Author Topic: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove  (Read 9354 times)

RevDisk

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Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« on: February 16, 2011, 02:05:43 PM »
I’ve heard of multiple versions of this concept. You can theoretically make it out of any cans. Soda cans, beer cans, soup cans, etc. I went with beer cans because they have thicker metal than soda cans and are the approximate size I wanted. The 12 oz Heineken can is appealing because of the bands around the can.


Making and assembling the stove is very simple and quick.

Take three cans.




Cut in half.



First can – Burner, cut approximately half an inch from the bottom.
Second can – Cover, cut to the bottom of the lower band (0.75 inch).
Third can – Fuel holder, cut to the top of the lower band (1.25 inch).





It is recommended to mark your holes with a Sharpie prior to drilling, but you can eyeball it and probably be fine.



Take the first section (0.50 inch). If your Heineken 12 oz can has stamped numbers on the bottom, try to sand it out as much as possible. Take a penny and put it in the center of the section (it should be acting as a bowl to center the penny). Hit it with any hard object. It should leave a slight indentation. Mark three or four holes within the indentation (ie covered by the penny), and drill them out with a 1/16th drill bit.



Drill six equally distanced holes just outside the ring at the very bottom of the can. The drill holes should be touching the outside base of the ring. Again, use a 1/16th inch drill bit. Once you complete the drilling, remove the bit and insert it into each hole. Bent towards the center of the can section.

Make 12 crimps on upper part of the first section (where you made your cut to section the can). Make them roughly equal, approximately three quarters the depth of the section. Drill a 1/16th hole in each crimp. Placement does not need to be exact.



Now sandpaper all locations that you made cuts. You want smooth edges. You want to avoid being cut, and you also want crisp fitting.

Insert the first section (the burner) into the third section (fuel holder). See picture if you can’t figure out the proper orientation.



How to test:

Pour denatured alcohol into center of the interior ring. Let completely drain. Cover intake holes with penny. Refill the interior ring until it reaches the very top of the ring. If some spills over, this is fine. Ignite carefully.

Watch the flames. After the initial burn, the flame should seperate into the six individual jets. If they don’t and it is one giant fire, you don’t have a tight fit between the burner and fuel holder sections. You can try removing the burner and bending into a better shape. You can also leave the burner in place and use epoxy along the edge.





I'll be dorking around with the design and probably posting the modifications at http://revdisk.org/blog/?p=115

I want to play around with the jet locations/sizes and overall size, verses time/temperature charts.  Need to make a digital thermometer that outputs temperature readings.  Time to fire up the soldering iron. 
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AZRedhawk44

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2011, 02:10:18 PM »
I just built two of these using Bud Light aluminum bottles.

My brother's coming over tomorrow evening and we're going to drink 4 more Bud Lights and make 4 more of these. ;)

I used this guy's recipe:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcrW27Leo4w

Works awesome. 

It brought 8 ounces of water to a boil in less than 3 minutes.  Used about half an ounce of isopropyl alcohol to do it.  Weighs, with 4 ounces of fuel, less than a quarter as much as my current backpacker's stove with disposable fuel cells.
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41magsnub

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2011, 02:15:16 PM »
How does the heat output compare to say an MSR whisperlight?

I've got one of those along with a single burner Coleman.  Haven't used either in years but as I recall they did pretty well though I don't remember enough about the use to quantify anything.

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2011, 02:16:07 PM »
Stuffing a tuft of fiberglass insulation batting in between the cans will help it hold the alcohol and control it's output.
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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2011, 02:29:01 PM »
Sounds complicated and dangerous.  Liquid fuel at a campsite?  I can see it at an established chuckwagon type of an affair with honest-to-gosh tables for the food preparation, but not on a lightweight-type camping trip.

Complicated:  Cutting, drilling six aluminum cans? 

Fire in a thin aluminum can?  Aluminum melts at a fairly high temperature, but it gets all soft and squooshy and powdery before that.

Boy, I don't know about this one.

Lightweight?  Are you considering the weight of the required liquid fuel and the optional but recommended fire extinguisher?



Are you planning on testing it on a windy day, on rock-strewn ground?  Or just on your kitchen table or workbench?  That part of the experiment might be informative.

