Author Topic: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies  (Read 7362 times)

Perd Hapley

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Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« on: May 09, 2009, 10:56:17 PM »
I am taking a few minutes off from writing my finals paper, but once I hand that in next week, I'll be setting up a couple of used computers for me and my Dad.  These two computers will be getting XP, but I will be installing Ubuntu on another one (or two) machines pretty soon. 

Any tips?  Does it matter in which order I install programs?  I'll be starting with the OS, of course.  I've figured out that much. 

jfruser, I've seen some of your advice in past threads, so I'll be keeping that in mind.  Installing virus protection from a disk before going online, etc.  You said hide icons to IE & Outlook.  How do you do that, just scoot 'em to the recycle bin? 

My Dad has a copy of Works 99, but I guess he'd be better off with Open Office.  Or would it be too much to install both?  His computer will be a P4, 1.7 GHz, with 1 GB of SDRAM.

Thanks. 
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Sindawe

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2009, 11:49:30 PM »
Quote
Any tips?

With the Windows boxen, set the PC up with two partions.  One for the boot OS and another for data and applications. Set all the standard programs (Word processors, Spreadsheet, Inet Brower et alii) to save to the data/application partion then purchase and install something like Faronics Deep Freeze.  Once installed and the OS partion is frozen, any changes made to same will vanish on the next reboot.  Spyware, viri and abnoxous other junk included.  If your Dad is not next door, it might we wise to enable RDP and leave him directives to find the IP address of the machine when you need to get into it to fix stuff.

Make sure you give your Dad directions and training on how to save to the 2nd data partion.


For AV, the most recent favorite I have is Avira, although ESET [urlhttp://www.eset.com/products/nod32.php]NOD32[/url] did show its quality with a badly infected PC at work this past week.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #2 on: May 10, 2009, 12:38:43 AM »
I'm also using Avira on this machine (P4, 1.8 GHz, 1 GB SDRAM) and I like the fact that I hardly notice it is there.  Takes almost no time at start-up.  I cannot say the same for AVG or Avast.  I will be using Avira for Dad's computer as well.

Unfortunately, I had an issue where the Avira just seemed to disappear for a while.  It would let me know it was updating from time to time, but I couldn't find the program, to tell it to scan.  And there was no friendly red umbrella to be seen.  Reinstalled, and all is well. 
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roo_ster

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #3 on: May 10, 2009, 02:06:30 AM »
fistful:

If you have Open Office, ditch MS Works.  Not worth the disk space if you have a half-decent alternative.

I always download the latest & greatest drivers for all HW possible before install & burn to CD or put on thumb drive. 

If you look in C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Desktop and  C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Start Menu you will find some shortcuts to applications.  If you 86 the ones you don't want users to mess with, most unsophisticated users will not go noodling through the directory structure to find the executable to, uh, execute.

Here is a tip you might want to follow if you expect wild & wooly-ness from users or having to rebuild the same machine multiple times:
After building a PC up to the point you would hand it over to a user, image the HD to an extra external hard drive you have handy.  That way, if/when the install goes tits up, you can re-image the machine much faster than to a complete re-install.

There are many tools that will do this.  You can pay for Ghost to have a nice GUI.  But, a live linux CD will likely have such tools, the oldest & most basic of which is "dd."

Also, you might want to limit your dad at first.  Instead of letting him run as admin or power user, make his account just plain ol' user-level permissions.  That is how I do it with my home desktop and my wife's lappy. 

Good luck.  You have just entered the special level of Hell reserved for people who help family with computers.  Expect to get calls asking you to solve problems that your family can not adequately describe to you on the phone.  Expect them to not remember what you taught them the last time.  Expect them, when they go out to buy hardware & software, to ignore your advice, buy some POS HW/SW, and then call you up and ask you to support that POS you warned them against.
Regards,

roo_ster

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Perd Hapley

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #4 on: May 10, 2009, 02:27:32 AM »
Maybe I shouldn't have asked.   :lol:  I more or less understand the techno-babble of those two replies, but I'm not sure I am ready to implement that sort of thing just yet.  Maybe I can re-configure or re-install Dad's computer that way in a year or two, once I get a little more experience. 

I know I'm setting myself up for some frustration here, but I really need the experience points.  I don't know why, but I have been hit with the strangest urge to un-stupid myself in the area of computers.  The two people I'm going to be IT'ing for are my Dad and my wife, neither of whom are terribly demanding.  I don't think either one wants to use a computer that much - maybe checking email two or three times a week, or writing word doc's.  I'm pretty sure my wife hasn't asked to use my computer more than two dozen times in the past four years.  And since I bought her several DVD's worth of Whose Line Is It, Anyway?, she has even less use for a computer.  She used to watch those on YouTube sometimes. 

