Author Topic: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars  (Read 7606 times)

AZRedhawk44

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VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« on: February 27, 2010, 03:01:21 PM »
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.85b9e2174ee33f025b89dd95cee83b08.101&show_article=1

Quote
A journey from Earth to Mars could soon take just 39 days, cutting current travel time nearly six times, a rocket scientist who has the ear of the US space agency NASA has said.

Former astronaut Franklin Chang-Diaz, a physicist at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, says reaching the Red Planet could be dramatically quicker using his high-tech VASIMR rocket -- now on track for lift-off after decades of development.

The Variable Specific Impulse Magnetoplasma Rocket -- to give its full name -- is quick becoming a centerpiece of NASA's future strategy as it looks to private firms to help meet the astronomical costs of space exploration.

NASA, still reeling from a political decision to cancel its Constellation program that would have returned a human to the moon by the end of the decade, has called on firms to provide new technology to power rovers or even future manned missions.

Never heard of this rocket before.

What is a Variable Specific Impulse Magnetoplasma Rocket?
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Cromlech

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2010, 03:17:25 PM »
Well, if wikipedia is to be trusted, it is:

"an electro-magnetic thruster for spacecraft propulsion. It uses radio waves to ionize and heat a propellant and magnetic fields to accelerate the resulting plasma to generate thrust."
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taurusowner

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2010, 04:09:20 PM »
How is this going to help NASA fight Global WarmingTM?

Viking

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2010, 04:21:02 PM »
How is this going to help NASA fight Global WarmingTM?
Silly, we'll export it to Mars of course =D.
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PTK

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2010, 04:29:07 PM »
Zing.  =D
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French G.

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2010, 05:08:20 PM »
I love how the climate alarmist tools that print National Geographic had a whole bit on how we could populate Mars. A key piece of their plan was factories that spewed tons of greenhouse gases into the martian sky in order to build an atmosphere over time.
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Tallpine

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2010, 05:13:01 PM »
Quote
What is a Variable Specific Impulse Magnetoplasma Rocket?

Quiet, too.  I doubt if our SONAR could even pick it up  :lol:
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CNYCacher

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2010, 05:45:19 PM »
Quiet, too.  I doubt if our SONAR could even pick it up  :lol:

Even if it did, they might think it was whales or something.
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Cromlech

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2010, 05:47:10 PM »
A key piece of their plan was factories that spewed tons of greenhouse gases into the martian sky in order to build an atmosphere over time.
This made me think of Total Recall.
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MechAg94

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2010, 07:58:52 PM »
I thought that Mars was supposed to be too small to hold a significant atmosphere? 
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CNYCacher

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2010, 08:04:41 PM »
Get yourself to Mars.
Get yourself to Mars.
Get yourself to Mars.
Get yourself to Mars.
Get yourself to Mars.
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Bigjake

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2010, 08:09:09 PM »
Even if it did, they might think it was whales or something.

Or some kind of seismic anomaly.  Anything but a VASIMR rocket  :laugh:

AJ Dual

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #12 on: February 27, 2010, 09:17:12 PM »
I love how the climate alarmist tools that print National Geographic had a whole bit on how we could populate Mars. A key piece of their plan was factories that spewed tons of greenhouse gases into the martian sky in order to build an atmosphere over time.

Well... That plan uses hydroflourocarbons. They're thousands of times more effective than CO2 as a greenhouse gas. So that actually has a chance of working.
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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2010, 11:08:16 PM »
I thought that Mars was supposed to be too small to hold a significant atmosphere? 

Size is irrelevant, lack of a liquid core to maintain a planetary magnetic field to deflect the solar wind is what killed the atmosphere.

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2001/ast31jan_1.htm

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2010, 11:40:18 PM »
Size is irrelevant, lack of a liquid core to maintain a planetary magnetic field to deflect the solar wind is what killed the atmosphere.

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2001/ast31jan_1.htm



True, but it would take millions of years if we built it up again. A couple chunks of comet every few centuries would make up for the losses.
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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2010, 03:36:19 AM »
A few nuclear or fusion satellites in orbit could make up for Mars weak magnetic field.

The purpose of the fluorocarbons is to get it hot enough that CO2 does not freeze at the poles, which will then help thicken the atmosphere and get more water vapor in the air, which will warm the planet, from there lichen and other hardy forms of life can do the rest. A few statites set behind Mars to reflect light onto key parts of the planet would help some more. Soon it would be pretty livable on the surface.
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PTK

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2010, 05:06:35 AM »
A few nuclear or fusion satellites in orbit could make up for Mars weak magnetic field.