Hmmmmm......

I don't know about this one. Pardon my healthy doubtship.  Because of the spillage problem, I believe that's why the Sterno folks use a jelled alcohol.

In a steel can.

With a good sealable lid.

Just sayin'.

Terry, 230RN
« Last Edit: February 16, 2011, 02:51:44 PM by 230RN »
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AZRedhawk44

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2011, 02:33:24 PM »
How does the heat output compare to say an MSR whisperlight?

I've got one of those along with a single burner Coleman.  Haven't used either in years but as I recall they did pretty well though I don't remember enough about the use to quantify anything.

I don't have a whisperlight.  The whisperlite, however, claims to bring a liter of water to a boil in 3.9 minutes... though they don't state the beginning temp of the water.  40 degree refrigerated water will take a lot longer than 75 degree ambient temp water.

My backpacker's stove is a Coleman/CampinGaz model that runs on a butane/propane mix in a blue canister.  It's 12 years old, but it's basically this model:

http://www.campingaz.com/p-23508-bleuet-micro-plus.aspx



That little CampinGaz claims to bring a liter to a boil in 5.25 minutes.  Again, no stated beginning temperature.

I'll run a comparison between the little beer can device and the CampinGaz for bringing a liter to boil.  I'll use the same pot for each one.  The water will be refrigerated each time, and the test will occur outdoors on my patio, in approximately 60 degree weather.

Mine burns a LOT more fiercely than the pic that Rev has posted so far.  That sucker's HOT.  The flame billows out sideways through the pinholes, about 2-3 inches in increased radius.  It licks at the sides of the pot I put on top of it... not just the bottom/center.

A note:  Isopropanol will leave a black sooty residue when burning in one of these.  On your pot, on your stove, on your aluminum heat shield wrap.  If you use a methyl-alcohol source, it won't.  HEET is good.
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RevDisk

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2011, 02:37:19 PM »
I just built two of these using Bud Light aluminum bottles.

My brother's coming over tomorrow evening and we're going to drink 4 more Bud Lights and make 4 more of these. ;)

I used this guy's recipe:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcrW27Leo4w

Works awesome.  

It brought 8 ounces of water to a boil in less than 3 minutes.  Used about half an ounce of isopropyl alcohol to do it.  Weighs, with 4 ounces of fuel, less than a quarter as much as my current backpacker's stove with disposable fuel cells.

Once I assemble a temperature gauge, I'll start doing fuel tests.  I plan on using a fiberglass coated thermocouple (-150 to 800°F) and a MAX6675 chip (on a breakout board into an Arduino because I'm a wuss) for testing.    


How does the heat output compare to say an MSR whisperlight?

I've got one of those along with a single burner Coleman.  Haven't used either in years but as I recall they did pretty well though I don't remember enough about the use to quantify anything.

Don't own a whisperlight.  But if you can find a temperature chart for one, I could let ya know?


Stuffing a tuft of fiberglass insulation batting in between the cans will help it hold the alcohol and control it's output.

Na.  It's already quite snug.  You'd know in a hurry if you're good to good.  If it's individual jets, it's working.  If it's a single giant flame, you have an excessive gap.  



Sounds complicated and dangerous.  Liquid fuel at a campsite?  I can see it at an established chuckwagon type of an affair, but not on a lightweight-type camping trip.

Drilling, cutting aluminum cans?

Fire in a thin aluminum can?  Aluminum melts at a pretty high temperature, but it gets all soft and squooshy before that.

Boy, I don't know about this one.

Lightweight?  Are you considering the weight of the required liquid fuel and the optional but recommended fire extinguisher?



Hmmmmm......

I don't know about this one. Pardon my healthy doubtship.

Terry, 230RN

I'm confused.

I'm not sure how this could be considered complicated.  It's a beer can and denatured alcohol. There are no values, hoses or pressured fuel containers.  The fuel cup is technically "pressurized" while burning, but the pressure is not high enough to lift out the burner cup out of the fuel cup (it's not welded into one unit and was hand assembled).  

Any fire is inherently dangerous.  I'll grant that point  I don't see essentially any additional danger than found in your average zippo.  It uses a liquid fuel that is not extremely explosive.  What am I missing?