« Last Edit: May 10, 2009, 02:30:43 AM by fistful »
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lee n. field

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2009, 02:10:51 PM »
Quote
Any tips?  Does it matter in which order I install programs?  I'll be starting with the OS, of course.  I've figured out that much.

Install XP first (if you must install it at all).  Install Ubuntu later.  The Ubuntu install will set up XP as an option on it's boot loader.  XP won't.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2009, 02:34:03 PM »
Does a dual boot use a lot of resources, or just the hard drive space taken up by the OS that you're not using? 
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Vodka7

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2009, 02:43:29 PM »
Does a dual boot use a lot of resources, or just the hard drive space taken up by the OS that you're not using? 

Just the hard drive space for the OS and apps, nothing else.  When you're booted into one it's like the other OS doesn't exist, basically.

Sindawe

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2009, 03:21:23 PM »
Quote
Expect to get calls asking you to solve problems that your family can not adequately describe to you on the phone.  Expect them to not remember what you taught them the last time.  Expect them, when they go out to buy hardware & software, to ignore your advice, buy some POS HW/SW, and then call you up and ask you to support that POS you warned them against.

Truth /ephatic cough

Even with just email and writing documents, I've spent about six hours this past week providing support to my mother in the writting of my sister's term papers. 

"I can't find the files"

"I can't save the files"

"My printer is broken"

"I don't know my right from my left"  - that one prompted by inisting that the list of files in Windows Explorer is on the left side of window when she mentally turns her body around to look OUT from the monitor. [Bang head against desk]



I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

Perd Hapley

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2009, 04:59:40 PM »
Quote
"I don't know my right from my left"  - that one prompted by inisting that the list of files in Windows Explorer is on the left side of window when she mentally turns her body around to look OUT from the monitor. [Bang head against desk]

 :laugh:
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erictank

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2009, 09:18:15 PM »
Truth /ephatic cough

Even with just email and writing documents, I've spent about six hours this past week providing support to my mother in the writting of my sister's term papers. 

"I can't find the files"

"I can't save the files"

"My printer is broken"

"I don't know my right from my left"  - that one prompted by inisting that the list of files in Windows Explorer is on the left side of window when she mentally turns her body around to look OUT from the monitor. [Bang head against desk]

Okay, wow.  THAT'S impressive.  Thank God I have a relatively-tech-savvy family - my Mom generally remembers when I tell her how to do certain computer-related things, and I get a lot fewer tech-support requests anyways, now that she's buying her own PCs rather than relying on my old (OLD) hand-me-down units.


lee n. field

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2009, 10:28:52 PM »
Quote
Does a dual boot use a lot of resources, or just the hard drive space taken up by the OS that you're not using?

No, just the disk space.

Another option, if you've got enough ram, is to install the second OS as a virtual machine running under the first OS.

VirtualBox or M$' Virtual PC.
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At thy right hand pleasures for evermore.

go_bang

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2009, 10:40:39 PM »
At my job I help support a more than a few people how are almost completely daft and senseless when it comes to computers.  Maybe I can offer a few ideas from what I've learned.

First, make sure the primary accounts user accounts are not members of the Administrators group.  Make them members of the Power User group.  Then make a pair of administrator accounts.  If they start to show some common sense and willingness to learn how to use the computer safely and properly then give them the login for one of the adminstrator accounts and show them how to use the Run As function to do things that Power Users are restricted from.  If they turn out to be the kind of users that can't help but click on every spam link or pop-up that is presented to them, then the extra restrictions of the Power User account coupled with a good antivirus/antispyware program will prevent a lot of malware from getting a firm hold on the system.  Most of them will fail to install, and others will only partially install, before the antivirus software takes their heads off.  There is a gotcha with this setup though.  Some programs won't automatically update themselves when run under Power User accounts, so you may want to periodically check on the PC and update stuff like Adobe Flash, Firefox, Java, etc.

Second, set up a free account with http://www.no-ip.com/ or a similar service.  Create a domain name on their site for the computer, such as mydad.no-ip.com, and install the client on the PC so it can update No-IP with the PC's current IP address.  Once that is done install RealVNC Server (http://www.realvnc.com/) on the machine, but configure it so it does not start automatically.  Set it for manual startup and give the user a nice, clear icon in the Windows menu to click on to start it.  Once it's running you point your VNC client to the No-IP domain and you'll have control of the desktop.

Third, set Firefox as the default web browser and hide all the Internet Explorer icons.  Installing the Ad Block add-on would be a good idea as well.

