Ive gone over to the left.

[Parker Dean]

The turn lane is NOT there to help you merge onto a busy road.  It is ONLY for people making left turns OFF of the road. 

 

Varies by location actually. Here in Corpus it is a legal move to use the turn lane to merge from.

Also, in Texas the law is that the left lane is for passing only. Kinda negates the speed-limit-in-the-left-lane-is-OK argument.

[Gewehr98]

I had a short-term assignment to Caracas, Venezuela some years ago.  We had the Air Attache's white van, and held on for dear life as the Venezuelan driver zipped us through the traffic intersections.  It was explained to us that Green meant "go like hell", Yellow meant "slow down a little", and Red meant "proceed when able". 

What also caught my attention was the MP5-armed police standing at nearly every intersection in Caracas.  This was pre-Chavez, but I doubt they were there for traffic enforcement.

Regardless, we still have some semblance of sanity in our daily traffic patterns here, compared to several other locations off the top of my head.   

[Perd Hapley]

The vehicles on the freeway have the right of way, that's why those yield signs, and the occassional stop sign, are directed towards the on-ramp.  The on-ramp drivers are expected and required to merge their car into the flow of traffic that is already on the freeway.

That much I agree with.

This is dumb:

I meant that the drivers on the on-ramp should not expexct or demand that the drivers on the freeway move over or change speed to allow the on-ramp to merge.

I both expect and demand that drivers do all they can to keep the right lane clear for those entering and exiting.  Doing otherwise leads to accidents.  The easiest way to do this is to avoid driving in the right lane as much as possible. 

[Perd Hapley]

The turn lane is NOT there to help you merge onto a busy road.  It is ONLY for people making left turns OFF of the road. 

Varies by location actually. Here in Corpus it is a legal move to use the turn lane to merge from.

It varies not a whit by location.  I was speaking of what would make sense for safe driving, not about law.  Turn lanes should be kept clear for those ALREADY IN THE FLOW OF TRAFFIC, who need to stop and wait for a chance to turn.  Those trying to enter the road already have a safe place to wait, and it ain't the turn lane. 

Also, in Texas the law is that the left lane is for passing only. Kinda negates the speed-limit-in-the-left-lane-is-OK argument.

Oh, the left lane for driving the speed limit isn't just OK.  It is often a safer place to drive.  Nice law you have there, that encourages unsafe driving. 

[Fly320s]

I both expect and demand that drivers do all they can to keep the right lane clear for those entering and exiting.  Doing otherwise leads to accidents.  The easiest way to do this is to avoid driving in the right lane as much as possible.

What do you demand drivers do on two-lane highways (one lane each direction)?  There is no left or right lane. 

[Sergeant Bob]

I both expect and demand that drivers do all they can to keep the right lane clear for those entering and exiting.  Doing otherwise leads to accidents.  The easiest way to do this is to avoid driving in the right lane as much as possible. 

Demand? Yeah, well, you can demand all you want but, you'll be the one in the ditch.

I'm actually one of the most courteous drivers you'll find on the road, but when people start demanding, I've been known to give out 18 wheels worth of driving lessons.

[wmenorr67]

If anyone has ever driven in a non-US city, you will attest that most Americans have it easy when it comes to driving and such.  There is a place in Seoul where two or three different highways all merge coming in from the south.  You have about 8+ lanes of traffic squeezing into 3 or 4 in a distance of a couple of football fields.  At least it felt that way driving a deuce and a half. 

[Parker Dean]

It varies not a whit by location.  I was speaking of what would make sense for safe driving, not about law.  Turn lanes should be kept clear for those ALREADY IN THE FLOW OF TRAFFIC, who need to stop and wait for a chance to turn.  Those trying to enter the road already have a safe place to wait, and it ain't the turn lane. 

Well, since the streets here are not running red with the blood of those killed by turning-lane mergers, I think the system works well enough.

Oh, the left lane for driving the speed limit isn't just OK.  It is often a safer place to drive.  Nice law you have there, that encourages unsafe driving. 

The reason that law exists is because some holier-than-thou types would sit in the left lane and pace traffic in the right lane causing traffic backups, short tempers, and the resultant overly aggressive driving of those stuck behind. Their justification would be that they were going the limit and why should they move. This law was specifically made because that happened too much on the I35 corridor. And it isn't a secret by any means, 4 lane divided highways frequently have very large white signs stating "Left Lane is for Passing Only".

[Perd Hapley]

What do you demand drivers do on two-lane highways (one lane each direction)?  There is no left or right lane. 

Uh, those usually don't have on-ramps.  But I recall specifically stating that I was speaking of roads with multiple lanes in each direction. 

