Author Topic: A Sithy question (Read 3516 times)

Smith · « **on:** May 11, 2005, 08:21:05 AM »

Ok, before the next one comes out, I need to clear something up in my head about the last one (Attack of the Clones). I know how convoluted this stuff can get...please keep your answer simple.

Ok, there can only be two Sith Lords at one time, right? One Master and one apprentice, right?

Ok, once Darth Maul died, there had to be another Sith. We assumed that that sith was Aniken (an apprentice since Lord Sideous was the assumed Master) but then Count Dookoo came onto the scene.

WHO IS COUNT DOOKOO? Is he a "good side" Jedi, a Sithy type, or did he just resign the whole thing and keep practicing (a neutral party opportunist)?

Please help. Thanks!

Chris · « **Reply #1 on:** May 11, 2005, 08:46:57 AM »

It would appear that Dooku is a sith apprentice, serving under Sideous. While it appears that he is fighting with the forces of the Droid Army against the Republic, it is all a part of Sideous' plan for assuming power and gaining control of the Galaxy. Recall at the End of AOTC, how Dooku and Sideous met up and discussed how the plans were going.

It makes sense, too. Palpatine/Sideous is chancelor of the Senate. He needs a crisis to gain power. A war between the Seperatists and the Republic would be the ultimate way of gaining power. And, the best way to ensure you are on the winning side is to actually be on both sides. Palpatine is on the Republic side, Sideous is on the Seperatist's side.

Given that Revenge will end with the "birth" of Vader, I'm guessing that Dooku will not survive to see the end of the film. Don't know for sure, intentionally, but I'm guessing that will happen.

Smith · « **Reply #2 on:** May 11, 2005, 08:57:49 AM »

Ok, now I'm really lost. I was thinking that the Republic was the equivalent of the Empire that we all know from the 4th episode. That would make the Seperatists the "Rebels." Or... Huh?

Help again? Thanks.

Sean Smith · « **Reply #3 on:** May 11, 2005, 09:19:34 AM »

Chancellor Palpatine (aka Darth Siddious, aka the future Emperor) basically created the separatist movement as a political prop to help him overthrow the Republic and become Emperor. Count Dooku (aka Darth Tyrannus), the separatist leader, was really working for Palpatine all along, since Tyrannus is the apprentice to Siddious. Palpatine caused the Clone Wars to happen, so he could create a crisis that would give him a pretext to have the Senate give him dictatorial powers.

Note that the Clone War not only gives Palpatine a pretext to gain absolute power, it also gives him a chance to kill off all his potential future rivals for power, for instance the Trade Federation and their droid armies, under the pretext of defending the Republic that he is going to overthrow and replace with the Empire.

Random speculation: Dooku/Tyrannus was the Jedi who had the records of the planet where the clones were made removed form the Jedi Archive, and was the one who had the order placed for the clone army, using the assumed name of a dead Jedi. Remember that Dooku used to be a respected Jedi Master before leaving the order some time in the past. Thus Palpatine all along knew that he'd have a clone army that would "just happen to be ready" when the sepratist threat (that he created on purpose) emerged.

He also hired Jango Fett to try to assassinate Senator Amidala, knowing it would fail because he is the one who arraged for Annakin and Obi-Wan to guard her, and knowing that it would lead to them trying to track Jango back to the planet where the clone army was just being finished, just in time for him to get dictatorial powers, use the clone army, etc., etc.

The future Rebellion in the original trilogy (Episodes IV-VI) is really elements of the old Republic who survived Palpatines creation of the Empire. Leia's "dad" is Senator Organa, who in the current movies is not a separatist.

The Sith master-apprentice pairings go something like this:

Siddious-Maul
Siddious-Tyrannus (Dooku)
Siddious-Vader

Vader isnt really Siddiouss apprentice until sometime in Episode III after Dooku/Tyrannus is whacked.

jefnvk · « **Reply #4 on:** May 11, 2005, 10:12:04 AM »

Anyone wanna bet that Vader is the one that whacks off Dooku, and then joins Siddious? Similiar to how Luke just about offs Vader, but then refuses to join the emporer in Episoide 6?

Sean Smith · « **Reply #5 on:** May 11, 2005, 10:34:21 AM »

Since there have already been reviews of Episode III published that are full of spoilers, the movie's plot is probably not a smart thing to bet on. Wink

Kharn · « **Reply #6 on:** May 11, 2005, 01:31:17 PM »

You're all a bunch of nerds!!!!
Anybody gonna be at opening night with me? :beatup:

Kharn

Schuey2002 · « **Reply #7 on:** May 11, 2005, 05:16:26 PM »

Ok, so what about General Grievous? He is going to be a one hit wonder as well, correct? Sorta in the way the Darth Maul was?

Sean Smith · « **Reply #8 on:** May 11, 2005, 05:19:54 PM »

Quote from: Schuey2002

Ok, so what about General Grievous? He is going to be a one hit wonder as well, correct? Sorta in the way the Darth Maul was?

http://www.themovieblog.com/archives/GeneralGrev3.jpg

As far as I know. Keep in mind, any new characters pretty much have to die by the end of the movie. Wink

Schuey2002 · « **Reply #9 on:** May 11, 2005, 05:26:50 PM »

Hehehe.

