Author Topic: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?  (Read 6741 times)

Grandpa Shooter

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No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« on: March 09, 2010, 10:31:06 PM »
I don't want to raise the fur on anyone's back, but I thought this a peculiar piece to come across as I was eating supper.



Inside the cat and dog meat market in China.

Guangzhou, China (CNN) -- Dogs bark and whine behind high chain-link fences, some of them gnawing the wire so hard they bleed at the mouths while cats packed into crowded cages cower in fear if anyone approaches.

This isn't a pet store -- it's a meat market in Guangzhou, a city in southern China where eating cats and dogs is common practice.

At the Han River Dog Meat Restaurant in central Guangzhou, diners can choose from a long list of menu items, including dog soup, dog steak, dog with tofu and more. In the kitchen, the chef chops up meat for dog hot pot, one of the more popular dishes. Most customers like it spicy.

"Dog meat is good for your health and metabolism," explains Li, the hostess who declined to give her first name. "In the summer it helps you sweat."

Should cat and dog meat be banned?

But these local restaurants may have to find a new specialty. The Chinese government is considering legislation that would make eating cats and dogs illegal.

Professor Chang Jiwen of the Chinese Academy of the Social Sciences is one of the law's top campaigners. "Cats and dogs are loyal friends to humans," he said. "A ban on eating them would show China has reached a new level of civilization."
Gallery: Cat and dog meat in China
I would never eat dog meat
--Louisa Yong, cocker spaniel owner
RELATED TOPICS

    * China
    * Dogs
    * Cats

Eating dog meat is a long-standing culinary tradition not just in China, but also Korea. Cat meat can be found on the menu in China, Vietnam and even parts of South America.

The Chinese government has signaled a willingness to take the meat off the market. To avoid upsetting international visitors during the Beijing Olympics, officials ordered dog meat off the menus at local markets. Officials in Guangzhou have warned vendors to stop selling it ahead of the Asian Games which will be held there later this year.

The ban on eating dog and cat meat is part of a larger proposal to toughen laws on animal welfare. Individual violators could face up to 15 days in prison and a small fine. Businesses found guilty of selling the meat risk fines up to 500,000 yuan ($73,500.)

The legislation is gaining support from China's growing number of pet owners. With living standards rising and disposable income growing, more Guangzhou residents are investing in house pets.

"I would never eat dog meat," said Louisa Yong, as she clutches her pet cocker spaniel. "It's so cruel!"

Meat vendors have a different view.

"The dogs you raise at home, you shouldn't eat," said Pan, a butcher who also declined to give his first name. "The kind raised for eating, we can eat those."

Many of the dogs and cats sold for meat are specially raised on farms. But Chang said there is always a chance they're someone's lost or stolen pet.

In anticipation of the new ban, dog and cat meat has become more difficult to find, though some vendors say they will keep selling it as long as they can.

"The legislation will definitely affect our restaurant," said Li. "We'll just wait to see the result."

And it seems restaurants don't necessarily need to change their menus anytime soon. According to the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, the law prohibiting cat and dog meat could take as long as a decade to pass. Until then it's a la carte, from the cage into the kitchen.

RoadKingLarry

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2010, 10:46:25 PM »
Dog isn't bad. Had some in the PI many years ago.
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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2010, 11:05:11 PM »
If more people ate dogs and cats, we'd have fewer strays.

Quote
In the summer it helps you sweat
How does that work?

Scout26

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2010, 12:37:50 AM »

Quote
In the summer it helps you sweat
How does that work?

Ever try licking your own junk ??   ;)
Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help.


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Tallpine

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2010, 10:51:47 AM »
I don't eat coyotes, either ...
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tyme

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2010, 10:58:26 AM »
Quote
Professor Chang Jiwen of the Chinese Academy of the Social Sciences is one of the law's top campaigners. "Cats and dogs are loyal friends to humans," he said. "A ban on eating them would show China has reached a new level of civilization."

I'm sorry, but that's just asinine.

Anyone who's had a pet other than a cat or dog knows that many animals raised in proximity to humans can be just as friendly.  And cats... loyal?  Not exactly the word I'd use.

And feral dogs and cats can be unfriendly, to say the least.

Either you have to accept people eating any non-human animal meat, or you have to reject it all.  Picking on cat and dog meat eaters because those two animals are the most common non-caged pets is ridiculous.
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mellestad

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2010, 11:49:12 AM »
Why would we care what other people eat?  The day we tell China they can't eat dogs and cats or the French can't eat horses is the day Indians get to tell us we can't eat cows or the Iranians tell us we can't eat pork.

And I like pork.

Creeping Incrementalism

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2010, 11:59:56 AM »
Why would we care what other people eat?  The day we tell China they can't eat dogs and cats or the French can't eat horses is the day Indians get to tell us we can't eat cows or the Iranians tell us we can't eat pork.