Other good ideas:

Set up an account for them with OpenDNS (http://www.opendns.com/) and install the OpenDNS Updater client on the PC.  Now you can log onto the OpenDNS account, configure the account to at least block phishing sites, and set up the PC's DNS config for OpenDNS.  Later if they ask you if there is anyway to block other types of sites you can give them the login for the OpenDNS account and let them set their own filtering.

If you don't want to muck with Linux or buy drive imaging software, but want a fairly quick way to restore the PC back to your initial config, use the Backup app that comes with Windows.  Install and configure everything, then use Backup to make a backup of the system onto a USB hard drive or flash drive (make sure you include the System State as part of the backup).  If you ever need to wipe the drive and start over all you need to do is put on a basic install of Windows, connect your USB drive, start Backup, and run a restore.


Perd Hapley

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2009, 10:43:31 PM »
Thanks.  Will a 2 Gig flash drive hold a Back Up, or will I need bigger? 
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go_bang

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #14 on: May 10, 2009, 10:48:39 PM »
Thanks.  Will a 2 Gig flash drive hold a Back Up, or will I need bigger? 

You're welcome.  I would use 8GB flash drives.  You'll have enought room that way and they don't cost that much anymore.

Perd Hapley

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #15 on: May 10, 2009, 11:49:28 PM »
Hey!  Here's a question I forgot to ask.  Can anyone recommend a checklist, or something you use to test a new install?  I've got sound driver problems on 2 out of the three installs I've done so far, but didn't even know it 'til a week or two went by.  ;/
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Gewehr98

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #16 on: May 11, 2009, 12:20:32 AM »
Quote
Does a dual boot use a lot of resources, or just the hard drive space taken up by the OS that you're not using? 

Do what I do.

Removable hard drive cassettes, one for each OS.  Pop out Windows XP, put in SuSE Linux, etc.
"Bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round...

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Perd Hapley

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #17 on: May 12, 2009, 04:19:15 AM »
Finals are over.  So let the fun begin.   =)
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lee n. field

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #18 on: May 12, 2009, 08:16:10 AM »
Quote
Will a 2 Gig flash drive hold a Back Up, or will I need bigger? 

How should we know?

Quote
Can anyone recommend a checklist, or something you use to test a new install?

Windows: clean device mangler, apply XP service pack 3 and all windows updates, antivirus, firefox, flash player for IE and Firefox,  latest Acrobat Reader,  openoffice or other office program of choice.  You either build up to that, with a bare metal install, or pare back to that from a out of the box consumer grade junk laden system.

Ubuntu, just run updates until nothing left.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #19 on: May 12, 2009, 11:05:22 AM »
Thanks.  How does one "clean" the device mangler/muncher/mauler/molester? 

Actually, though, I was asking how to TEST a system to check for stuff what went wrong.  Like I said, I've had some things screwed up, but didn't realize it until later. 
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lee n. field

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #20 on: May 12, 2009, 01:24:28 PM »
Quote
How does one "clean" the device mangler/muncher/mauler/molester?

"Clean" here is an adjective, not a verb.  By clean, I mean nothing in device manager with a red X, yellow exclaimation point.

Test it?  Peruse the system and application event logs.  Use good hardware, don't load your system down with crapware, it'll run well for longer.  Click YES! to every InterWebz comeon, be a gamer running beta drivers, then run it will not so well.
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Phantom Warrior

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #21 on: May 12, 2009, 06:06:49 PM »
Windows: clean device mangler, apply XP service pack 3 and all windows updates, antivirus, firefox, flash player for IE and Firefox,  latest Acrobat Reader,  openoffice or other office program of choice.  You either build up to that, with a bare metal install, or pare back to that from a out of the box consumer grade junk laden system.

I strongly recommend Foxit Reader instead of Acrobat for a .pdf reader.  Foxit Reader is small, fast, and awesome.  And free.  You can read more here.

roo_ster

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #22 on: May 12, 2009, 06:39:27 PM »
I strongly recommend Foxit Reader instead of Acrobat for a .pdf reader.  Foxit Reader is small, fast, and awesome.  And free.  You can read more here.

And much less annoying.
Regards,

roo_ster

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Perd Hapley

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #23 on: May 13, 2009, 12:47:04 PM »
Do I want .NET Framework stuff?

Smart Card Cryptographic Service Provider?

Windows Search 4.0?
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Marnoot

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Re: Setting Up "New" Computers For Dummies
« Reply #24 on: May 13, 2009, 01:26:45 PM »
Get the .NET Framework stuff as many applications require it. The other two I wouldn't bother with.