Author Topic: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?  (Read 3874 times)

AZRedhawk44

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I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« on: March 02, 2009, 04:32:31 PM »
I've decided I oppose the current Western idea of Human Rights.

This abusive concept is responsible for the staggering debt being foisted upon our unborn generations of Americans.  It is an anchor around the neck of our Economy.  It is a slimy miasma that seductively globs itself onto valid moral standards and then acts as a barrier to truly understanding them.

The war on poverty.  The right to health care.  The right to state sanctioned behavior of any type.  The right to home ownership.  The right to education.  The right to a social safety net in the event of hard times.  The list is endless.

The core of this ludicrous understanding of Human Rights lays in the wrong understanding of just what a "right" is.  These people consider anything necessary to stave off unintended consequences to be a right.

Citibank going under?  It's our right to have the government bail them out and save our 401k's.
GM going under?  It's our right to have the government protect the jobs of those union workers.
Huge hospital bills?  It's our right to get miraculous treatment and not incur any debt that alters our spending habits.
2.5GPA?  It's our right to go to a school just like the NHS students that pulled 4.0's, and not to have to pay more than them either!
Out of work?  It's our right to continue to look for a job in our narrow career field rather than getting something to pay the bills NOW and get off the government dole... or pursue placement education on the government dime while also collecting unemployment.
Your house is upside-down in value and you want/need to move?  It's your right to coerce the bank into adjusting the loan so that not only would you owe nothing, but your prior payments give you equity into the adjusted value of the home, enabling you to move.
You're 65 and want to retire, living the life of the traveling snowbird?  It's your right to Social Security, Medicare and all the additional increased or invented benefits that were voted into place during the tail end of your tax paying years.  It's also your right to the latest medical treatments to keep you alive for another 40 years... but you don't want to have to pay for them yourself!  Heck, if you don't have a healthy portfolio to live off of, it's your right to increased government subsidies to raise your standard of living so you aren't a burden on your younger generations.

These aren't Rights.  These are Robberies.

I won't acknowledge them as rights.

Let me tell you what a "right" is.  A right is a course of action a person might choose to undertake... or not choose.  In that course of (in)action, a person will be unfettered by any restrictions.  EXCEPT:  his actions must not act in any way to impede the right of another person.

Rights do not co-mingle.  Any perceived right that depends upon the compliance or graciousness of another person's actions is by definition not a right.

A right to health care?  Tell that to a Doctor that refuses to work because of retirement or simple choice.  Will you force that Doctor to treat at gunpoint?  Will you make him a slave?

A right to unemployment?  Tell that to the taxpayer who deliberately decreases his income and standard of living because he's disgusted by your slothlike behavior.  Will you send the men with guns to his door to take more?

A right to escape intimidating debt?  Tell that to your banker when you attempt to withdraw money from your savings and he tells you to pound sand... he's covering an upside down mortgage with it.  Or tell that to the grocer when your weekly $100 grocery bill doubles due to inflation from your irresponsible dodging of your loans.

All actions that are not rights, carry burdens or consequences for others.

I oppose carrying the burden of any more strangers, especially at the muzzle of the Government Gun.
"But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist."
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Uncle Bubba

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2009, 04:39:10 PM »


Preach it, brother!
It's a strange world. Some people get rich and others eat *expletive deleted*it and die. Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

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Matthew Carberry

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2009, 04:40:05 PM »
How DARE you redefine the redefinition of "human rights" back to its historical basis!

How DARE you sir!

 =D
"Not all unwise laws are unconstitutional laws, even where constitutional rights are potentially involved." - Eugene Volokh

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Leatherneck

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2009, 04:54:07 PM »
Oh, I believe in human rights, and I bet you do too. They're listed in The Owner's Manual. Specifically, the first ten amendments thereto.

TC
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Nick1911

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2009, 04:55:58 PM »
I think, more correctly, you oppose entitlements, sold under the guise of "rights".

Human rights aren't entitlements.  Your rights don't cost me anything.

Leatherneck

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2009, 05:04:02 PM »
Well said, Nick.

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Perd Hapley

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2009, 07:55:39 PM »
The way I heard it, true rights are "negative rights."  But I hear some folks don't like that term, as it is too - er - negative. 
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Standing Wolf

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2009, 08:11:20 PM »
Quote
These aren't Rights.  These are Robberies.

Shhhhh! That's supposed to be a secret!
No tyrant should ever be allowed to die of natural causes.

Bigjake

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2009, 09:08:16 PM »
Well said.

Myself

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #9 on: March 02, 2009, 11:56:03 PM »
I thunked that life liberty and the pursuit of happiness covered everything.  Boy were I naive.

Perd Hapley

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2009, 12:19:42 AM »
Yes, but how can I enjoy my right to life, unless you guarantee me a house?  And medical care?  And food?  And a pension for my old age? 

And how can I be happy without an HD converter box?  And birth control?  And the Firefly Boxed Set?
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

BridgeRunner

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2009, 12:28:13 AM »
And the Firefly Boxed Set?

There's a government program for that? Where do I sign up?

Perd Hapley

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2009, 12:30:00 AM »
I have a feeling Firefly and Atlas Shrugged are two of the things our tax money will NOT be paying for. 
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

Jeff B.

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2009, 01:17:23 AM »
What the heck ever happened to working and providing for your family?

I (my family) have been through hard times (70's) and made it through by pulling together.