And I like pork.

We can't eat horse in California either, per a ballot proposition that passed via popular vote about 10 years ago.  A HSUS commercial on TV is pushing this nation-wide.  A lingering fear I have about vegetarians and vegans is that, if they become common enough, I am sure they would try banning all meat.  It may be just a little way over the horizon that Berkeley or Santa Cruz tries something like this.

BridgeRunner

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2010, 02:55:45 PM »
Yes, I think what China really needs is millions more stray, feral animals and even fewer sources of food.  That will absolutely make China more civilized.

Is it just me, or is it kind of screwed up that China is trying to convince the Western world that they are civilized?  They have one of the oldest civilizations on the planet.  I happen to find many aspects of their civilization repugnant, but eating dogs and cats doesn't even make it on the list of reasons why.

mellestad

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2010, 04:55:28 PM »
We can't eat horse in California either, per a ballot proposition that passed via popular vote about 10 years ago.  A HSUS commercial on TV is pushing this nation-wide.  A lingering fear I have about vegetarians and vegans is that, if they become common enough, I am sure they would try banning all meat.  It may be just a little way over the horizon that Berkeley or Santa Cruz tries something like this.

This is a good point.  If an argument can be made for banning a use of an animal, the same argument can be made about any other use.  It isn't even a slippery slope fallacy, it is just a fact.  If you can't eat a horse, why would you be able to eat a cow?  Or a fish?  If you can't eat a horse because it is cruel, why can you hook a fish in the mouth and drag it to where it can't breathe?

Bah.  Hippies.  Really though, most of them only care about the cute animals, and the animals they see in movies.  Some do though...and at least I respect them, even though I disagree with then.

taurusowner

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2010, 05:14:17 PM »
Quote
Professor Chang Jiwen of the Chinese Academy of the Social Sciences is one of the law's top campaigners. "Cats and dogs are loyal friends to humans," he said. "A ban on eating them would show China has reached a new level of civilization."

On a list of about 100,000 things China needs to do before they can be considered "civilized", not eating dog is about #99,978.  Try freeing up the internet, allowing personal property, and closing the human slave trade first.

BlueStarLizzard

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2010, 07:47:05 PM »
i'll say the same thing about any animal butchered for meat.

as long as it is treated humanly while alive and cleanly once dead, why not?

personally, i'm not gonna eat dog, but i don't expect a hindu to eat beef either...
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The Lone Haranguer

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2010, 08:02:07 PM »
With a billion people and only so much food, eating cats and dogs may have been borne of necessity.

RoadKingLarry

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2010, 09:50:42 PM »
A lingering fear I have about vegetarians and vegans is that, if they become common enough, I am sure they would try banning all meat.  It may be just a little way over the horizon that Berkeley or Santa Cruz tries something like this.

They may like too but I don't think many people grasp the shear size of the even just the beef industry.
Cattle alone runs close to 3 Billion head a year in the US.
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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #14 on: March 10, 2010, 10:03:39 PM »
With a billion people and only so much food, eating cats and dogs may have been borne of necessity.

dogs have been meat animals long before asia had immence population. it was the first domesticated animal and its first use would have most likely been as walking MRE when the hunting was bad.
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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #15 on: March 10, 2010, 11:32:45 PM »
Yes, I think what China really needs is millions more stray, feral animals and even fewer sources of food.  That will absolutely make China more civilized.

Is it just me, or is it kind of screwed up that China is trying to convince the Western world that they are civilized?  They have one of the oldest civilizations on the planet.  I happen to find many aspects of their civilization repugnant, but eating dogs and cats doesn't even make it on the list of reasons why.

On a list of about 100,000 things China needs to do before they can be considered "civilized", not eating dog is about #99,978.  Try freeing up the internet, allowing personal property, and closing the human slave trade first.

Yeah, how's about they start treating humans decently and let them eat all the cats & dogs they can stomach.
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thebaldguy

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #16 on: March 11, 2010, 07:43:35 PM »
We have a cultural thing in the US that eating companion type animals is sort of taboo. I'm sure Hindus would like us to stop eating cattle about as bad as we want the Chinese to stop eating cats and dogs. Europeans and Japanese (they prefer former champion Thoroughbreds) eat horse which we find weird. I think Indians in the Americas ate dog as well.

I'm a vegetarian who only eats fish. I eat eggs and dairy products. It's for health reasons (uber high cholesterol and the drugs gave me bad side effects) not for moral reasons. I am not an animal rights activist or anything like that. I've had the occasional bite of home raised pork and free range chickens. It's much better tasting and better treated than the store stuff. I don't care about what people eat for meat as long as it's treated decently while alive. Most Americans are pretty stupid about where and how their meat comes from and is processed. Generally speaking, it's not pretty. It's not really home on the range for beef cattle and a nice chicken coop for your store bought poultry. Factory farms are pretty much the norm. I'm not sure it's as humane, healthy or safe as it could or should be. It could be and should be done a lot better than it is today.

