DOW just hit the 6000's...

[Manedwolf]

Dow 6,947 -115.49 

All gains since Oct. 28, 1997 erased. 12 years of growth. Gone, just like that.

I do not even want to look at the 401(k), which is a train wreck.

And it's still OMG CRISIS NEED MORE GOVERNMENT BANKERS BAD....which drives it down further.

I think they want it to crash. Make everyone dependent on the government. Why not?

[zahc]

time to buy yet?

I've been going to start investing by purchasing a some DOW and S&P 500 index funds, but it keeps falling.

[Manedwolf]

time to buy yet?

I've been going to start investing by purchasing a some DOW and S&P 500 index funds, but it keeps falling.

I think this is a falling knife, myself. Obama keeps talking it down.

[MechAg94]

I think this is a falling knife, myself. Obama keeps talking it down.

I seem to have heard that comment more and more.  Obama is definitely not preaching optimism. 

[El Tejon]

Well, now my SEP contributions buy more shares.

*rocking back and forth*  It will come back, it will come back, it will come back . . . .

[AZRedhawk44]

Unless Obama outlaws Capitalism itself, it will come back.

The way things are going now, he'll be a 1 term wonder and we'll get the house back in 2010 as well as 2-4 senate seats to get away from 60, and unless we run a total 'tard (although Stupid Party does seem apropos at times) in 2012 we'll get the White House back.

(Frackin' McCain.... grumblegrumble)

My stocks aren't doing bad at all right now.  I'm up 50% on one, up 15% on another and down 15% on a 3rd one.  But that one is an energy stock... it'll go back up later this summer or fall when supplies tighten up again.

[El Tejon]

Who has your funds?

Is it a Roth, SEP, etc.?

[AZRedhawk44]

Etrade.  Just buyin' stocks.

I do a little bit of analysis on my own for any company I'm interested in investing in, then decide to pull the trigger or not. 

[El Tejon]

Gotcha.

Did the same thing with Smith & Wesson last quarter, but usually just pump money into the SEP so I can get the tax cut.

[Balog]

I've been filling out the paperwork to start contributing to my 401k..... starting to seem like a less attractive option, but it's still a tax break for the moment I guess.

[280plus]

"Oh, bury me not on the lone prairie.
These words came sad and mournfully " 

 

[HankB]

I think this is a falling knife, myself. Obama keeps talking it down.

Every time the guy opens his mouth, the market drops. You'd think he'd realize this by now . . . and yet he KEEPS the nonsense flowing out of his pie hole.

He's either stupid, malicious, or the highest-placed Fifth Columnist we've ever had . . .  

[Manedwolf]

Every time the guy opens his mouth, the market drops. You'd think he'd realize this by now . . . and yet he KEEPS the nonsense flowing out of his pie hole.

He's either stupid, malicious, or the highest-placed Fifth Columnist we've ever had . . .  

Saul. Alinsky.

The first step in community organization is community disorganization. The disruption of the present organization is the first step toward community organization. Present arrangements must be disorganized if they are  to be displaced by new patterns.

All change means disorganization of the old and organization of the new.

- Rules for Radicals

[French G.]

I sat on the sidelines with my TSP in late 07-08, making my piddly 4.5% as the Dow cruised from 14,000 down to 9,000 something. The highlights, I moved all my money out of the stock funds within 1% of the index highs. I even made a little money moving back and forth in the early '08 retard rally. The lowlights? October of '08 I moved 100% back into stock based funds with the Dow around 9,300 and the S&P around 1050 I think. I guess I felt bad standing around making money while all you guys were jumping out of windows.  Oh well, I'm 34, I'll be filthy rich one day unless Pelosi steals my personally contributed retirement funds for the greater good.

[280plus]

"I fell into a ring of fire
I fell into, a burning ring of fire
I went down, down, down, and the flames went higher
and it burns, burns, burns
the ring of fire, the ring of fire"

 

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

I sat on the sidelines with my TSP in late 07-08, making my piddly 4.5% as the Dow cruised from 14,000 down to 9,000 something. The highlights, I moved all my money out of the stock funds within 1% of the index highs. I even made a little money moving back and forth in the early '08 retard rally. The lowlights? October of '08 I moved 100% back into stock based funds with the Dow around 9,300 and the S&P around 1050 I think. I guess I felt bad standing around making money while all you guys were jumping out of windows.  Oh well, I'm 34, I'll be filthy rich one day unless Pelosi steals my personally contributed retirement funds for the greater good.

You still managed to miss a lot of the drop.  Nothing wrong with that.

[RaspberrySurprise]

[MillCreek]

*rocking back and forth*  It will come back, it will come back, it will come back . . . .

+1000 to this.  The only question I have is if it will do so before I am dead.