The purpose of the fluorocarbons is to get it hot enough that CO2 does not freeze at the poles, which will then help thicken the atmosphere and get more water vapor in the air, which will warm the planet, from there lichen and other hardy forms of life can do the rest. A few statites set behind Mars to reflect light onto key parts of the planet would help some more. Soon it would be pretty livable on the surface.

"Soon", in this case being less than 10,000 years after beginning the terraforming.
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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #17 on: February 28, 2010, 08:57:39 AM »
Quote
climate alarmist tools that print National Geographic

actually the guys at Quad in West Virginia are pretty even keeled
 =D
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MillCreek

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2010, 10:01:24 AM »
So this is a type of ion thruster engine, which means it can only be used in space.  They will still need to boost the payload from ground to orbit using another method.

The 39 day figure must be by using continuous and accelerating thrust all the way from Earth to Mars orbit insertion.  I see that the plans are for the engine to be powered via a solar array.  Sounds very economical.
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Tallpine

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #19 on: February 28, 2010, 10:50:55 AM »
Or some kind of seismic anomaly.  Anything but a VASIMR rocket  :laugh:

But what if somebody sabotages the flux capacitor?  :O

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Sergeant Bob

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #20 on: February 28, 2010, 01:37:21 PM »
Size is irrelevant, lack of a liquid core to maintain a planetary magnetic field to deflect the solar wind is what killed the atmosphere.

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2001/ast31jan_1.htm



In addition to the problem of Mars not maintaining a steady axis. With no moon large enough to stabilize it, its axis varies between 13 to 40 degrees, which would cause wild climate swings pretty much rendering it relatively  uninhabitable. The Earth varies only 2.5 degrees over millions of years and is theorized to have caused total climate shifts.


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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #21 on: February 28, 2010, 03:26:17 PM »
We'll have to get Sean Connery to explain that "some things in there don't react well to bullets", and turn Alec Balwin loose with a 1911 to shoot the capacitor saboteur.

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #22 on: March 01, 2010, 03:51:56 AM »
Quote
   I see that the plans are for the engine to be powered via a solar array.  Sounds very economical.

Given the power requirements of ion engines, I would think it would have to be one hell of a large array, or a fission plant.  Has there been a power breakthrough with this engine?
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AJ Dual

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #23 on: March 01, 2010, 08:05:42 AM »
Given the power requirements of ion engines, I would think it would have to be one hell of a large array, or a fission plant.  Has there been a power breakthrough with this engine?

Rocket engines have two overall factors Isp - Specific Impulse, and total thrust.

Engines with a high Isp, that is they squirt out the propellant really really fast and are incredibly efficient, still may have a low overall thrust. An example of this being an ion engine. The advantage being that they're very efficient, and can operate for very long periods of time, building up acceleration like compound interest in a bank account.

Other chemical rockets, like a solid or liquid fueled  booster, the Space Shuttle, etc. may have an incredibly high thrust, but a poor Isp.

The analogy could be like comparing a garden hose with a spray nozzle vs. a river. The garden hose has a high Isp, but not lots of thrust. The river has lots of thrust, but a low Isp. Or if you prefer an electrical analogy, think of the difference between voltage and amperage.

VASIMR has some attributes of both. It accelerates the gas/plasma to the best Isp ever achieved, but also has a somewhat higher thrust than ion engines. Kind of like a fireman's hose. An extremely high Isp, but a fair amount of thrust too. And the V in VASIMR stands for "Variable", so it can temporarily generate more thrust forsaking Isp, and can also go into "cruise mode" where the Isp is maximized but thrust is less.

VASIMR still takes a ton of electricity to operate, and IMO a fission reactor would be the best choice, especially for Mars, where solar becomes marginal in terms of efficiency, but it's at least got a lot of bang for the buck, or Watt.

« Last Edit: March 01, 2010, 08:11:14 AM by AJ Dual »
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lee n. field

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Re: VASIMR Rocket: 39 days to Mars
« Reply #24 on: March 01, 2010, 09:01:05 AM »
Quote
a fission reactor would be the best

Except that would be "noooculer", and we can't have that.   :facepalm:
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