Author Topic: Value on Grandpa's 1917 Winchester 30.06?  (Read 2708 times)

Stand_watie

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Value on Grandpa's 1917 Winchester 30.06?
« on: October 26, 2008, 04:59:53 PM »
     Dad's thinking about selling it and I told him I'd give him best price on it.

It's a...

1917 Winchester
"Springfield action"
bolt action
Manufactured for ww1
Bought "unfired" army surplus in the 50's
Original barrel, "sporterized" stock
2.5 power weaver scope
less than a hundred rounds fired through it
Dusty but not beat up
Yizkor. Lo Od Pa'am

"You can have my gun when you pry it from my cold dead fingers"

"Never again"

"Malone Labe"

Gewehr98

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Re: Value on Grandpa's 1917 Winchester 30.06?
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2008, 06:37:45 PM »
Don't take this wrong, but sporterizing basically killed it value-wise.  If there's a scope mounted on a 1917 Winchester-made U.S. Enfield action, then that means the integral sight ears and hardware have also been milled off the rear receiver ring to accommodate the scope base and rings.

The value is only what somebody will pay for it as a deer rifle or plinker. 

My advice?  Keep it in the family as a shooter and heirloom, and use it to introduce the younger generations to shooting rifles from bygone eras.  It's solid, chambers a legendary cartridge, and will outlast several owners. Sporterized M1917 U.S. Enfield actions were the basis of many good solid hunting rifles, and folks like Art Alphin of A-Square used them to make some of his premium dangerous-game rifles.  The value of A-Square rifles, however, is in Art's workmanship in converting those old military actions to functional works of art, much like R.F. Sedgley did back in the day with surplus M1903 Springfield actions.  The collector's value based on the gun's military heritage is gone the second the hacksaw/dremel/mill/drill touches it and removes material.

Here's what a M1917 U.S. Enfield would look like if it were worth something to a military collector:



Mike Irwin and a few others know about this, but I have one sporterized M1917 U.S. Enfield that is actually just slightly collectible. It's a long range wildcat target/varmint gun built in the old tradition and chambered in .236 Super (aka, 6mm-.270), with heavy bull barrel, 12x Unertl scope, and early Fajen laminated stock:









« Last Edit: October 26, 2008, 09:25:49 PM by Gewehr98 »
"Bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round...

http://neuralmisfires.blogspot.com

"Never squat with your spurs on!"

280plus

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Re: Value on Grandpa's 1917 Winchester 30.06?
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2008, 07:12:00 PM »
Dammit G, you got too many good guns, you should share!  =D
Avoid cliches like the plague!

Gewehr98

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Re: Value on Grandpa's 1917 Winchester 30.06?
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2008, 07:22:11 PM »
I honestly don't believe there's such a thing as too many good guns.   :lol:

However, there is such a thing as having more guns than time to shoot them.  I've scaled back considerably on my firearms acquisition rate, since range day is now an agonizing process of asking one's self "which toy has been the longest safe queen so far?".  I've actually considered making an Excel spreadsheet that logs range time so I know at a glance, based on the shooter's logbook I take notes with each time I go out...   :O

Logbook seen here with my 700PSS:

« Last Edit: October 26, 2008, 07:28:24 PM by Gewehr98 »
"Bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round...

http://neuralmisfires.blogspot.com

"Never squat with your spurs on!"

Stand_watie

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Re: Value on Grandpa's 1917 Winchester 30.06?
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2008, 08:10:13 PM »
No offense taken Geweher. The question I guess I'm really asking is how much $ I can give dad for it without him thinking I'm giving him charity.
Yizkor. Lo Od Pa'am

"You can have my gun when you pry it from my cold dead fingers"

"Never again"

"Malone Labe"

Gewehr98

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Re: Value on Grandpa's 1917 Winchester 30.06?
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2008, 08:13:46 PM »
That's a hard question to answer, really.