[ilbob]

a lot of people bought government bonds over the years when the price looked attractive thinking that governments have armies and tax collectors, so how bad can it get.

a lot of those countries no longer even exist, and some that do their bonds became completely worthless.

[makattak]

a lot of people bought government bonds over the years when the price looked attractive thinking that governments have armies and tax collectors, so how bad can it get.

a lot of those countries no longer even exist, and some that do their bonds became completely worthless.

Which leads me to the scary question whose answer I don't want to ponder:

What happens when people stop buying US Treasury bonds?

(I KNOW what happens, it's more a question of IF and/or WHEN this will happen)

[Manedwolf]

6700's.

Resistance, in terms used in the market, is apparently futile.

[RevDisk]

Well, now my SEP contributions buy more shares.

*rocking back and forth*  It will come back, it will come back, it will come back . . . .

Looking over the numbers, stock market got overvalued in the 90's, and corrected a bit.  But IMHO, monkeying with delaying the correction caused all manor of issues.  Some folks don't seem to ever realize that sometimes you have to accept a little pain today to prevent a bigger pain tomorrow. 

The market will bounce back.  Not quickly.  Basically, every time Obama spends $100 billion, imagine the US economy taking another month or two longer to recover. 


I'm putting a very reasonable (matched) percent into my 401k.  Primarily into an S&P 500 index fund, but a modest amount into my company stock and a stable growth fund that hits 4-5% (give or take) like clockwork.  When times are good, I plan on (very slowly) dumping some of the S&P money into the stable growth.  When times are bad, I plan on (very slowly) dumping some of the stable growth into the S&P500. 

I have a couple stocks outside my 401k, but they tend to be modest and only individual companies I am familiar with.  I plan on holding onto them very long term.

Which leads me to the scary question whose answer I don't want to ponder:

What happens when people stop buying US Treasury bonds?

(I KNOW what happens, it's more a question of IF and/or WHEN this will happen)

Won't completely happen.  Many t-bills are essentially manditory to purchase by credit unions and such.  Also, your social security money is dumped into t-bills.  If people stopped buying t-bills, the interest rates on t-bills would have to be increased.  If the percentage was high enough, people would buy them.  Aside from short term disruptions (which the Treasury maintains enough funds to smooth out), t-bills are fine for the long haul. 

Unless the US government defaults on any single t-bill, then the monetary policy of the US government comes apart like 105mm artillery round impacting a very large turbine engine

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

Which leads me to the scary question whose answer I don't want to ponder:

What happens when people stop buying US Treasury bonds?

(I KNOW what happens, it's more a question of IF and/or WHEN this will happen)

But will it happen?  The stock market is worth zilch.  Bonds are no good.  Commodities are sketchy.  Banks are failing.  There aren't a whole lot of alternatives left for parking serious sums of money. 

I can't fathom treasuries being undesirable until the rest of the financial world picks up again.  Not unless something utterly stupid happens like Obama choosing to default on some treasuries, just to destroy the economy even further.

[Manedwolf]

Also, London got smashed. Down 5.33%. Think people didn't like Brown begging the US for a handout?

[makattak]

Won't completely happen.  Many t-bills are essentially manditory to purchase by credit unions and such.  Also, your social security money is dumped into t-bills.  If people stopped buying t-bills, the interest rates on t-bills would have to be increased.  If the percentage was high enough, people would buy them.  Aside from short term disruptions (which the Treasury maintains enough funds to smooth out), t-bills are fine for the long haul. 

Unless the US government defaults on any single t-bill, then the monetary policy of the US government comes apart like 105mm artillery round impacting a very large turbine engine

But will it happen?  The stock market is worth zilch.  Bonds are no good.  Commodities are sketchy.  Banks are failing.  There aren't a whole lot of alternatives left for parking serious sums of money. 

I can't fathom treasuries being undesirable until the rest of the financial world picks up again.  I mean, unless something utterly stupid happens like Obama choosing to default on some treasuries, just to destroy the economy even further.

Will it happen? I don't know- hence my if.

Currently it is still an extremely unlikely possibility.

However, if the government continues to spend money like it is, we may eventually reach that point.

A monetary collapse is NEVER impossible for a country. It is still highly unlikely, but less so than it was just a year ago.

I don't think the sky is falling, but I do think it's necessary to take a sober look at just how much borrowing the government will be doing. This government is BORROWING 10% of the US GDP. Not spending, BORROWING 10%.

Next year, our GDP will be lower. (Partly due to the fact that the government is spending so much). How much will the government borrow in order to save us from that?

There is a limit to just how much they can continue to borrow. I'm not sure where that limit is, but once we reach it, our microscopic level of inflation will sky rocket.

Please don't read this as predicting that it is about to happen. Rather, I am sobered by the thought that it's no longer inconceivable.