Author Topic: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?  (Read 22060 times)

Manedwolf

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So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« on: September 23, 2007, 06:39:37 AM »
IMO, this is going to be used as a tool. He's going to go home and say that he stood on US soil, the ground that will be part of the future caliphate, and the impotent infidels couldn't do anything to stop him, they're ripe for conquest.

That's what all his speeches are like.

So why, precisely, is he being allowed to travel to US soil, speak at Columbia University, and not simply be arrested?

The man is building nuclear weapons. He's overseeing shipments of ordnance into Iraq that is killing our soldiers every day. He just had a "look at our big missiles" parade with Death to Israel and Death to America written on the vehicles. And we welcome him here. To New York City.

So he can gloat.

I don't quite get it.

griz

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #1 on: September 23, 2007, 09:15:08 AM »
It shows the rest of the world that we are free and believe in freedom for all.  A lot of countries pay attention to that kind of thing, just like we have a bad impression of countries that allow visiting heads of state to be assasinated.  If we were at war with his country, especially if we had declared war, he would be a legitimate POW or KIA depending upon how the events transpired.
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Tuco

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2007, 09:19:20 AM »
Uh, please pardon my ignorance, who is this "Mr." so-called "Death to America"?

Does he have a real name, (soez I can find out more) or is he still underground?
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grislyatoms

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #3 on: September 23, 2007, 09:23:01 AM »
I believe he's referring to Ahmedinejhad.

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #4 on: September 23, 2007, 02:59:35 PM »
There's a place for everything. Even for poisonous snakes. That place, however, doesn't include one's home.
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Desertdog

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #5 on: September 23, 2007, 03:17:54 PM »
It will not matter what question is asked, the reply will always be his propaganda line.

This is the College that forced the Minute Men off the stage when they were invited to speak.  I'll bet that won't happen to this creep.

nico

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #6 on: September 23, 2007, 06:01:57 PM »
It shows the rest of the world that we are free and believe in freedom for all.
What exactly does allowing a dictator who encourages genocide have to do with "freedom for all?"  If it's a freedom issue, then are all of us being denied freedom by not being invited to speak at columbia?

The whole "freedom of speech" angle that the president of columbia is using to defend this is complete BS.  The right of freedom of speech does not guarantee you the right to speak wherever you want any more than the right to assemble allows the KKK to have a rally at NAACP headquarters.  I don't know what their real motivation in scheduling this abomination is, but the administration are cowards for not even having the guts to be honest about it.

Boomhauer

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #7 on: September 23, 2007, 07:06:17 PM »
Quote
IMO, this is going to be used as a tool. He's going to go home and say that he stood on US soil, the ground that will be part of the future caliphate, and the impotent infidels couldn't do anything to stop him, they're ripe for conquest.


Quote
IMO, this is going to be used as a tool. He's going to go home and say that he stood on US soil, the ground that will be part of the future caliphate, and the impotent infidels couldn't do anything to stop him, they're ripe for conquest

Well, if it was up to me, I'd shut him up with a .30-06. Then he couldn't go back home and brag about it.

But, we stopped assasinating heads of states long ago.






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Manedwolf

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #8 on: September 23, 2007, 08:19:27 PM »
Quote
I don't know what their real motivation in scheduling this abomination is, but the administration are cowards for not even having the guts to be honest about it.

Unless they're actually hoping that one of the hundreds of thousands of people who lost parents in the holocaust he said didn't happen, the hundreds of thousands who do not want Israel to be "wiped off the map" as he promises, or the hundreds who have lost a family member via the IEDs he's supplying, or just someone who wants their name immortalized in history and culture...

...decides to use a scoped whatever to solve the administration's problem for them.

I don't know. It just makes no sense at all to me. They have to know that despite our intentions of showing peace and goodwill, he's going to use it as an example that he walked right in and we couldn't stop him, we're weak.


Bigjake

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #9 on: September 24, 2007, 02:25:21 AM »
Griz said

Quote
  If we were at war with his country

We are very much at war with Iran.  It may be only a proxy/shadow war, but His followers and HIS ordinance kills our boys on an almost daily basis (and he encourages it!)   

I'd love to know where Iraq would be right not without that smug, grinning bastard funneling in trouble.

I sincerely hope Karma catches up with his ass sometime early this week.

griz

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #10 on: September 24, 2007, 03:42:35 AM »
Quote
What exactly does allowing a dictator who encourages genocide have to do with "freedom for all?