I can't wait to see him wield four lightsabers at once. It should be quite the eye candy!

No, I am not a nerd. Redneck maybe, but definitely not a nerd. Wink

mtnbkr · « **Reply #10 on:** May 11, 2005, 06:15:39 PM »

I'm a nerd and a redneck and I can't wait to see this.

No comments about my Budweiser pull tab collection, or my highwater overalls please. Wink

Chris

Schuey2002 · « **Reply #11 on:** May 11, 2005, 07:14:03 PM »

In a court of law, under oath, whilst being grilled by a high priced defense attorney, I could be pressured into blurting out the fact that I own a couple of vintage (Mint On Card) Star Wars action figures..

Under ANY other circumstances, you'll never hear me say that.

So, yeah, there may be a wee bit of nerd in me. And, yes, Kharn, I will be there opening night.

You buying the popcorn?

TarpleyG · « **Reply #12 on:** May 12, 2005, 03:07:08 AM »

This is more freakin' complicated than real life....

Greg

mtnbkr · « **Reply #13 on:** May 12, 2005, 03:40:53 AM »

Quote

I could be pressured into blurting out the fact that I own a couple of vintage (Mint On Card) Star Wars action figures.

My friend used to be a hardcore collector. He had some of the action figure prototypes valued at around 10k each. He sold them for a profit a few years after he bought them.

Chris

Bemidjiblade · « **Reply #14 on:** May 12, 2005, 03:50:28 AM »

GOD"S OWN NERD!!!!! What's wrong with that?! *wink*

Every single time the new movies have come out, I went right out to buy the unabridged book on audio CD. I have *never* been disappointed. Even though George Lucas seems bound and determined to keep capable actors I like from actually emoting (Liam Neeson and Haydon Christenson have both put in very excellent performances in Michael Collins and Life as a House respectively)... I have yet to be disappointed with the storyline! It's exquisite stuff!

The movies... well... I own them. I'm still not sure how I feel 'bout that.

So, I've already listened to Episode III on Audio CD 3 or 4 times. I won't ruin anything.

From the Clone Wars micro-series, as well as the books etc, I gather that there is only one Sith Lord and one apprentice, but they may have any number of underlings and fallen Jedi working for them.

The books on tape clearly make a distinction between Fallen Jedi (Jedi who have gone over to the Dark Side), and Sith Lords (who represent a specific order and philosophy). It's sort of like a force-user who isn't Jedi trained versus a Jedi or Padawan.

So as far as I understand it, once a Sith Lord is killed, another Fallen Jedi or underling is chosen to take his place.

Strings · « **Reply #15 on:** May 12, 2005, 05:57:16 AM »

Ummm... actually, the proper term is "Dark Lord of the Sith". It's almost always a fallen Jedi (which is why you never hear Palpatine refered to this way). If you want, I'll go back through Tales of the Jedi to give an exact explaination...

Smith · « **Reply #16 on:** May 12, 2005, 06:16:08 AM »

You never hear Palpatine (aka the Emperor, aka Lord Sideous) referred to as the Dark Lord of the Sith? Why not? He's not a fallen Jedi?

Still lost.

Strings · « **Reply #17 on:** May 12, 2005, 06:48:11 AM »

As far as *I* know, Palpatine was never a Jedi...

The Sith were a race of Darkside manipulating beings that eventually were defeated by the Jedi, and thought extinct. Their teachings and knowedge of the dark side is equal to the Jedi's knowledge of the light...

Every so often, a Jedi falls from the light, and is seduced by the Dark. Some of them learn the teachings of the Sith (through a variety of ways). If they're powerful enough, they can become the Dark Lord of the Sith. But there's only one Dark Lord at any given time...

Of course, this is all back history made up to explain one of the cool titles Lucas came up with for his villian... Wink

Now I'm trying to remember Ep1: did Palpatine ever refer to Maul as his apprentice, or as "my friend"? It could actually be that Maul was the Dark Lord, and had taught Palpatine some of what he knew. He (Palpatine) seems to use abilities more suited to the Sith than the Jedi...

Sean Smith · « **Reply #18 on:** May 12, 2005, 09:32:13 AM »

Quote from: Smith

You never hear Palpatine (aka the Emperor, aka Lord Sideous) referred to as the Dark Lord of the Sith? Why not? He's not a fallen Jedi?

Still lost.

Apparently Palpatine was never a Jedi; he was directly recruited into the Sith by Darth Plagueis, whom he later killed.

"Dark Lord of the Sith" isn't the title of the MASTER Sith. It is just a Sith title. Darth Vader was called "Dark Lord of the Sith" back in the original trilogy, yet he was always clearly subordinate to Darth Sidious (Emperor Palpatine).

jefnvk · « **Reply #19 on:** May 12, 2005, 10:06:20 AM »

Quote

Since there have already been reviews of Episode III published that are full of spoilers, the movie's plot is probably not a smart thing to bet on.

I guess by not knowing that, it proves I am not a lost cause yet Wink

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Author Topic: A Sithy question (Read 3516 times)

Chris

Strings

Strings