Author Topic: What's wrong with this country?  (Read 22683 times)

Thor

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #75 on: August 11, 2007, 03:08:38 PM »
One of CATV companies I worked for started as an overbuilder. That is, a monopoly buster. They built in St Cloud, MN and California. One of the things that helped do them in was the fact that they hired contractors to do a lot of the work. One of the contractors managed to hit a gas line and blew up a building. Due to that, delays happened and gave the competition ample opportunity to get their cable plant in order. The competition, in turn, bought out the overbuilder, re-establishing their monopoly. I'm all for competition, but getting the cities to cooperate is another story. That same overbuilder was supposed to build where I now live. I'm disappointed that they didn't.
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Len Budney

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #76 on: August 11, 2007, 03:47:51 PM »
Only if the local provider will sell.

That's the beauty of it: bankruptcy has a way of forcing the owner to sell. Exactly what makes the government so dangerous is that it never goes bankrupt. If worst comes to worst, it will just print more money.

It's true that a jillionaire could, in theory, buy up the roads of a certain town just to deny everyone passage. Under road socialism, he can still strangle a town--he only needs to be slightly more creative. For example, he could buy up all the shopping centers within X miles and shut 'em all down. The anti-walmart crowd claims that Walmart creates "ghost towns" by doing almost exactly that: out-compete the other stores until Walmart is the only one standing. The claim is bogus, but a vengeful billionaire could do that if he really wanted to.

The evil billionaire could not shut the country down that way, though. The costs rise fast, especially when neighbors see what just happened to Victimville. They'll pay almost anything to keep their road supplier from selling out to Predatorpike, and the value of roads would be bid way beyond Predatorpike's ability to pay.

Bottom line: a "monopoly" is much, much harder to create or sustain than people imagine. There are all sorts of countermeasures that can destroy the would-be monopolist. That's why governments cut out the BS and secure their monopolies with guns and prisons.

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Since that was probably an unexpected development at the time of sale to Evil Road Corp, they don't put markers in to keep costs down.  What recourse do people living there have?  Again, property values go down, and the people there are stuck.

The drop in property values would in turn hurt Evil Road Corp. When you run a fast-food joint in a slum, you can't charge high prices. That's why businesses do modernize. Government doesn't, or does so much more slowly, because they don't care about profit and loss. They can raise prices and then shoot anyone who refuses to pay.

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The argument that cable and phone are "natural monopolies" is the same argument that roads are: namely, that it's prohibitively expensive to "duplicate infrastructure," so the one to lay wires first becomes a monopolist. You can easily see through this argument when it comes to wires;

Fiber can be run parallel to all the other fiber/copper crap already in place.

Not if the company that owns the poles refuses to let them. But in any case, that's a huge fixed cost which the first company doesn't face. So, the argument goes, the competitors have no choice but to charge more in order to cover the infrastructure cost which the first company has already paid. Hence, the first-comer always out-competes newcomers, and competition is impossible. That's the "natural monopoly" argument in a nutshell.

And it's identical to the road argument. Namely, the first-comer has the easements and roadway; the newcomer would (it's claimed) need to buy up property or easements to set up a separate, competing network of roads.

And both arguments are wrong for the same basic reasons. Road "competition" doesn't mean two distinct sets of roads, any more than phone "competition" means two distinct sets of wires. Airlines are one competitor of highways, just as cell phones are one competitor of landlines. "Competition" is a much more complex landscape than most people's simplistic image of two identical products side-by-side on a shelf.

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Thor

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #77 on: August 11, 2007, 04:43:16 PM »
Since the poles are generally owned by the local power company, cable, telephone, etc can attach to them provided they pay a fee for each pole attached to. The first cable company I worked for, it was $3 per pole per month is what the power company charged. (that was 1996/97) All in all, they didn't care much who attached to their poles provided they got their rental fees.
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The Rabbi

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #78 on: August 11, 2007, 05:22:31 PM »
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Here's one thing that's wrong with this country-that this crap should even get to court.  If it was so important, wth didn't he lift the bun before he bit into it?

A good example in microcosm of why America is turning into a joke.  Lawyers who will take any case that promises a big payoff, judges who bought their way onto the bench, juries who live in game show fantasies.  A general moral smog permeates America's social life, growing thicker by the day. 

We are being undone by the very things that used to be our strengths: the rule of law (perverted), commerce (avaricious business people lacking any sense of ethics or good will or community responsibility), and education (the realm of leftist, anti-American propaganda).  We need radical self-surgery--on our souls.  How we do that I don't pretend to know, but we are either going to have to metamorphose or die as a nation.

