You Get in Trouble for Saying What Folks Figure Is True

[roo_ster]

In politics, a related critter is known as the Kinsley Gaffe:

In U.S. politics, a Kinsley gaffe (or "gaffe in Washington") is an occurrence of someone telling the truth by accident. Typically, it refers to a politician inadvertently saying something publicly that they privately believe is true, but would ordinarily not say publicly because they believe it is politically harmful. The term comes from journalist Michael Kinsley, who said, "A gaffe is when a politician tells the truth." He first said this in The Guardian on 14 January 1992.

"In contrast, the Vice President of the United States frequently says stuff that makes no sense, but nobody cares because it's just random gibberish. Nobody is offended because it's not true."






http://isteve.blogspot.com/2010/06/you-get-in-trouble-for-saying-what.html

What you get in trouble for is saying out loud what everybody else already figures is true


In contrast, the Vice President of the United States frequently says stuff that makes no sense, but nobody cares because it's just random gibberish. Nobody is offended because it's not true.

What gets you in trouble is when you point out that the emperor has no clothes. As Fox and Tiger pointed out, Hans Christian Anderson was all wrong: the crowd wouldn't start to laugh at the naked emperor, they'd get really, really mad at the little boy who said what they all knew.

From the Daily Mail:

'Immigrants are making our country dumber':
    Anger as board member of Germany's central bank cites 'ample statistics'

    By Allan Hall

    A controversial board member of Bundesbank has come under fire for claiming immigrants are making Germany ‘dumber in a simple way’.

    Thilo Sarrazin told a business group in Frankfurt that people arriving in the country from Turkey, the Middle East and Africa are less educated than those from other nations.

    The 65-year-old added: ‘There’s a difference in the reproduction of population groups with varying intelligence.’

    In his speech this week, Mr Sarrazin, a former finance minister, cited what he called ‘ample statistics’ for proof.

    He said the fact that immigrants tend to have more children than Germans - who have the lowest birthrate in Europe - meant this caused ‘a different propagation of population groups with different intelligence because parents pass their intelligence on to their children’. ...

    A spokesman for a Muslim group in Berlin said; ‘He is a tired old white Christian male full of prejudice and few ideas.’   

[230RN]

Jes' numberatin'.

If a population of 500 (minority, population "A") has a growth rate of 5% per year, and another population of 600 (majority, population "B") has a growth rate of only 4% per year, it will take just under 20 years for the minority to become a majority.

Population A = 500 with a birth rate of 1.05
Population B = 600 with a birth rate of 1.04


500 * (1.05^20) > 600 * (1.04^20)


Population A = 1327, population B = 1315 in 20 years.

Just sayin'.  If my arithmetic is right.

Same numbers occur with $500 in one bank with an interest rate of 5% and $600 in another bank with an interest rate of only 4%.

Jes' numberatin', not implyin' nuthin'.

(These are PFA ("Plucked From the Air") numbers for the sake of illustration only.)

Terry, 230RN

[vaskidmark]

That's kinda strong talk coming from a German - meaning he/they carry a whole lotta baggage regarding the subject even though what he says is true/correct/accurate.

On the other hand, http://www.moviefone.com/movie/idiocracy/25980/main?flv=1

Brawno.  It's got electrolytes.

stay safe.

[MicroBalrog]

Here's why the previous poster is not quite correct:

1. How many Germans are immigrants? Is there a statistic? I remember reading that 5.4% of Germans are Muslim. But not all Muslims are immigrants and not all immigrants are Muslim.

2. Population growth rates change.

[roo_ster]

Here's why the previous poster is not quite correct:

1. How many Germans are immigrants? Is there a statistic? I remember reading that 5.4% of Germans are Muslim. But not all Muslims are immigrants and not all immigrants are Muslim.

2. Population growth rates change.

1. Quite pertinent as to the magnitude of the problem and the time required to overtake the native folks.

2. True.  The correlation has been, for the last 100+ years, the less religious the population, the lower the birth rate.  OTOH, the more religious the population, the greater the birth rate.

Unless the Germans re-Christianize in startling numbers, they can expect to be swamped by immigrant Muslims & their kiddos by 2050 or so.

[lee n. field]

Here's why the previous poster is not quite correct:

1. How many Germans are immigrants? Is there a statistic? I remember reading that 5.4% of Germans are Muslim. But not all Muslims are immigrants and not all immigrants are Muslim.

I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the Arab Christians chased out of the Middle East ended up in Europe.

[AZRedhawk44]

The only argument I have with the German's numbers is the fact that after Generation Zero (the actual immigrant), the subsequent generations participate in the same school system that Germans do.

Now... if you use a "melting pot" philosophy to societal integration, immigrants are not a problem.

If you allow them to balkanize and bring the 3rd World with them to your country, then immigrants ARE a problem.

[dogmush]

The only argument I have with the German's numbers is the fact that after Generation Zero (the actual immigrant), the subsequent generations participate in the same school system that Germans do.

This assumes that participation in the same schools gives the same outcome regardless of home environment.  I don't think that's the case.

If the case is made that immigrant parents/families raise their kids to care less about school then german families then the lack of education would continue past generation zero.

I'm have no idea however if that's actually the case with Germans and their predominant immigrants.

[Racehorse]

1. How many Germans are immigrants? Is there a statistic?

Lots. My wife is from Germany, and I've been there a few times. I would say I see proportionately as many Turks there as I see Mexicans here. Basically, for right or wrong, the Turks there are viewed very similarly to the Mexicans here. I've heard similar comments from Americans about the different birth rates in the Hispanic and other minority communities here, as well.

Here are some numbers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Germany

[230RN]

Terry, 230RN, said:

Jes' numberatin', not implyin' nuthin'.

(These are PFA ("Plucked From the Air") numbers for the sake of illustration only.)

[Scout26]

Idiocracy was not a comedy, but a documentary.


(Damn, VAS beat me to it.....)

[vaskidmark]

I've sat on this waiting for anybody to catch the "baggage" reference I made a few days ago.  So far no takers.

Guess I'll have to be Capt. Obvious for the moment.  Godwin be darned to heck!

German official rants about untermenchen despoiling the country by virtue of being less intelligent, less educated, and breeding like rabbits as opposed to the Germans whom I guess breed like elephants only with a longer gestation period.

And as for the melting-pot vs. balkanization discussion - seems folks are either forgetting or do not realize that Germany is not known for any history of homogenity - even among their own folks.  It's been worse in various past epochs, but possibly the only ones in western Europe who are worse are the Italians, where different streets in the same city seem to have centuries-long histories of animosity and blood feuding.

In a way I'm still amazed that the Turks have not been displaced too much by those from the former East German regions.  My guess is that the social welfare net extends far enough to keep them contented as opposed to driving them to seek work that the fatcat West Germans won't do.

I'm not as up on the Gernam Anti-Nazi laws as I'd like to be for this discussion, but it seems to me that the remarks made were skirting very close to the line.  And I do not see a whole lot of coverage of either the remarks themself or opposition to them and the speaker.  Makes me wonder.

stay safe.