I don't carry a fire extinguisher while hiking, I do keep dirt handy.  Plenty of that in nature and it works very well as a means of smothering a fire.  Whenever I make ANY source of fire other than lighting a cigarette, I generally have some precautions.  Fire ring, loose dirt or water, etc.  


I'd like to point out, an extremely large number of hiking/camping stoves are made out of aluminum.   Yes, I am taking precautions during testing.  I did my initial tests outside, on concrete, in a metal bucket.  Thus far, I haven't seen any problems.  And yes, I whacked the entire thing with a rubber mallet after firing it up a few times.  Sir, I am a proper mad engineer and always incorporate destructive testing into my test procedures.  To do anything else would be an insult to the mad engineering profession.

  ;)
« Last Edit: February 16, 2011, 02:59:01 PM by RevDisk »
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PTK

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #7 on: February 16, 2011, 02:44:16 PM »
I made one of those years ago, and I did indeed use a fiberglass wick between the cans just to make the alcohol burn more efficiently and get every last drop. Works like a charm.

...wish I could FIND where the heck I put it though! :D

I'll just make another.
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RevDisk

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2011, 02:55:48 PM »
I made one of those years ago, and I did indeed use a fiberglass wick between the cans just to make the alcohol burn more efficiently and get every last drop. Works like a charm.

...wish I could FIND where the heck I put it though! :D

I'll just make another.

Wouldn't mind seeing your design?   Are you doing a center wick, or outside ring wick?

Also, any recommendations for the fiberglass material to use and working with it?  Ordinarily, I try to avoid the stuff as I don't want to have to toss on a Tyvek suit and respirator.
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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2011, 02:57:02 PM »
I tried making a super cat alcohol stove out of tuna cans, it stank.
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AZRedhawk44

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2011, 02:59:27 PM »
Sounds complicated and dangerous.  Liquid fuel at a campsite?  I can see it at an established chuckwagon type of an affair with honest-to-gosh tables for the food preparation, but not on a lightweight-type camping trip.

Complicated:  Cutting, drilling six aluminum cans? 

Fire in a thin aluminum can?  Aluminum melts at a fairly high temperature, but it gets all soft and squooshy and powdery before that.

Boy, I don't know about this one.

Lightweight?  Are you considering the weight of the required liquid fuel and the optional but recommended fire extinguisher?



Are you planning on testing it on a windy day, on rock-strewn ground?  Or just on your kitchen table or workbench?  That part of the experiment might be informative.

Hmmmmm......

I don't know about this one. Pardon my healthy doubtship.  Because of the spillage problem, I believe that's why the Sterno folks use a jelled alcohol.

In a steel can.

With a good sealable lid.

Just sayin'.

Terry, 230RN

I thought you were being smarmy, at first.

There are thousands of "ultralight" backpackers that use these things instead of heavy, over-engineered and expensive REI fluff.

Keep your HEET or isopropanol in a little container separate from your cooking activities, and your stove only has access to the < 2 ounces you put in it initially.

Also, a liter is a hell of a lot of water to bring to a boil.  Most backpacker's food calls for 8 to 16 ounces of water.  These stoves support that weight and the empty pot weight with no problem.  Remember, we're selecting the strong aluminum cans... not just any old pepsi can.  And it then becomes a double-wall design by inverting one can section into another.

For an overnight trip, I can take one of these and 4 ounces of fuel.  Almost no weight, and I can cook dinner and breakfast and still have about 2 ounces of fuel left over when I'm done with the trip.  3-4 days, and I can take a little metal flask with 8-16 ounces.  Still weighs a LOT less than a whisperlight, CampinGaz, Coleman or other backpacker solution with heavy and expensive fuel cells.

K.I.S.S.  It's fire.  We've been making it for millions (thousands, for Fistful  ;)) of years.  Don't need to spend $50-$100 for a machine to do it.
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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2011, 03:00:57 PM »
I prefer my hobo stoves to not require packing any fuel, and double as a storage container:

http://www.trails.com/how_6037_coffee-can-camping-stove.html

I prefer the smaller metal coffee cans, not the large one as suggested in the article.  
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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2011, 03:39:02 PM »
Wouldn't mind seeing your design?   Are you doing a center wick, or outside ring wick?