[MechAg94]

Bullshit.  I don't want some slow SOB cutting me off because he thought he saw someone on the on-ramp.  The slower traffic should always keep right.  It is easier for merging traffic to merge with a guys going 55 than the guys passing at 75 or 80.  If that was actually done, the right lane would become the passing lane which would defeat this safety purpose you seem to have in mind.

I pass people on the right regularly if they don't get over.  My only purpose is to get on around them with as little hassle as possible.  No point in flashing lights or tailgating them if there is no reason to.  Some people will get over when I am coming up behind them, but there is a sizable percentage of people who won't for whatever reason.  It is up to me to keep an eye on the cars around me especially when I am in their blind spot. 

[MechAg94]

If you want to get into driving pet peeves:

1.  Herd Drivers.  People who will go fast or slow when driving by themselves, but let them pull up next to another vehicle or two on the highway and they speed up or slow down to stay with the other drivers.  They either make it difficult to pass them or take 10 minutes to pass someone in the right lane.
1a.  The worst of these are the people who will drive 80 down I-10, but slow down to 70 when the are passing an 18 wheeler.  Someone needs to explain to them that risk is a function of time more than speed.  The longer they stay with that truck the more likely it will veer into their lane due to wind or something.  Get your can moving.  I am not exaggerating at all on the speed differential.  I may be underestimating it.
1b.  The next to worst of this type will sit there and ride your rear bumper and stay in your blind spot.  They will almost always slow back down eventually, but it is annoying. 

2.  If you are going to run up on somebody's rear and they get over to let you pass; PASS THEM!.  Don't pull up just over their rear bumper and sit there and take an hour to pass.  I get back over when I sense people doing that to me.  They typically make a better effort after that.   

[zahc]

I usually try to pick out a caravan of lightly loaded semis and just back-door them, even if they are going slow. Nice and stress free.

[Perd Hapley]

It varies not a whit by location.  I was speaking of what would make sense for safe driving, not about law.  Turn lanes should be kept clear for those ALREADY IN THE FLOW OF TRAFFIC, who need to stop and wait for a chance to turn.  Those trying to enter the road already have a safe place to wait, and it ain't the turn lane. 

Well, since the streets here are not running red with the blood of those killed by turning-lane mergers, I think the system works well enough. 

Oh, people do the same crap here, and I'm sure we have the same number of accidents from that mis-guided practice, too.  I don't know if our laws are the same on that, or not. 

Oh, the left lane for driving the speed limit isn't just OK.  It is often a safer place to drive.  Nice law you have there, that encourages unsafe driving. 

The reason that law exists is because some holier-than-thou types would sit in the left lane and pace traffic in the right lane causing traffic backups, short tempers, and the resultant overly aggressive driving of those stuck behind. Their justification would be that they were going the limit and why should they move.

I notice you blame those who are calmly driving at the legal speed limit, rather than those who wish to break the speed limit.  Yesterday, I was driving 64 in a 60 mph zone, in the far left lane of a six-lane highway (three lanes each way).  One of my "victims" passed me in the middle lane, extending a middle finger of friendship.  He then pulled into my lane, with only a foot or so of clearance, and quickly decelerated to about forty miles per hour.  I'm fairly certain I was not at fault for his potentially lethal behavior.   

Holier-than-thou - How do you know that they're thinking?  Maybe they just want to drive at a constant speed without dodging back and forth from one lane to the other. 

Pacing traffic in the right lane - I don't like to do that, but I would like to know why the person in the left lane is blamed for blocking traffic, rather than the fellow in the right lane.  Apparently, it is the result of superstitious ideas about the left lane being some hallowed ground for speed demons. 

If both lanes are traveling at the speed limit, then please explain how safety is enhanced by clearing the left lane for those who choose to go faster than the posted speed?  Especially when this will often dangerously clog the right lane for those attempting to exit or enter the road? 

short tempers, and the resultant overly aggressive driving of those stuck behind.

So, the person traveling the speed limit in the left lane is now responsible for the happiness of those behind him.  Guess what?  I get short-tempered when I obediently move into the right lane, only to find myself stuck behind those traveling below the speed limit.  Then I am tempted to drive aggressively to get back into the left lane, to pass.  What I have concluded is that I should stay in the left lane.  The problem is not my driving.  The problem are those who want to drive at a speed well above the limit.  Let them learn some patience. 

[Perd Hapley]

Bullshit.  I don't want some slow SOB cutting me off because he thought he saw someone on the on-ramp.  The slower traffic should always keep right.  It is easier for merging traffic to merge with a guys going 55 than the guys passing at 75 or 80.  If that was actually done, the right lane would become the passing lane which would defeat this safety purpose you seem to have in mind. 