Honestly, I guess I'd go over to www.gunsamerica.com and/or www.auctionarms.com and peruse the listings of sporterized milsurps.  On www.auctionarms.com you'll be able to see what price the auctions finished at, so that'll give you a ballpark figure for what folks are willing to pay for them. 

Sorry that's not much help, especially when it comes to family heirlooms and all...

My dad's got a couple safes full of beautiful sporterized Mausers, Springfields, and Arisakas, done with deep Belgian bluing, Fajen, Bishop, and other high-grade wood, and the work was done by transplanted old-world gunsmiths shortly after WWII.  They're works of art, and worth very little - save for the fact that as a teenager, my dad and I harvested many deer with the collection.  So they have value to me for that sake alone. 

The same goes for a certain 1916 C.G. Haenel Mauser that I spent a couple years building into a 1000 yard tactical/target rifle, just as F-Class shooting was starting in earnest.  I built the gun to see if I could stay inside 10" at 1000 yards with 10 rounds.  Physics major friends of mine in the Air Force forensics lab I worked in, plus some evenings spent on computer ballistics simulations, led me to settle on the 6.5-06 wildcat chambering, which would keep a low-drag bullet very supersonic even at 1000 yards, without the excessive recoil of the big belted magnums then in vogue.

I went all out with it, using a 26" Krieger heavy barrel, Canjar trigger, Tubb striker system, Devcon Marine Epoxy bedding w/powdered aluminum, lapped lugs, magnafluxed and trued action, you name it.  I was determined to take the venerable 98 Mauser (aka, Gewehr98) to the pinnacle of performance, something one wouldn't normally do against the more popular Remington 700 and Winchester Model 70 rifles used as the basis for long-range accuracy work. 

It worked like a charm.  In May of 1999, my spotter and I were invited to a regional sniper match in Ione, Kalifornia.  The targets at 500 meters were life-sized steel chickens, 4" steel plates, 3" steel plates, and golf balls.  The early dawn sight-in period went without a hitch, and we decided not to waste ammo or heat up the barrel showing off before the shooting for score commenced.

I have the golf ball, and the copy of the November 1999 Tactical Shooter magazine that spells out how a certain 6.5-06 Mauser and yours truly did what was previously thought to be impossible - namely, a first-round, cold-bore shot through the center of a Titleist brand golf ball at 500meters, aka 547 yards.   

When I eventually take my dirt nap, the rifle, the golf ball, the magazine w/expose' article, and the rifle's build sheet will go to the NRA museum in Fairfax, VA. It can stay in their basement, it can go on display, I don't care.  It'll go where it can be appreciated for the effort behind it, and what it accomplished.  My best 1000 yard group to date has been 8", although the gun is currently illegal in F-Class due to the George Vais muzzle brake contoured and screwed to the end of the barrel.  Bummer...

Otherwise, the gun is essentially worthless. Were I to sell or auction it, the rifle wouldn't even bring in what I have invested in the components used to assemble it.   It's just a sporterized Mauser, bottom line.  ;)



« Last Edit: October 26, 2008, 10:00:06 PM by Gewehr98 »
"Bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round...

http://neuralmisfires.blogspot.com

"Never squat with your spurs on!"

Perd Hapley

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Re: Value on Grandpa's 1917 Winchester 30.06?
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2008, 12:21:40 AM »
Luke/Gunclinger's dad has a really neat 1917 sporter, which he lets us play with.  It also has the ears removed, and a scope mounted.  =(  But, if you can stomach the butchery, the cool thing is what they did with the stock.  From what I can tell, someone sawed off the butt stock, and then attached a sporter style, pistol grip butt stock.  The joint is visible, but not obvious.  Then the pistol grip and fore-end were very neatly checkered.  What's so cool about it, is that the fore-end checkering covers the grooves, as well, which just gives it a very nice look and feel.  I couldn't see the grooves at first, and it took me a while to recognize what they were.  I thought it had just been dropped into a new, wooden sporter stock. 

I'll post some pictures, if anyone wants to see it.  Or maybe even if you don't. 
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