Also, any recommendations for the fiberglass material to use and working with it?  Ordinarily, I try to avoid the stuff as I don't want to have to toss on a Tyvek suit and respirator.

If I can find a picture or the stove itself I'll show you the design. Based it off the "tomato sauce can" design. Anyway, it's an outside ring wick, part of a wick used in kerosene heaters - Home Depot clears out "last year's model" wicks for $0.49 up here, once a year, and one of those is good for 10 home made stoves once it's cut up. That's the ONLY fiberglass I'm willing to work with.

Anyway, a quick idea of what I do - small can inside larger can with wick in between, top is an inverted piece of beercan, holes around exterior as jets, interior has holes ONLY for fuel filling, it's about 3" high and the same OD. An ounce of fuel burns for 15 minutes or so and will boil 4 full cups of water in that time from 40 degrees. Yeah, baby. :)
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RevDisk

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2011, 04:08:38 PM »
If I can find a picture or the stove itself I'll show you the design. Based it off the "tomato sauce can" design. Anyway, it's an outside ring wick, part of a wick used in kerosene heaters - Home Depot clears out "last year's model" wicks for $0.49 up here, once a year, and one of those is good for 10 home made stoves once it's cut up. That's the ONLY fiberglass I'm willing to work with.

Anyway, a quick idea of what I do - small can inside larger can with wick in between, top is an inverted piece of beercan, holes around exterior as jets, interior has holes ONLY for fuel filling, it's about 3" high and the same OD. An ounce of fuel burns for 15 minutes or so and will boil 4 full cups of water in that time from 40 degrees. Yeah, baby. :)

I'd love to see the pics, or even a sketch
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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2011, 04:15:32 PM »
If nothing else, I'll be building another one if I can't find that one. I've made a note to pop back into this thread at that time. :)
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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #15 on: February 16, 2011, 04:59:23 PM »
Not being "smarmy" or snotty at all, except maybe for the fire extinguisher wisecrack.  "Just sayin'," and trying to be practical.  After all, Sterno (or somebody) makes a collapsible little steel stove for their alcohol cans.

I've 'sperimented around with that kind of thing, too.  Probably the best I've done was a small coffee can with holes punched in the sides with a beer can opener.  Stored a can of Sterno in it, with space left over for packets of salt 'n pepper 'n other sundries.  Wanted to gussy it up with one of those computer fan grills, but decided that was unnecessary.  (I guess most coffee is in plastic containers, though, nowadays.  Other cans will do just as well.)

So.  Have at it. Nice little DIY project, but sooner or later you (generic "you," not personal) might discover that commercial products are just as practical, perhaps more so, if a bit more expensive.

On the other hand, in your experimenting you (generic "you," not personal) might serendipitously discover a completely new departure on the packing camp stove concept and make a million bucks off it.

I wouldn't be the first one to say that failed experiments are actually successful experiments.   

Terry, 230RN
« Last Edit: February 16, 2011, 05:07:10 PM by 230RN »
WHATEVER YOUR DEFINITION OF "INFRINGE " IS, YOU SHOULDN'T BE DOING IT.

PTK

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #16 on: February 16, 2011, 05:18:44 PM »
I can't be spending any money on these sorts of stoves, Sterno is dang expensive, and alcohol (91% isopropyl) is cheap and easy to find for the stoves. To each his own. ;)
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zxcvbob

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #17 on: February 16, 2011, 06:27:58 PM »
Have you tried using E85? (ethanol denatured with 15% gasoline)
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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #18 on: February 16, 2011, 06:34:57 PM »
I never did, no. Not readily available in my area, plus the low flash point and nasty smell both make me nervous to carry any serious amount around.
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RevDisk

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #19 on: February 16, 2011, 08:28:58 PM »
Not being "smarmy" or snotty at all, except maybe for the fire extinguisher wisecrack.  "Just sayin'," and trying to be practical.  After all, Sterno (or somebody) makes a collapsible little steel stove for their alcohol cans.

I've 'sperimented around with that kind of thing, too.  Probably the best I've done was a small coffee can with holes punched in the sides with a beer can opener.  Stored a can of Sterno in it, with space left over for packets of salt 'n pepper 'n other sundries.  Wanted to gussy it up with one of those computer fan grills, but decided that was unnecessary.  (I guess most coffee is in plastic containers, though, nowadays.  Other cans will do just as well.)