For those who think I'm being too dark or that we'll squeeze by, well, I think you're kidding yourself.  We have a few years before the iPod generation takes over and does any deal to be left alone with its toys in "peace."

Gee, I'm glad I don't live in the same country as you.
And if you want to see mess, look at the US post Civil War.
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Manedwolf

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #79 on: August 11, 2007, 05:46:47 PM »
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For those who think I'm being too dark or that we'll squeeze by, well, I think you're kidding yourself.  We have a few years before the iPod generation takes over and does any deal to be left alone with its toys in "peace."

Can't say I agree with that one. I blame baby boomers for opening the door wide to socialism, myself.

I'm also of that "ipod generation", and I'm currently messing with my AK after having sent some editorial letters about local taxes and tolls this morning.

Don't generalize. Wink

Hawkmoon

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #80 on: August 14, 2007, 07:05:19 PM »

It's true that a jillionaire could, in theory, buy up the roads of a certain town just to deny everyone passage. Under road socialism, he can still strangle a town--he only needs to be slightly more creative. For example, he could buy up all the shopping centers within X miles and shut 'em all down. The anti-walmart crowd claims that Walmart creates "ghost towns" by doing almost exactly that: out-compete the other stores until Walmart is the only one standing. The claim is bogus, but a vengeful billionaire could do that if he really wanted to.

The claim is not entirely bogus. Not an entire town, but Wal-Mart has created a ghost shopping center not far from me. They took over a store that was originally built by a regional discount chain that flopped after a good number of years. Half a mile down the road is another shopping center that held, among other tenants, a K-Mart. Not a Super K-Mart, just a K-Mart. When K-Mart closed that in the last round of shutting under-performing locations, Wal-Mart immediately took over the lease and refuses to reliquish it. So that store has been vacant for several years, and without the draw of an anchor there hasn't been enough traffic to keep the other stores in customers, so one by one they have all closed. There is now nothing in the center, only a Burger King and a Dunkin' Donuts whose lots connect but who also have direct access from the state highway that runs along the front of their stores.

Wal-Mart is evil personified. Perhaps not quite as evil as Bill Gates and Microsoft, but a very close second.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #81 on: August 14, 2007, 07:27:16 PM »
OK, we have enough people complaining about Wal-Mart in this country (including my Dad) - what are they doing about it?  If Wal-Mart is so terrible, squash it.  Start another company and take them down.  If they're violating anyone's rights, legislate against it; take them to court.  Start a mass movement to boycott them until they die or change their ways. 

FWIW, I rarely go to Wal-Mart and never for gun stuff.  Sorry, JJ. 


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Sergeant Bob

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #82 on: August 14, 2007, 07:55:43 PM »

Wal-Mart is evil personified. Perhaps not quite as evil as Bill Gates and Microsoft, but a very close second.

So, who's number three? Big Oil? Big Tobacco? George Bush?  rolleyes
Personally, I do not understand how a bunch of people demanding a bigger govt can call themselves anarchist.
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Manedwolf

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #83 on: August 15, 2007, 04:12:11 AM »
OK, we have enough people complaining about Wal-Mart in this country (including my Dad) - what are they doing about it?  If Wal-Mart is so terrible, squash it.  Start another company and take them down.  If they're violating anyone's rights, legislate against it; take them to court.  Start a mass movement to boycott them until they die or change their ways. 

FWIW, I rarely go to Wal-Mart and never for gun stuff.  Sorry, JJ. 

Snapper lawnmowers said no to them on quality principles. Wal-Mart wanted to sell mowers with the Snapper name, but made from sheet steel in China. The CEO of Snapper said "no" and walked out of their offices.

The Rabbi

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #84 on: August 15, 2007, 05:54:12 AM »
Good.
Some company making lawn equipment (Stihl?) runs ads touting that their product is not sold by Wal Mart or Home Depot.  Good for them.
Meanwhile, it is estimated that Wal Mart has saved the average consumer $3,000 a year in lower prices.  I don't know how many people they employ but lots.  I dont know what they pay in taxes of various kinds but it's lots.  And they're the evil ones??
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Paddy

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #85 on: August 15, 2007, 05:58:43 AM »
Quote
it is estimated that Wal Mart has saved the average consumer $3,000 a year in lower prices
for a bunch of plastic fantastic junk from China that winds up in the landfill.

longeyes

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #86 on: August 15, 2007, 06:10:10 AM »
I think we're all "generalizing."  But you have to to come to useful knowledge.  The "generalities" are based on empirical evidence.  You can argue that it's not all-pervasive, and with that I concur, but the trends are there. 