Freedom of speech means everybody can say what they believe, not just the people who have the same opinion as you.  Inconvienient, but that's what it means.  That nutcase was invited, he isn't just marching in and spouting his nonsense.  I'm with you guys as far as the worth of this man, but your anger should be at the university and the UN for getting him over here and asking him to speak.

Quote
We are very much at war with Iran.  It may be only a proxy/shadow war, but His followers and HIS ordinance kills our boys on an almost daily basis


We use proxy/shadow war as an excuse for too much.  War on drugs, war on poverty, economic war, etc.  It's about as meaningful as saying "for the children" to justify gun control or anything else.  If we killed everybody that we had a proxy (albeit in this case legitimate IMO) beef with, how are we any differnet than Ahmedinejhad and his ilk?
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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #11 on: September 24, 2007, 05:07:33 AM »
Having him here demonstrates to a large part of the world that we are a free nation, and are willing to deal and negotiate from our position of strength.
 
Having him here demonstrates to the DANGEROUS part of the world that we are too weak to do anything to him, and that they should be further emboldened to step up their attacks. Death to the Great Satan!
 
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Manedwolf

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #12 on: September 24, 2007, 06:48:42 AM »
Daily Kos poll today.



Yes, I think these people are getting dangerous.

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #13 on: September 24, 2007, 08:31:13 AM »
Daily Kos poll today.



Yes, I think these people are getting dangerous.

I can understand that poll; I see little difference between the two.  Major differences include religion, skin color, and languages spoken.

Having said that, both people listed in that poll are political criminals who need to be treated as such.

I'd love to see proof that he's building nuclear weapons.  Last I saw, teh IAEA had the same proof that Iran was building nukes that we had that Iraq was building them.

If we really want to deal a blow to terrorism, why aren't we threatening Saudi Arabia?  They are the REAL enemy.

EDIT: Can you link to that dkos poll?  I cannot find it; I want to vote.
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Manedwolf

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #14 on: September 24, 2007, 09:14:39 AM »
George Bush is a political criminal?  rolleyes

Right.

So. Why are you still in America, Nitrogen? (If you are.)

And your "proof" that he's building nuclear weapons? With that attitude, it'll come in the form of a bright flash and loss of all contact with Tel Aviv. But go right ahead, keep that head in the sand, bet it's comfortable.

I suppose he's not supplying jihadists with IEDs, either.

SteveS

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #15 on: September 24, 2007, 09:56:27 AM »
Eugene Volokh had this to say on his blog:

Quote
[Eugene Volokh, September 24, 2007 at 2:29pm] Trackbacks
Ahmadinejad Speech at Columbia:

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is a bad and dangerous man, but it seems that Columbia was quite right to have him speak there as part of its World Leaders Forum. Columbia students can benefit from hearing bad world leaders as well as good ones; I'm pretty confident that most of the students in the audience will be able to tell one from the other -- and if they're not, then the event offers a great opportunity for them to do so.

If the event were some special honor for the person -- as endowed lectures, "visiting public interest mentor" positions, graduation speeches, and the like often are -- I would take a different view: A university should not honor the dishonorable. But my sense is that the World Leaders Forum does not carry the university's endorsement of the speaker's moral character, only of his significance on the world stage (which Ahmadinejad regrettably has plenty of).

Incidentally, the blog reports about Ahmadinejad's talk -- which I read after I decided to post this -- reinforce my view on the subject. It looks like Columbia President Bollinger has forcefully expressed his disagreement with Ahmadinejad, thus reminding people that the invitation didn't constitute endorsement of Ahmadinejad's beliefs.

This may be one of the I realize my friend and coblogger David Bernstein might disagree with me on this, but experienced Volokh Conspiracy readers know that such amicable inter-blogger disagreements happen on occasion.
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Nitrogen

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #16 on: September 24, 2007, 10:06:50 AM »
I am still in America because it is my country, and I wish to fight to see it return to a peaceful country that doesn't attack other countries for no reason.  I want to see America return to a fiscally responsible country.  And I DO NOT appreciate your attack on my patritosim, sir.  I would argue that I love my country more than most, by not sitting on my butt, listening to a few talking heads, but actually reading and learning.

And yes, Bush is a war criminal.

1) He invaded Iraq when they did not threaten us.  (Unless you believe the fallacy that Iraq helped the 9/11 terrorists.)  The United States Millitary has killed more Iraqi civillians in this illegal war than Saddam Hussein did during his reign.  (300k civillians died at his hands during his 25 years of rule, vs. at least 600k since the war started in 2003.  (human rights watch report)

When Saddam did this to Kuait, we called him a war criminal.