So.  Have at it. Nice little DIY project, but sooner or later you (generic "you," not personal) might discover that commercial products are just as practical, perhaps more so, if a bit more expensive.

On the other hand, in your experimenting you (generic "you," not personal) might serendipitously discover a completely new departure on the packing camp stove concept and make a million bucks off it.

I wouldn't be the first one to say that failed experiments are actually successful experiments.   

Terry, 230RN

Sterno and to a greater extent proprietary stoves use expensive fuel.  Even more problematic is that often specialized to their stove.  Yes, I know that there are plenty of commercial stoves that use common fuels or reusable fuel containers.  I realize this is more likely than not a unlikely scenario that I'll be unlikely to find X specialized fuel source.  But I'm doing this not only for obtaining a cheaper hiking stove, but to learn.  THAT is what I'm actually doing.  Education, experimentation and learning something new.  Your points are all valid ones to varying degrees, but they are heavily outweighed by what I learn in the process.  Even if the experiments fail, as you pointed out, they are still "successful" in the fact that I learned something from the process. 




PTK, if I remember correctly, isopropyl will leave soot on the cooking vessel.  Obviously, I'm going to test it as well as plenty of other fuels.  But I'd ideally like my fuel source to be all of the following: smoke free, high temperature, low volume, easy to handle and cheap.  I'll generate a matrix of all fuel sources, test them and record the results. 


The current fuels I'll be testing are Sunnyside denatured alcohol, HEET, iso-HEET, Ronsonol lighter fluid, Zippo lighter fluid, isopropyl alcohol, some charcoal starting fluid, etc.  Probably find some more by the time I'm done.  I'll ponder using gasoline, but I'd rather stay away from volatile fuels. 
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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #20 on: February 16, 2011, 09:12:25 PM »
Made one of these last week, the two hardest parts are finding the Heine cans since the stores don't sell them locally and then drinking the crap.

My big contribution to science was making a pot support/windscreen/venturi out of a slightly larger steel can. The first was so crude(1.5 minutes + aviation snips) that I tossed it, need to make a slicker version. Love this stove.
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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #21 on: February 16, 2011, 09:25:01 PM »
My son's a Webelo and to get his Craftsman pin he needs to make six projects, but only two can be wood.

Two trips to Home Depot the Saturday of each month and the wood projects are covered.

He's going to make a Foxhole radio as one project.

I think that this hiking stove would be another great project.

Just need to find a couple of other projects that a 10 yo can build on his own.
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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #22 on: February 16, 2011, 10:20:32 PM »

 Look up "gasification stove" similar build, can be made out of an assortment of soup cans & has a similar purpose. Lots of "How To's" on You Tube. It uses twigs, small sticks, etc to make a clean burning camp stove.

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #23 on: February 16, 2011, 10:22:32 PM »
My son's a Webelo and to get his Craftsman pin he needs to make six projects, but only two can be wood.

Two trips to Home Depot the Saturday of each month and the wood projects are covered.

He's going to make a Foxhole radio as one project.

I think that this hiking stove would be another great project.

Just need to find a couple of other projects that a 10 yo can build on his own.

Do electronics count?  Have a couple projects that'd probably interest him, very good way to learn how to use a soldering iron.



Look up "gasification stove" similar build, can be made out of an assortment of soup cans & has a similar purpose. Lots of "How To's" on You Tube. It uses twigs, small sticks, etc to make a clean burning camp stove.

Talked with Nick about inverted down-draft gassifier.  I'll muck with one eventually. 

http://www.garlington.biz/Ray/WoodGasStove/
« Last Edit: February 16, 2011, 10:31:27 PM by RevDisk »
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zahc

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Re: Handy (and cheap) hiking stove
« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2011, 11:43:40 PM »
My friend has a small fleet of these, with difference configurations, some with fiberglass, etc.

He favors everclear. Somewhat expensive, but can double as disinfectant and drinkable alcohol on the trail.
Maybe a rare occurence, but then you only have to get murdered once to ruin your whole day.
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