1.  I don't want anyone to cut you off, either.  But if there is enough room for the "slow SOB" to go into the left lane, it is easier and safer for you to slow down a bit (or move into a farther left lane) than for the merging vehicle to dodge the slow SOB as he is trying to enter the freeway. 

2. 

The slower traffic should always keep right.

Courtesy demands that vehicles, if possible, travel near the speed limit, to avoid slowing down the rest of us.  Human nature assures that there will be very few such people.  There should be no "slower traffic," except for a very few vehicles that simply can't hack it and the rare souls who don't want to keep up.  And who cares where those few, rare slowpokes go? 

3.  If 75 is legal, there will be no one going at 55.   See #2 above.  Or if the limit is 55, why are you going 80?  Maybe you are the safety problem.

If that was actually done, the right lane would become the passing lane which would defeat this safety purpose you seem to have in mind.

That might seem to be a sticking point, but I wonder what's harder to merge into - a line of cars moving at 60, or a few cars going 75.  If there are but two lanes, then no one ought to be passing near an on-ramp, anyway.  That is why urban areas with multiple, closely-packed exits often have a third lane.  Or more.   

[MechAg94]

I notice you blame those who are calmly driving at the legal speed limit, rather than those who wish to break the speed limit.  Yesterday, I was driving 64 in a 60 mph zone, in the far left lane of a six-lane
Pacing traffic in the right lane - I don't like to do that, but I would like to know why the person in the left lane is blamed for blocking traffic, rather than the fellow in the right lane.  Apparently, it is the result of superstitious ideas about the left lane being some hallowed ground for speed demons. 

Perhaps you should see the superstitious road signs in Texas that say "Slow Traffic Keep Right". 

If you are in the front of the pack in the left lane, it is your obligation to get over or pass.  Blocking people from passing you makes the road much less safe than just driving fast.  As one defensive driving instructor told us once; if someone is tailgating you, your attention is focused on him and his on you.  Neither of you is putting as much attention as you should to just driving.  It doesn't matter whose fault you think it is.

64 in a 60 in Houston would piss of about 60% of all drivers on the road.  Stop being stubborn and selfish.  Show a little common courtesy and stay to right.

IMHO, if you have to drive the speed limit to feel safe, then you really aren't one of those really good drivers...or else you just aren't paying attention. 

[MechAg94]

fistful, what alternate universe do you live in where everyone drives the speed limit or even comes close to diving at the same speed?  It is pointless to use that as your answer to any and all traffic problems since it doesn't happen and never will. 

Most of the highways I use in Texas have 60 to 70 MPH speed limits.  You see cars driving anywhere from 55 to 85.  You have to adjust driving to fit that.  Demanding that everyone drive the speed limit because you think they should is foolish.  Let other drivers drive the speed they are comfortable with just don't hog the road.  If others want to risk traffic tickets, that is their business. 

If you are going to drive slow in the left lane just because you want to, don't be surprised when people get upset with you.  You brought it on yourself.

[bunni]

The left lane isn't the fast lane.  The signs say, "Slower traffic keep right."  That means that cars that are going so slow as to be an impediment to traffic traveling the normal speed limit should move to the right.  That does not mean that drivers who choose to speed get free reign in the left lane.

That's way out of line as far as I'm concerned - slower traffic, keep right. This means you.

[griz]

This is the funniest thread I have read in a long time.  Each and every one of the posters believes the way they drive is the safest, and everybody else is a dangerous menace.  And yes, I can see myself in a few of the posts.  I hate to say it but we all sound like a bunch of roosters in this thread.  If I am wrong about the testosterone poisoning, please let the female voices in this thread be heard.

There have been cases of road rage in female drivers, but you have to admit that most women drivers don't seem to be overly stressed out when they get where they are going.  Hmmm.. maybe I can learn something here?  Now I am off to join the string of cars in the left lane of I-64, trapped behind the cars going 63 while passing the cars going 62 on a road posted at 65.  GRRR.

[Paddy]

There have been cases of road rage in female drivers, but you have to admit that most women drivers don't seem to be overly stressed out when they get where they are going.

That hasn't been my experience.  Some of the aggressive drivers on the road are women, lotta them driving bigazz suv's.

As for me, I'm a 'defensive driver' all the way.  I try to be as courteous as possible (no matter what somebody else is doing).  I monitor the rear view, and pull over to let a speeding vehicle pass.  If I'm in the right lane when somebody is merging, and there's nobody in the left lane, I'll even pull over to give them plenty of room.  I'm just an all around nice guy, but then you all knew that. 

[Tuco]

Or do I need to be talked down? 

Yes.