I'm not blaming only the "iPod generation."  I'm in the previous one and agree completely that the baby boomers brought us to where we are now.  The "best and brightest" lost their compass early on.

Can we get out of the mess we're in?  Yes, we can, but only point is that to do so will be uber-painful because the problem has now insinuated itself into the nation's very marrow: business, the law, and education. 
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The Rabbi

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #87 on: August 15, 2007, 06:21:58 AM »
Quote
it is estimated that Wal Mart has saved the average consumer $3,000 a year in lower prices
for a bunch of plastic fantastic junk from China that winds up in the landfill.
Is there a point you are making here?
American manufacturers were not stuck on "quality" until they encountered serious competition, first from Japan.  The average car from the 1970s ran until about 80k miles and then it was junked.  It used more gas, provided less comfort and safety, and overall cost more to operate than today's cars.  The only impetus for all this came from "cheap" cars from Japan.
I would bet it is the same with all manufactured items.  If you want to spring for a quality toaster oven or blender, go right ahead.  But for most people something cheap from China will fit the bill just fine.
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wmenorr67

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #88 on: August 15, 2007, 06:29:57 AM »
If this country is in such dire straights why is it that more people are still wanting to come to this country than want to leave?
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longeyes

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #89 on: August 15, 2007, 08:10:05 AM »
Obviously, because where those people are coming from it's worse, at least economically.

How many people crowd onto a creaking bus isn't necessarily a measure of a great transportation system.  It's a great country, even now, but some things need to be identified and fixed if we want it to stay that way in the future.
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The Rabbi

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #90 on: August 15, 2007, 09:06:19 AM »
If this country is in such dire straights why is it that more people are still wanting to come to this country than want to leave?

EVERY country is worse than this one in one way or another.  People want to move here from, e.g. Germany in part because entrepreneurship is rewarded here while it is taxed in Germany.
I do not know any group of refugees for whom the U.S. is not the preferred destination.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #91 on: August 15, 2007, 12:36:06 PM »
Quote
it is estimated that Wal Mart has saved the average consumer $3,000 a year in lower prices
for a bunch of plastic fantastic junk from China that winds up in the landfill.

Except that Wal-Mart sells clothing.  And shoes.  And cooking utensils, pots, pans, dishes, flatware, etc.  And towels.  And tools.  And light bulbs.  And fabric by the yard.  And food, for humans and animals.  And the afore-mentioned lawn care implements (just not Snapper).  And motor oil.  And car batteries.  And electric lamps so you don't have to use kerosene.  But you're right.  All of that stuff is just frivolous junk. 
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Paddy

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #92 on: August 15, 2007, 12:48:58 PM »
90% (or more) of it substandard crap made by slave labor in third world sweatshops.  But, hey, it's a free country.  Shop 'til ya drop  laugh

Brad Johnson

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #93 on: August 15, 2007, 12:58:03 PM »
90% (or more) of it substandard crap made by slave labor in third world sweatshops.  But, hey, it's a free country.  Shop 'til ya drop  laugh

Last time I looked it was the same brands sold pretty much everywhere else, only cheaper.

Brad
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Perd Hapley

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #94 on: August 15, 2007, 01:06:33 PM »
90% (or more) of it substandard crap made by slave labor in third world sweatshops.

I don't know if all of that is true, and it's not that I don't care.  Like I said, I don't shop at Wal-Mart very often.  My point was that Wal-Mart saves customers money on stuff that is neither junky nor plastic.  A lot of their merchandise are necessary items, not trinkets. 
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JohnBT

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #95 on: August 15, 2007, 04:02:14 PM »
"I blame baby boomers for opening the door wide to socialism, myself."

I thought it was FDR with the New Deal and LBJ with the Great Society. Of course I could be wrong, because being a baby boomer they were a little before my time.

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Sergeant Bob

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #96 on: August 15, 2007, 04:38:09 PM »
"I blame baby boomers for opening the door wide to socialism, myself."

I thought it was FDR with the New Deal and LBJ with the Great Society. Of course I could be wrong, because being a baby boomer they were a little before my time.

John

And fistful thought he was a scapegoat......
Personally, I do not understand how a bunch of people demanding a bigger govt can call themselves anarchist.
I meet lots of folks like this, claim to be anarchist but really they're just liberals with pierced genitals. - gunsmith

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longeyes

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #97 on: August 15, 2007, 08:46:46 PM »
What's wrong?  Lack of a coherent shared vision--and shared loyalty--to the deepest values that make up America.  Draw your own conclusions about how we arrived here.

