Author Topic: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated November 1, 2009)  (Read 158711 times)

Fjolnirsson

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Re: *** Pending lawsuit regarding THR - message reposted via Oleg's blog.***
« Reply #175 on: September 25, 2008, 12:56:37 PM »
Just came across this....

http://thearmedschoolteacher.blogspot.com/

Thursday, September 25, 2008
Just So You All Know. . . .

Im not avoiding telling you what I know.  Im at work right now, and not able to post very well (the email client stinks, and I cant visit Blogspot at work.)  This evening I promise to break things down from my point of view.  Obviously, thats only going to tell you what I know and what I think is going on.

 

The short version, as I see it, goes like this:

1.       Oleg Volk agreed to carry on with The High Road after Rich Lucibella closed The Firing Line.  Since Rich had already registered the www.thehighroad.org domain, he gave it to Oleg.  (In quotes because those are Richs words.)

2.       Oleg enlisted many of us from the old TFL staff to help.  He also enlisted Derek Zeanah to provide hosting and IT services.  We were all volunteers, including Derek.

3.       Fast forward to this summer, when Oleg, Derek and others discover that there is an opportunity to make money from THR, whether by selling the domain to an outside party or by accepting advertising.  Can you guess where the party ended?

4.       Oleg seemed to be leaning toward a business offer that made many of us, myself included, wary to the point of suspicion.  Derek proposed an alternative that many, myself included, thought might be preferable.  The details arent important right now; there were honest differences as to the best course, and thats all we need to know for our purposes here.

5.       When Derek decided that Oleg would make a rash decision (and to be fair, I believe Derek thought Olegs decision would benefit Oleg but leave everyone else out) he revealed that Oleg was not actually registered as the owner of www.thehighroad.org.  Derek had transferred the registry and passcodes into his name and keeping from Rich, and had never passed them on to Oleg.  Derek used his control of the registry and database passcodes to deny access to Oleg so that Oleg would be unable to complete any business transaction involving THR.  This is where Derek and I part ways.

6.       Over the past several weeks, several attempts have been made to reconcile Oleg and Derek and mediate their dispute in private.  No solution has been found.  Eventually, Oleg made the decision to bring a lawsuit to force Derek to give up his control of the domain.  In response, Derek shut down THR yesterday.  I dont know what message is there today; I cant access THR at work.

7.       I believe Oleg will eventually prevail in any lawsuit.  In my mind, the bottom line is that even if one accepts that the ownership of the domain is currently in dispute, the last person who had undisputed ownership was Rich Lucibella.  Rich Lucibella told Oleg, Derek, and the TFL staff that he wished to transfer the rights to www.thehighroad.org to Oleg Volk.  He gave them to Derek because he believed that Derek, as Olegs agent, would complete the transfer to Oleg.  In effect, Derek intercepted the rights and held them for himself, and he now proposes to use them.  But this is not a football game; interceptions dont count.  Under Dereks theory, if you pay your investment manager $10,000 and direct him to invest it in the fund, he could keep it since he had possession of it at some point.

8.       Both Oleg and Derek claim to believe that the other has honest intentions.  I dont believe either of them on that score at the moment.  However, I do think each is doing what he thinks is necessary, not only for himself but also for THR.  We can convince ourselves of almost anything with very little effort, after all.  That said, as I said before, I expect Oleg to prevail in any contest of law.  Derek has claimed that Oleg contemplated utterly destroying THR and therefore must be stopped.  If thats true, it doesnt change anything.  If the place belongs to anyone, it belongs to Oleg.  If he wanted to destroy it, he would be within his rights.  I might never speak to him again after that, but I wouldnt stop him.  In fact, Rich Lucibella shut down TFL entirely.  Twice.  The difference was that Richs host and IT guy, like the rest of us, cringe in mortal fear at the thought of crossing The Lucibella.  For better or for worse, nobody is afraid to cross Oleg.

9.       The question that stays in my mind is not whether Oleg or Derek will win in the end.  The question is, what will be left of THR when the winner is finally declared?  THR is a community.  It has no geographic, religious, historical or cultural bonds to hold it together, only a shared passion for shooting and firearms.  This could easily destroy it.

10.   Keep in mind that this is my opinion.  Its based on what I know.  What I know is undoubtedly not the whole story.  What I believe is even less reliable than what I know.
Posted by Don Gwinn at 3:02 PM 0 comments

And the previous post....

The High Road; An Apology To You All

For now, all I have to say is that I don't have anything to say. Tomorrow I expect to go into much more detail. It's a dark day if you're a member of The High Road dot Org. It's after midnight, I spent all day in an emergency room, and I have parent-teacher conferences in the morning. I'm going to bed.