[Fly320s]

bunni:

That's way out of line as far as I'm concerned - slower traffic, keep right. This means you.

Attitude aside, you are right.

I went to look up Texas traffic laws, since that is where I grew up and learned to drive, and found that I am entirely wrong about the "slower traffic keep right" rules.

http://home.att.net/~texhwyman/laws.htm#DriveRight

§545.051 - DRIVING ON RIGHT SIDE OF ROADWAY
[...]
 
(b) An operator of a vehicle on a roadway moving more slowly than the normal speed of other vehicles at the time and place under the existing conditions shall drive in the right-hand lane available for vehicles, or as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway, unless the operator is:
(1) passing another vehicle; or
(2) preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway.
 
[...]

Before I explain this one, let me ask you this: where is the fastest water in a river?  In the middle, of course.  Why?  Because this is the place with the least friction.  This is the deepest part of the river and there are no ragged edges to slow the water.  A highway works the same way (think of it as a two-way river.)  The right lane has the most friction: entering and exiting traffic and stalled vehicles on the shoulder.  The left lane has virtually no friction.  That is why it is reserved for faster-moving traffic.

Imagine this scenario: you're in the left lane on the freeway going faster than other traffic and you come up behind someone going a little slower than you.  Instead of waiting a few seconds for them to move over, you whip around them on the right.  At the same time, someone going much slower than you is trying to get on the freeway at the same location.  Now, both of you are creating a big hazard for each other and someone is going to have to give.  This is why (a) you shouldn't pass on the right; and (b) you should move to the right if you're traveling slower than other traffic.  The second part applies no matter how fast you are going.  Notice that the law only says that traffic moving "more slowly" than other vehicles; there is no exception given for vehicles traveling the posted speed limit.  If you're going the speed limit in the left lane and someone behind you wants to go faster, move over!  It is neither your right nor your privilege to enforce the law, and you're actually violating the law by not moving over.  You never know-- that person may have an emergency they're responding to.  On the other hand, if you're the one behind the slower driver, have a little patience and give them a few seconds to move over before you zip around them.  I can't count the number of times I've seen someone in the left lane who wanted to move over but got trapped there because everyone immediately passed them on the right.  Plus, the weaving of the driver who constantly passes people causes hazards for other drivers and frequently results in "kinks" in the traffic flow.

So, all you left lane lovers, have at it.  I'll move out of your way.

[Fly320s]

And just for giggles, here is NH's law pertaining to keep-right issues.  It's nearly identical to Texas'.

http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XXI/265/265-16.htm

265:16 Drive on Right Side of Roadway; Exceptions. 
    I. Upon all roadways of sufficient width a vehicle shall be driven upon the right half of the roadway, except as follows:
       (a) When overtaking and passing another vehicle proceeding in the same direction under the rules governing such movement;
       (b) When an obstruction exists making it necessary to drive to the left of the center of the way; provided, any person so doing shall yield the right of way to all vehicles traveling in the proper direction upon the unobstructed portion of the way within such distance as to constitute an immediate hazard;
       (c) Upon a roadway divided into 3 marked lanes for traffic under the rules applicable thereon;
       (d) Upon a city street designated and signposted for one-way traffic.
    II. Upon all roadways any vehicle proceeding at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing shall be driven in the right-hand lane then available for traffic, or as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway, except when overtaking and passing another vehicle proceeding in the same direction or when preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway.
    III. Upon any roadway having 4 or more lanes for moving traffic and providing for 2-way movement of traffic, no vehicle shall be driven to the left of the center line of the roadway, except when authorized by official traffic control devices designating certain lanes to the left side of the center of the roadway for use by traffic not otherwise permitted to use such lanes, or except as permitted under I(b) hereof.
Source. RSA 262-A:15. 1963, 330:1. 1981, 146:1, eff. Jan. 1, 1982.

[K Frame]

"I'm glad we see eye-to-eye, Mike."

Another fantasy brought to you courtesy of Fisgoat or whatever you're calling yourself these days.

[K Frame]

The turn lane is NOT there to help you merge onto a busy road.  It is ONLY for people making left turns OFF of the road. 

 

Varies by location actually. Here in Corpus it is a legal move to use the turn lane to merge from.

Also, in Texas the law is that the left lane is for passing only. Kinda negates the speed-limit-in-the-left-lane-is-OK argument.

I believe it's also legal in Virginia.

Lord knows I see enough cops doing it.

[K Frame]

"I was speaking of what would make sense for safe driving, not about law."

God almighty.

Here you are coming in with this pack of self-serving crap, which essentially breaks down into "I'll make my own rules for the highway, and screw everyone else," then you try to don the saintly garb of Mr. Highway Safety advocate.