Here's what we're facing:


U.S. agents accused of aiding Islamist scheme


August 15, 2007

By Sara Carter -

A criminal investigations report says several U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services employees are accused of aiding Islamic extremists with identification fraud and of exploiting the visa system for personal gain.
The confidential 2006 USCIS report said that despite the severity of the potential security breaches, most are not investigated "due to lack of resources" in the agency's internal affairs department.
"Two District Adjudications Officers are allegedly involved with known (redacted) Islam terrorist members," said the internal document obtained by The Washington Times.
The group "was responsible for numerous robberies and used the heist money to fund terrorist activities. The District Adjudications Officers made numerous DHS database queries to track (Alien)-File movement and check on the applicants' status for (redacted) members and associates."
According to the document, other potential security failures include reports that:
Employees are sharing detailed information on internal security measures with people outside the agency.
A Lebanese citizen bribed an immigration officer with airline tickets for visa benefits.
A USCIS officer in Harlington, Texas, sold immigration documents for $10,000 to as many as 20 people.
A USCIS employee, who wished to remain anonymous for fear of reprisal, said many of the complaints in the multipage document are as many as three years old.
"Terrorists need immigration documents to embed in our society and work here without raising alarm bells," said the employee.
"Whether through bribing an immigration officer, an employee with the department of motor vehicles, or utilizing highly effective counterfeit documents produced by the Mexican drug cartels. They are always looking for that documentation to live amongst us."
Bill Wright, spokesman with USCIS, said that he could not comment on any ongoing investigations but that USCIS "takes all internal allegations seriously."
"The investigations that are referenced are ongoing investigations that we can not comment on," Mr. Wright told The Times. "We take all of these allegations seriously, and we are acting on them. For anyone to suggest that they are ignored is blatantly wrong."
In March, USCIS established the Office of Security and Integrity to investigate internal corruption.
"We'd like to clean up our own house first," Mr. Wright said.
The office would add 65 investigators and internal-review specialists, for a total of 245 employees and contract employees, but none of the new 65 vacancies approved in March has been filled.
Last week, The Times disclosed a confidential DEA report substantiating the link between Islamic extremists and Mexican drug cartels. The 2005 DEA report states that Middle Eastern operatives, in U.S. sleeper cells, are working in conjunction with the cartels to fund terrorist organizations overseas. Several lawmakers promised congressional hearings based on the information disclosed in the DEA documents.
The DEA report also stated that Middle Eastern extremists living in the U.S.  who speak Spanish, Arabic and Hebrew fluently  are posing as Hispanic nationals.
USCIS Director Emilio Gonzalez in March told Congress that he could not establish how many terror suspects or persons of special interest have been granted immigration benefits.
"While USCIS has in place strong background check and adjudication suspension policies to avoid granting status to known terror risks, it is possible for USCIS to grant status to an individual before a risk is known, or when the security risk is not identified through standard background checks," said a statement provided to lawmakers.
"USCIS is not in a position to quantify all cases in which this may have happened. Recognizing that there may be presently known terror risks in the ranks of those who have obtained status previously."
Mr. Gonzalez's response, along with the 2006 USCIS document obtained by The Times, show a "pattern of national security failures that have put the nation at risk," the agency source said.
Another investigation involved more than seven USCIS and Immigration and Custom's Enforcement (ICE) employees  including special agents and senior district managers  who were moving contraband via "diplomatic pouches" to the United States from China.
ICE  the original investigating agency  downgraded the criminal investigation to a managerial problem, and the case was never prosecuted, a source close to the investigation said.
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The Rabbi

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #98 on: August 16, 2007, 03:19:35 AM »
IN WW2 there were German-Americans who aided Hitler.  Prior to the war there was a very large number of Germans and Irish who thought the U.S. ought to side with Germany.  Ditto in WW1.
The Irish staged riots in NY during the Civil War against conscription.
None of this is new.  The idea that sometime, somehow we were one country united in our beliefs and goals is just bunk.  Things were no better 100 years ago than today, probably worse in some areas.  Politics was no more civil then, not 30 years ago, not 50 years ago, not 150 years ago.
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longeyes

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Re: What's wrong with this country?
« Reply #99 on: August 16, 2007, 05:59:53 AM »
Let me get this straight, "Rabbi:" you are defending what look to me like treasonable activities by government officials? 

This country has been unified around certain fundamental values and principles.  E plurius UNUM, my friend.  Without that level of basic unity we are not a nation.  That is elementary.

And citing dissident groups really doesn't equate to the creation of a vast class--in the tens of millions--that now feels it is a nation apart.

You can posit all the "doom and gloom" to my messages you wish.  I'm a realist and a pragmatist.  If we continue on the current path we are looking at a civil war in America that will make the last one look like war games.
"Domari nolo."

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