Before I do, I want to say this much:

If you're a member of www.thehighroad.org and you're wondering what's going on, I'm sorry. I apologize on behalf of the entire staff for the fact that we were not able to keep our childish bickering and junior-league food fights from destroying a community you built with us from nothing. I would urge you to hold yourselves blameless and instead hold the staff responsible for this epic failure of the ideals THR stands for, but I'm sure you've figured that part out for yourselves.

I'm sorry.

Posted by Don Gwinn at 12:15 AM 8 comments
Labels: Guns, Hypocrisy, Love, Politics, schadenfreude, Screwups, Waaaaaambulance
Hi.

TheBluesMan

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Re: *** Pending lawsuit regarding THR - message reposted via Oleg's blog.***
« Reply #176 on: September 25, 2008, 01:03:58 PM »
Don's recollection of the events is accurate.

I would only add that Derek has repeatedly refused to respond to requests for an accounting of donations and expenditures relating to The High Road. He alone holds the only backup of the database (a dangerous proposition and terribly irresponsible for a sysadmin) and refused to give a copy to a disinterested third party.

He has seized control but will continue to keep THR up and running to pacify the masses with bread and circuses. Also to be certain that his "investment" doesn't shrivel up and fade away.

freedom lover

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Re: *** Pending lawsuit regarding THR - message reposted via Oleg's blog.***
« Reply #177 on: September 25, 2008, 01:05:47 PM »
I just hope that whatever's best for these two forums wins out in the end.

I can't tell who is lying. The facts are not clear and neither are the accounts of the witnesses.

All I know is I was punished for serving Oleg's side. He may be in the right.

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Re: *** Pending lawsuit regarding THR - message reposted via Oleg's blog.***
« Reply #178 on: September 25, 2008, 01:15:29 PM »
getting the boot from thr was really depressing, I feel real bad for you guys.
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: *** Pending lawsuit regarding THR - message reposted via Oleg's blog.***
« Reply #179 on: September 25, 2008, 01:21:43 PM »
I just hope that whatever's best for these two forums wins out in the end.

I can't tell who is lying. The facts are not clear and neither are the accounts of the witnesses.

All I know is I was punished for serving Oleg's side. He may be in the right.

you were punished for not acting your age young as that is.
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

freedom lover

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Re: *** Pending lawsuit regarding THR - message reposted via Oleg's blog.***
« Reply #180 on: September 25, 2008, 01:29:56 PM »
Quote
you were punished for not acting your age young as that is.

I admit I didn't act my age. I suppose I should try to act less on emotion and more on facts, to think logically.

I guess I kept going because it felt darn good. I should try to become less impulsive.

jamz

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Re: *** Pending lawsuit regarding THR - message reposted via Oleg's blog.***
« Reply #181 on: September 25, 2008, 01:35:27 PM »
Holy clusterf*ck.

I haven't been to THR for a long long time, mostly due to the greatly increased size since '03 when I liked it a whole lot, but I hate hearing stuff like this.
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Re: *** Pending lawsuit regarding THR - message reposted via Oleg's blog.***
« Reply #182 on: September 25, 2008, 01:37:16 PM »
OK, this is starting to range far and wide, and it's getting a bit out of hand, so I'm going to lock this down.

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Latest THR lawsuit update
« Reply #184 on: April 03, 2009, 01:41:40 AM »
From Oleg's blog. I assume it's not an April 1 thing, despite the date.

http://olegvolk.livejournal.com/548766.html

Wed, Apr. 1st, 2009, 09:40 pm
The High Road lawsuit update
The case is going to trial in mid-September 2009.

I am charging Derek Zeanah with theft of the domain name by conversion and requesting the return of my property. He also violated my registered copyright for the organization of the forum.

Derek, for his part, claims sole, exclusive ownership of The High Road trademark. He hasn't explained just how it belongs to him, other than through his technical control of the domain name. He also claims that I owe him for not taking adequate care of The High Road forums as a business and thus causing him monetary losses. Seems what he lacks in evidence, he makes up in sheer audacity of claims.

We are going through the labor-intensive discovery process. Fortunately, I have a very capable lawyer as well as a friendly law student assisting with research and organization. Thanks to the generous assistance of my friends and readers, I still have some of the legal fund on hand, though it won't last through the end of this saga.
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Gewehr98

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Re: Latest THR lawsuit update
« Reply #185 on: April 03, 2009, 02:50:28 AM »
Merged the thread into the existing one already stickied.

Still locked, for obvious reasons.