That being said, my girlfriend (who is not a vegetarian) is hinting that I need to help some friends in Wisconsin with a possible wild hog problem. I'm sure I'd eat a few bites out of that hog.

mellestad

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2010, 07:50:32 PM »
We have a cultural thing in the US that eating companion type animals is sort of taboo. I'm sure Hindus would like us to stop eating cattle about as bad as we want the Chinese to stop eating cats and dogs. Europeans and Japanese (they prefer former champion Thoroughbreds) eat horse which we find weird. I think Indians in the Americas ate dog as well.

I'm a vegetarian who only eats fish. I eat eggs and dairy products. It's for health reasons (uber high cholesterol and the drugs gave me bad side effects) not for moral reasons. I am not an animal rights activist or anything like that. I've had the occasional bite of home raised pork and free range chickens. It's much better tasting and better treated than the store stuff. I don't care about what people eat for meat as long as it's treated decently while alive. Most Americans are pretty stupid about where and how their meat comes from and is processed. Generally speaking, it's not pretty. It's not really home on the range for beef cattle and a nice chicken coop for your store bought poultry. Factory farms are pretty much the norm. I'm not sure it's as humane, healthy or safe as it could or should be. It could be and should be done a lot better than it is today.

That being said, my girlfriend (who is not a vegetarian) is hinting that I need to help some friends in Wisconsin with a possible wild hog problem. I'm sure I'd eat a few bites out of that hog.

I have to ask though: If you are willing to kill something for food, why do you care about treating it nicely before the deed?  I get the empathy aspect, but I don't know if I have seen a good argument for why

thebaldguy

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #18 on: March 11, 2010, 08:43:00 PM »
Animals raised in a healthy, humane manner grow faster and are much healthier. They usually don't need the massive amounts of drugs, suppliments, and antibiotics which can end up inside you.

I've always been told that stress in an animal can change the flavor of the meat. My dad always said that deer shot after a long run didn't taste as good as the deer that slowly walked into range. I don't know if it's true or not but I've read that they mess with dogs before slaughter to change the flavor.

I would rather eat organic eggs from a free range chicken than some factory produced store eggs. The difference is huge. The meat tastes better as well.

We used to get awesome steaks from a small town butcher in central Minnesota. The steers came in from local beef ranchers. It was pretty close to free range beef. They were some of the best cuts of meat I've ever had. The butcher said the big difference was because these steers didn't live in some overcrowded, filthy feedlot eating who knows what for who knows how long.

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #19 on: March 11, 2010, 08:43:09 PM »
I'm a vegetarian who only eats fish.
Pescetarian is the term for you, rather than Vegetarian. Like one of my sister's friends (I wouldn't have known the term existed otherwise).
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taurusowner

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #20 on: March 11, 2010, 08:45:54 PM »
Honestly, I couldn't care less what people eat, or how the food is treated while it is alive.  In fact, I don't even think there should be animal abuse crimes whatsoever.  I do think people who abuse animals are sick, but only because there is a strong correlation between animal abuse and later crimes against people.  But as far as the animals themselves, IMO they are biological machines.  I think the emotional attachment people have with animals is pretty silly, at the includes food animals, pets, wildlife, etc.  I don't begrudge anyone for getting close to a pet.  You're free to do whatever you want.  But I do take issue with people who try to tell me what I can and can't do regarding animals because of their emotions.

Bottom line, I would care if the Chinese rounded up every dog in the country and burned them alive just for the hell of it, so long as they started respecting the Inalienable Rights of People.

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #21 on: March 11, 2010, 09:20:49 PM »
I have to ask though: If you are willing to kill something for food, why do you care about treating it nicely before the deed?  I get the empathy aspect, but I don't know if I have seen a good argument for why

Animals DO feel pain, inflicting unnecessary pain is cruel and wrong.
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Tallpine

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #22 on: March 11, 2010, 11:42:28 PM »
Quote
I would rather eat organic eggs from a free range chicken than some factory produced store eggs. The difference is huge. The meat tastes better as well.

And it's also a way to turn grasshoppers into palatable protein.  =)
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sanglant

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #23 on: March 11, 2010, 11:58:39 PM »
I don't eat coyotes, either ...
you missin' out man, coychili is, err good


 [barf]

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Re: No more Fido or Fluffy for supper?
« Reply #24 on: March 12, 2010, 09:59:36 AM »
I had dog soup in the PI and "You don't want to know." with vegetables in Taiwan.  :O

It was all good.  =D
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