New CEO for HD MoCo

[AZRedhawk44]

https://www.advrider.com/harley-davidson-looking-for-new-ceo/

I've owned one cruiser (Honda) and ridden a few others, including a couple HD's.  Meh.  Bad sitting position, IMO.  Especially for long cross country treks.

The one thing HD has that I want, is an engine I don't have to valve clearance.  But the only bike they have that is a neutral sitting position is their Pan American.  I think it is an inferior ADV bike for several reasons (non-21" front wheel, poor ground clearance, and stupid auto-lowering/raising gadget that caters to short people) and I don't want it.  But I do want a bike equipped with the Pan American's engine, or its 975 equivalent.  I tried out the 1250 variant once at a demo and it was a rocket.

If HD made something like a 975 Bronx, I would get it as my commuter.  Done.  At least, as long as it doesn't have a stupid 80's dust buster styled headlight.

Alas, the Bronx was just a concept bike done back in the late 20-teens.


Even better would be a neutral seated flat-tracker in the style of Indian's FTR, with the RevMax 975 and/or 1250.  I've had a lust after that bike for several years now, and I have held off on buying one for three reasons:
1. Doesn't solve my gripe with valve clearancing since that Indian 1200 engine requires clearancing
2. Puny fuel tank.  Something around 3.7 gallons.
3. Abysmal fuel economy.  35mpg riding sedately.  Total range on the bike is 120ish miles.

The FTR:


The RevMax 1250 gets 45-50mpg in the Pan American, and capacity is just an issue of good design.  An HD flat tracker could be perfect.  And appeal to the scrambler/adv crowd, and HD's "muh heritage" crowd.

[MechAg94]

Did they stop trying to sell bikes to gay people or are they looking for someone to continue that effort?

[Calumus]

Did they stop trying to sell bikes to gay people or are they looking for someone to continue that effort?

Pretty sure the complete disregard of historical company values, and their average customer base is the reason buddy is leaving. From what i understand, he wanted to continue on with his “forward thinking and Green” agenda and had the support of some board members. Mainly giant investment firms; but long time board members wanted him gone. Tough to argue with the old timers when he’s also tanked the company’s stock price by half in a year.

As for the RevMax engine, great update to the VRod engine that was co-developed with Porsche. I like the look of the new Sportster S; but it’s a little on the small side. Drop a 1500cc version in a Fatbob, and I’m lined up for the first one out of the factory.

[AZRedhawk44]

Pretty sure the complete disregard of historical company values, and their average customer base is the reason buddy is leaving. From what i understand, he wanted to continue on with his “forward thinking and Green” agenda and had the support of some board members. Mainly giant investment firms; but long time board members wanted him gone. Tough to argue with the old timers when he’s also tanked the company’s stock price by half in a year.

As for the RevMax engine, great update to the VRod engine that was co-developed with Porsche. I like the look of the new Sportster S; but it’s a little on the small side. Drop a 1500cc version in a Fatbob, and I’m lined up for the first one out of the factory.

I think you're confusing the current outgoing CEO for the prior one.

Prior one had this "many roads to Harley Davidson" mantra.  He wanted ADV bikes and sport/muscle bikes and electric bikes and whatnot.

Current one stripped out all that except the ADV bike and the e-bike, and focused the company on boutique/custom/bespoke stuff that maxed out the customer's checkbook.  The e-bikes were the gimme for the environmentalists, and the only ADV bikes they sold were also tricked out to the nines, nearing $25-$30K.

A neat development I saw in a competitor over the last few years... over at Triumph, they introduced (reintroduced?) a 250cc enduro and followed up with a 450cc enduro.  HD used to have dirt bikes.  HD used to be huge in flat track racing and scrambling.

Not everything has to have $15,000 worth of chrome attached to it.  I'd like for the next CEO to get that.

[tokugawa]

The only Harley I ever wanted was an XR1200. But it is heavy. These days about 450-480 lbs is my limit to pick up.    

[Calumus]

Current outgoing CEO is the one behind all the recent woke crap. He’s a true believer. The Many Roads to Harley was, over all, a good idea. Expanding their range would be the best way to bring in new customers. The Pan American is a decent hit for a genre they’ve never played in. If they would actually release the Brooklyn and at a decent price, they’ll take a chunk of the naked market. With Trump now talking about rolling emissions standards back to 2020 levels, that would open the door to bringing back the Evo, and the entry level bikes it went in…Current outgoing CEO said that used Harleys were the only entry level Harleys he was interested in. He compared the company to Ferrari. Completely missing the fact that the brand has always been a blue collar icon. One that you had to work hard to get to; but not unobtainable for most like a Ferrari.

[Bogie]

Plus, it is a costume that many want to wear...
 
The Enfields are big here in Skinny Jeans land...

