a handicapped spot!

[K Frame]

Back when I was working, some of us used to go out for lunch from time to time. Once the guy driving was using his wife's car which had handicapped plates - we absolutely DID NOT park in a handicapped spot!

I used to drive my parent's cars and they both had placards. I would never park in a crip spot when I was alone.

When I blew out my knee in 2022 I could have qualified for a temporary crip tag, but I didn't pursue it.

[230RN]

I think next HC renewal time I'm going to ask for a permanent one.  No charge or anything for the three-year ones, but  it's still inconvenient because you have to go to a DMV office to pick up your renewal hang tag as well as getting a physician's sig.

And nowadays, at least here in Libland (Commierado), you have to make an appointment for everything involving any level of government.

No "Walk-Ins Welcome."

And it's not easy to just call in and say hello and make the appointment any more, you have to wait through N minutes of shitty music seemingly designed to make you want to hang up and try again later.

A couple of private outfits now give you the option of calling you back when your call gets through the queue.  But that's private outfits, who want to please you and make money thereby.

Government doesn't.

It makes money without pleasing you.

Terry, 230RN

[griz]

No matter what, Griz, maybe you should have gotten in touch with your inner Karen and demanded to see the parking lot's manager.

No, my inner Karen believes it is inconsiderate but not illegal.  If there WAS a parking lot manager, I'll bet they're busy!

[Hawkmoon]

No, my inner Karen believes it is inconsiderate but not illegal.  If there WAS a parking lot manager, I'll bet they're busy!

Are you certain it's not illegal? It is illegal here. The fine for a first violation is $250, and the fine for subsequent violations is $500. In addition, the vehicle can be towed, and the owner has to pay impound and towing fees.

[230RN]

Are you certain it's not illegal? It is illegal here. The fine for a first violation is $250, and the fine for subsequent violations is $500. In addition, the vehicle can be towed, and the owner has to pay impound and towing fees.

Hawkmoon, I think his "it's not illegal" refers to a handicapped-stickied person parking a regular car in a van zone.

We have the same penalty structure (plus towaway) here.  Don't know if that's by Fed or Local law.   As far as "Van Accessible" goes, I guess I'll continue to observe the spirit of the law.