2) He's kidnapped citizens of other countries and released them to countries where they'd be tortured. (Maher Arar from Canada, for one.  There's plenty of proof his administration has done this many times)
Outsourcing torture to another country counts.

3) He's violated the geneva convention. 
Again, when Saddam did this, we called him a war criminal.

4) He's tearing the bill of rights apart.  He's pushing for the power to wiretap and spy on american citizens without a warrant.
The Constitution says that when the president does this, "The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors."  I'd call breaking their inaugrial oath treason, and an impeachable offense.

5) Violating seperation of powers as outlined in the constitution by ignoring congress's oversight powers.  (Congress is letting him, of course, because the democrats are pussies)

Shall I continue?

And it's not just me or "leftist wackos" that think Bush could be prosecuted as a war criminal. His own lawyer thought so, too.

I'd love to see a response that doesn't include the standard response of questioning a dissenter's Americanism or patriotism.

Back to the original topic:  Why are you afraid of this tinpot?  He has no real power; the guardian council of Iran has all the power, he's just a figurehead. 

Do you honestly think we should invade a country that hasn't attacked us just because we're scared of them?
The world demonized Germany for doing just that in 1939 when they invaded Poland.

Iran would be stupid to nuke anyone, especially Israel.

PS I'm still waiting for a link to that poll.
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Desertdog

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #17 on: September 24, 2007, 11:06:36 AM »
A question: Does Columbia have their own interpeters or are they provided by the Iranians?

If they are furnishesd by the Iranians, how do we know what that creep is saying or what he is being asked?

For all we know they could be saying in Iranian that they are goin to kill us, but the interpeter could be saying in english what they think we want to hear.

I don't creeps.

Nitrogen

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #18 on: September 24, 2007, 11:55:49 AM »
I'm sure the speech, in its original Persian or whatever language he speaks, will be available for auditing, no matter who the translators are.  In the age of the internet and youtube, I'm not worried.

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #19 on: September 24, 2007, 12:43:14 PM »
Well, now that it's over I can see it was not a warm reception for President Ahmadinnerjacket.

Hostile introduction, and outright laughter from the crowd when he said Iran doesn't have any homosexuals.

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #20 on: September 24, 2007, 01:23:07 PM »
See, that's my point exactly.  We're afraid of this idiot why now?
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Boomhauer

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #21 on: September 24, 2007, 01:41:41 PM »
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We're afraid of this idiot why now?

Who says we're afraid of him? We just want him and his ilk dead.

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Bogie

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #22 on: September 24, 2007, 01:48:52 PM »
Because he'll gladly endow the family of a religious fanatic nutjob with more money than they ever dreamed of after the nutjob kills Americans... Remember - state sponsored terrorism is DENIABLE. "Oh, we not have ANY contact with those bad people!" And I don't like the Saudis either - but their oil is gonna run out sooner or later, and they can then go back to making jabbering laughter while they abuse their camels...
 
Personally, I'll take our relatively mild religious fanatics over the rabidly homicidal ones any day.
 
And consider one other thing while you're at it... How do we know that Iraq didn't have any of the materials which that country used to kill whole bunches of people? Because they said so. Okay, they _did_ have ample time to move them or hide them, during which they made lots of threats about wholesale slaughter of Americans. Maybe someone else sees humor in that, but I don't... And hey, we don't need to worry that their "peaceful" reactor complex is designed to create weapons grade material... At least not until it's used... Then, after the fact, we can point fingers at the Bad Republicans, and blame them for not doing something...
 
I suspect that there are lots of "liberals" today who are rethinking how they feel about world leaders...
 
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roo_ster

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #23 on: September 24, 2007, 01:56:07 PM »
Uh, he has access to billions in oil revenues, has an active nuke program, exports terrorism, exports equipment to terrorists, is an adherent to a millenarian sect of a militant religion, oppresses & kills those currently in his power, and has threatened to nuke other countries.

-----

If folks want to be taken seriously, they need to stop calling GWB a war criminal.  He has Congress's chop on legislation authorizing his policy in Iraq.  Get over it.

Might as well be a flat-earth proponent.

-------

The World's Best Known Holocaust Denier has no claim on the USA or any of our institutions for a soapbox.  Period.
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drewtam

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Re: So why is Mr. "Death to America" on US soil making speeches?
« Reply #24 on: September 24, 2007, 02:43:10 PM »
Sooo..... Can we question their patriotism now?




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