« Last Edit: April 03, 2009, 01:47:09 PM by Gewehr98 »
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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated 3 Apr 09)
« Reply #186 on: August 08, 2009, 11:49:05 AM »
Many of you have been inquiring regarding the status of Volk vs. Zeanah. I am authorized by my attorney to disclose the following information:

      On June 5, 2009, Charles Peeler, the attorney for Derek Zeanah, filed a motion to disqualify my attorney, Glenn Bellamy, from the case.  Mr. Peeler’s motion argued that Mr. Bellamy was a necessary fact witness. Under legal ethics rules one cannot be a witness and simultaneously the trial attorney for one of the sides in the case.  After due consideration, we concluded that Mr. Bellamy could do more good for my case as a witness for my side than as my attorney, and he withdrew as my attorney of record.   

      On the 10th day of July, 2009, Michael Branson, a trial lawyer from Missouri, entered an appearance as my new attorney of record.  Mr. Branson has never been a member of TheHighRoad.org and therefore cannot be named as a necessary witness.  Mr. Branson is currently working with everyone involved to schedule oral depositions.

      Recently, the attorneys have engaged in discussion of a negotiated settlement out of court.  My attorney has asked me not to comment on the nature of the negotiations except to acknowledge that we are exchanging settlement offers through our attorneys, while they prepare for the upcoming depositions and trial.

Oleg Volk

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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated August 8, 2009)
« Reply #187 on: October 07, 2009, 01:02:17 AM »
My attorney issued an update this week:

On August 28th, 2009 Oleg Volk's oral deposition was taken down in Statesboro, Georgia. The deposition by Charlie Peeler, Derek Zeneah's attorney, took more than five hours, and Mr. Volk was very consistent in his testimony. Lines of questioning pursued by Mr. Peeler indicate that Mr. Zeneah will argue that Mr. Volk did not act as the true owner of a business asset (the THR.org forums) because he did not make sufficient and consistent efforts to increase the net value of that asset. Mr. Volk insisted during the entire deposition that he had always viewed THR.org as an online community existing as its own justification, rather than a for-profit business entity, and that ownership of the website can and should be determined regardless of the profit motives (or lack thereof) of the parties.

Mr. Volk's attorney, Michael Branson, will take Mr. Zeneah's deposition on October 29 in Statesboro. Mr. Branson will elicit testimony from Mr. Zeneah on a variety of topics. The deposition and discovery process is very costly for both parties and very time consuming for the attorneys, and all the documentation and testimony must be generated and exchanged before the discovery process concludes November 15, 2009. After that point, assuming no reasonable settlement has been agreed to, the parties will begin final preparations for trial.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2009, 11:29:52 AM by Oleg Volk »

KD5NRH

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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated August 8, 2009)
« Reply #188 on: October 07, 2009, 10:00:09 AM »
The deposition and discovery process is very costly for both parties and very time consuming for the attorneys,

Dueling is so much more cost-effective.


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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated August 8, 2009)
« Reply #189 on: October 07, 2009, 10:05:07 AM »

Is Rich Lucibella still around?  I don't know much about the gentleman, but I understand he is quite...  uhm, vocal.  I don't think he'd be shy if put on the stand.
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Brad Johnson

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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated October 7, 2009)
« Reply #190 on: October 30, 2009, 03:01:59 PM »
Any update from yesterday's depo?

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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated October 7, 2009)
« Reply #191 on: November 01, 2009, 01:46:25 AM »
Working on it. Don't have the transcript yet but will have a summary shortly. It went very well for us.

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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated October 7, 2009)
« Reply #192 on: November 01, 2009, 02:31:16 AM »
Working on it. Don't have the transcript yet but will have a summary shortly. It went very well for us.

That is encouraging, Oleg.  Please update us as the situation allows.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated November 1, 2009)
« Reply #193 on: January 01, 2010, 05:47:24 PM »
Well?
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Laurent du Var

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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated November 1, 2009)
« Reply #194 on: January 12, 2010, 03:33:52 AM »
So?
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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated November 1, 2009)
« Reply #195 on: January 13, 2010, 01:17:40 AM »
Any Updates?
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norinco982lover

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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated November 1, 2009)
« Reply #196 on: January 27, 2010, 10:53:25 AM »
any updates? Please?

Gewehr98

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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated November 1, 2009)
« Reply #197 on: January 27, 2010, 01:50:56 PM »
Locked until Oleg can provide an update.
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Re: Pending lawsuit regarding THR (Updated November 1, 2009)
« Reply #199 on: January 30, 2010, 03:55:23 AM »
It's kind of noisy over there right now.  I wish I knew more of both sides of the story, it would make for an easier landing.  But, from the little I know so far, I am inclined to side with Oleg.
In any event, I hope it works out without irrepairable damage being done to the overall THR ethic.  That is what is most important.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.