My brother came back from the Army (CO CDR) and lived at home and worked a factory job until he got accepted to Grad School.  There was no, "I deserved this or that", we wer poroud that he got accepted, the first in our family to not only complete an Undergraduate Degree, but to undertake (an complete) an MBA.

Why work or strive if the "gubmint" will provide everything.

I'm at the point of saying, when (not if) I get layed off, I'll lay back and let "THEM" take care of me...

Well... not really.  But it sounds good.

 =D

Jeff B.
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HankB

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2009, 01:28:39 PM »
How dare you say that I don't have a HUMAN RIGHT to impose obligations on other people against their will!!!!
Trump won in 2016. Democrats haven't been so offended since Republicans came along and freed their slaves.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #15 on: March 03, 2009, 01:32:10 PM »
He is an enemy of the people!
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

Leatherneck

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #16 on: March 03, 2009, 07:01:57 PM »
Quote
And how can I be happy without an HD converter box?  And birth control?  And the Firefly Boxed Set?
You have the right to PURSUE happiness, TP. You don't have the right to catch it.

TC
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Perd Hapley

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #17 on: March 03, 2009, 09:20:03 PM »
You have the right to PURSUE happiness, TP. You don't have the right to catch it.

TC

fascist reactionary!   :mad:
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Scout26

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2009, 09:44:13 PM »
AZ,

We've got local elections here coming up on April 7th.

Can I write you in for every open office ??
Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help.


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digitalandanalog

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #19 on: March 04, 2009, 12:59:09 AM »
Americans have forgotten what the real meaning of RIGHT is!

However, I do disagree when the system allows obvious abuse of the lower and middle classes to continue while they are made to suffer at the hand of cruel masters.

Bitch, scream and moan at me for that last statement...I don't care. I feel that I am right and I will not be shaken.

I am hardly what you would call a liberal, but I do see eye to eye with a few of them.

De Selby

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2009, 06:17:38 AM »
The progression of this idea has been extremely interesting to say the least.

From as far back as we have writing in Western civilization, up until the enlightenment (including the Founding Fathers), there was an ingrained principle of people having a right to life.  Not a right to be wealthy, but a positive right to sustenance.  And that makes sense, given the system of lordship and serfdom that this culture developed out of...in a lordship, the lord has responsibilities to the serfs because he is the master of all that goes on with respect the land.  This was true even of slavery - slave owners didn't deny their slaves' positive rights to sustenance.

Along comes the industrial revolution, and suddenly people start saying you have no right to anything but what you can scratch out for yourself from the marketplace.  And at that time, given the power and expanse of the elite, it was like the landlord saying he had no responsibility to the serfs.

This new concept of "negative rights" would clearly have been foreign to the Founding Fathers, and probably revolting to everyone before them.  I can't think of a single trend that would support it...but then again all those thinkers tended to be landlord class types and religious philosophers; the powerful middle class of the industrial revolution post 1800 would've come from a different cultural background, and the thinking they paid for and engaged in to justify their policies shows it.
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

Matthew Carberry

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2009, 02:28:28 PM »
The "right of sustenance" you're describing would be more properly described not as a right of the serf, but rather a responsibility of the leige.  Noblesse oblige.

If I claim to in some sense own or control another person, I become to a degree responsible for their well being.  Quid pro quo.

Once they leave my service I have no further responsibility to them.  In a feudal system, if the serf leaves the land, my land, my responsibility for their well-being ends and they are on their own.  They are "out laws", outside the system, bound to none but provided for by none as well.

After slavery and the feudal system went away the "right to sustenance" by definition went away as well as there were no more nobles to be directly oblige'd.

A government of free men has no responsibility to care for its citizenry, merely to provide a system where they are not impeded by said government or the criminal actions of others in caring for themselves. 

The "safety net", orphanages, homes for invalids or the aged, soup kitchens and the like, is to be provided by willing private members of the society, whether family or voluntary charitable organizations.  A society founded on Western moral structures would have those services provided or funded privately by the wealthy who retain a certain sense of noblesse oblige to the less fortunate in general.

"Not all unwise laws are unconstitutional laws, even where constitutional rights are potentially involved." - Eugene Volokh

"As for affecting your movement, your Rascal should be able to achieve the the same speeds no matter what holster rig you are wearing."

seeker_two

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #22 on: March 04, 2009, 03:26:38 PM »
I have a feeling Firefly and Atlas Shrugged are two of the things our tax money will NOT be paying for. 

We'll be lucky if the gov't doesn't start hunting down people wearing brown coats....  =|
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Strings

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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #23 on: March 04, 2009, 05:56:44 PM »
"Your coat is a kinda... browninsh... color... "

"I got it on sale"

 =D
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Re: I oppose Human Rights. Who's with me?
« Reply #24 on: March 04, 2009, 06:03:25 PM »
"Your coat is a kinda... browninsh... color... "

"I got it on sale"

 =D

"Funny, Sir, how you always find yourself in some Alliance-friendly bar come U-Day, looking for a 'quiet drink.'"
Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help.


Bring me my Broadsword and a clear understanding.
Get up to the roundhouse on the cliff-top standing.
Take women and children and bed them down.
Bless with a hard heart those that stand with me.
Bless the women and children who firm our hands.
Put our backs to the north wind.
Hold fast by the river.
Sweet memories to drive us on,
for the motherland.