[MechAg94]

Current outgoing CEO is the one behind all the recent woke crap. He’s a true believer. The Many Roads to Harley was, over all, a good idea. Expanding their range would be the best way to bring in new customers. The Pan American is a decent hit for a genre they’ve never played in. If they would actually release the Brooklyn and at a decent price, they’ll take a chunk of the naked market. With Trump now talking about rolling emissions standards back to 2020 levels, that would open the door to bringing back the Evo, and the entry level bikes it went in…Current outgoing CEO said that used Harleys were the only entry level Harleys he was interested in. He compared the company to Ferrari. Completely missing the fact that the brand has always been a blue collar icon. One that you had to work hard to get to; but not unobtainable for most like a Ferrari.

My comment was tongue in cheek.  Many of those "true believers" who shoot for new markets usually end up ignoring or abandoning the traditional customers.  IMO, that is where they fail.  I have no issue with an alternative design meant for another type of customer. 

I agree that Harley Davidson is not the same as Ferrari.  I had not heard that before.  That is nonsense.  The board should have canned him the moment he said that. 

[zahc]

In the 4-wheel space, electro mobility is being absolutely dominated by the Chinese. The same appears poised to happen in the 2 wheel space, because all the legacy motorcycle companies are punting on electric. It would be nice to see an American company put out something competitive in the electric space or even be an innovator or leader for electric bikes the way Tesla used to be for cars. I know HD has an electric offering but I don't know much about it.

[dogmush]

Man, just based on my Volvo EV, a well engineered electric sportbike would be INSANE.

[tokugawa]

Man, just based on my Volvo EV, a well engineered electric sportbike would be INSANE.

 The torque is crazy. It would be nice to see a cartridge type battery pack for quick change.
 For a lot of motorcycle use, the range would not be a big problem. And the quiet would be great.

[Calumus]

Man, just based on my Volvo EV, a well engineered electric sportbike would be INSANE.

Range is an issue, plus breaking old habits can be hard and dangerous. I saw a guy on a Harley Livewire (which is supposed to be a rocket) stopped at a light and watched him do something he’d probably done a thousand times before on different bikes. He blipped the throttle while sitting, waiting for the green. That blip had him halfway in to the intersection before i think he even realized what had happened…😂. Thankfully no one was coming.  I do agree that a well made electric bike might be a good run around for the city, it’s just not something I’d be in to unless there were no other choice.

[AZRedhawk44]

In the 4-wheel space, electro mobility is being absolutely dominated by the Chinese. The same appears poised to happen in the 2 wheel space, because all the legacy motorcycle companies are punting on electric. It would be nice to see an American company put out something competitive in the electric space or even be an innovator or leader for electric bikes the way Tesla used to be for cars. I know HD has an electric offering but I don't know much about it.

The Livewire is a "gimme" to the green agenda for Harley.  They don't push it hard, and are talking about spinning it off to its own brand.  Its market share is miniscule compared to Zero or even Energica.

Zero is the leader in electric motorcycles, and they're American (well, Californian anyways).  Ryan Fortnine made a great video detailing exactly why electric motorcycles suck, but electric bikes are desirable.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2zlYpy6QCM

Sur-ron is probably the leader in what electric "bikes" or moto-e-bike hybrids could/should be.  I really want one of those.  Not for range, just for pure enduro/mountain-bike fun.  Terrible machine to put on a road with other vehicles though.

I go back and forth on an electric motorcycle.  I'm drawn to them off-and-on due to reduced maintenance.  I don't want one as my "fun" bike that I go touring or dual sporting around the country on.  I want one as a commuter.  I do 1000 miles commuting for every 100 miles of recreational riding.  That means I'm doing oil changes and valve clearancing and so on 90% due to commuting.  An e-moto has no valves to tune and so on.

But ultimately the manufacturers are the ones that talk me out of the purchase.  It's not range anxiety.  It's outright lies from the manufacturers.  Zero says their bikes get 140 miles (taking one model) per charge.  The quiet part though, is that is urban driving under 45mph.  "Highway" range drops to about 90 miles.  There's another quiet part to that:  That's under 65mph.  If I do 70mph, that drops to about 75 miles.

My commute is about 33 miles.  I join traffic doing 80-85mph.  I don't see a Zero with a 140 mile advertised range being able to do 66 miles between 75 and 90 miles per hour.  It's not range anxiety.  It's pure unbridled disappointment and loathing at the misrepresentation of what "range" should mean.  There's nowhere to charge at my work.  And I shouldn't have to look to charge the bike every 30-40 miles when it's advertised with a "140 mile range."  Gasoline engine efficiency doesn't fall off like that.

[Calumus]

The Livewire is a "gimme" to the green agenda for Harley.  They don't push it hard, and are talking about spinning it off to its own brand. 

Gasoline engine efficiency doesn't fall off like that.

They spun it off a while ago. It trades under symbol LVWR.  As for gas efficiency, it also depends on how you drive them. I’ve yet to see a foot more than 15mpg out of my Challenger and it’s rated for up to 23 i believe. 😂