Seems the Judge is iffy even with the "right" ammo...

[AJ Dual]

My one silver-lining hope is that it's creating new gun owners who may not have otherwise been inspired to get into it.

[Tallpine]

My one silver-lining hope is that it's creating new gun owners who may not have otherwise been inspired to get into it.

The lady next door has one.  She is deathly afraid of snakes.

I'm just glad to see a woman carrying a gun.   

[Gowen]

Gun rags will never really bad mouth a firearm, especially from a big money advertiser like Taurus or S&W.  I don't blame S&W for jumping on the band wagon.  S&W produces enough variety that the Governor won't hurt them and may also help them.  People will buy what appeals to them and calling someone an *expletive deleted* just because they like something isn't helping the cause.

[brimic]

Don't people buy guns to shoot just for fun anymore? The Judge might not be useful for SD, but it is fun to shoot.

[French G.]

Meh, I'm waiting until I go nuts and build the 3.5" 12ga model. Dunno whether to call it The Supreme Court Justice or The Dictator.

[PTK]

He didn't try the most effective ammunition, the 4 pellet 000 buck load. I really need to post the photos and whatnot from my gelatin test.

[41magsnub]

Meh, I'm waiting until I go nuts and build the 3.5" 12ga model. Dunno whether to call it The Supreme Court Justice or The Dictator.

That will be the Taurus Orthopod.

[MillCreek]

^^^ I simply must remember this for the next time I speak at a medical meeting.

[AJ Dual]

Don't people buy guns to shoot just for fun anymore? The Judge might not be useful for SD, but it is fun to shoot.

Considering what the cheapest "fun" .410 loads are birdshot, and how poorly it patterns even at 7 yards... I kind of think you have to hit "something" to have "fun". But that's just me...

[stevelyn]

Does the law or the waffen BATFEces regs actually specify that "rifling" has to twist? If not, why not manufacture it with straight grooves and lands to satisfy BATFEces regs and eliminate the problem of the shot pattern spreading due to centrifigal force? It would suck for the handgun cartridges, but you fix that by shooting slugs.

[seeker_two]

He didn't try the most effective ammunition, the 4 pellet 000 buck load. I really need to post the photos and whatnot from my gelatin test.

Please do...I'm interested in the results....

Does the law or the waffen BATFEces regs actually specify that "rifling" has to twist? If not, why not manufacture it with straight grooves and lands to satisfy BATFEces regs and eliminate the problem of the shot pattern spreading due to centrifigal force? It would suck for the handgun cartridges, but you fix that by shooting slugs.

Even better....go with Paradox rifiling....stabilizes slugs and keeps shot from spreading too wide....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_gun

http://www.hallowellco.com/paradox_boring.htm

[birdman]

That will be the Taurus Orthopod.

Which will be cool until the 30mm Taurus Unicron comes out

[Pharmacology]

Whatever happened to that 28 gauge revolver?

[AJ Dual]

Whatever happened to that 28 gauge revolver?

Since it had a rifled bore to try and get around the SBS and AOW categories like the Judge does, but also had a bore of greater than .50, it was an instant Destructive Device classification. The demonstrated prototype did not even make it on display through the entire length of the SHOT show.

Speculation was that Taurus knew it wouldn't make it past the BATF, but just produced the "Raging Judge" as a publicity stunt, and as sour grapes to steal thunder from S&W copying the Judge with their Governor which they also presented at SHOT.

[Pharmacology]

Since it had a rifled bore to try and get around the SBS and AOW categories like the Judge does, but also had a bore of greater than .50, it was an instant Destructive Device classification. The demonstrated prototype did not even make it on display through the entire length of the SHOT show.

Speculation was that Taurus knew it wouldn't make it past the BATF, but just produced the "Raging Judge" as a publicity stunt, and as sour grapes to steal thunder from S&W copying the Judge with their Governor which they also presented at SHOT.

But I thought that was all rumor?

http://www.americanrifleman.org/blogs/quashing-raging-judge-rumors/

http://www.shootingillustrated.com/5521/truth-missing-from-raging-judge-28-gauge-rumors/

[PTK]

Apparently, even the "big names" in magazines and online articles got it wrong. Read the GCA 68, NFA 34, and then look at the description of the Taurus 28 revolver - 28ga (.550" or so), rifled, no stock, under 16" barrel and 26" OAL. It's an NFA item, plain and simple. :)

Even Taurus has greyed out the page with the 28ga Judge in their online catalog...

http://www.taurususa.com/2011newcatalog/?catalog_page=6

[Pharmacology]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=US0AsCuvfF8#t=28s

[Zardozimo Oprah Bannedalas]

Even Taurus has greyed out the page with the 28ga Judge in their online catalog...
http://www.taurususa.com/2011newcatalog/?catalog_page=6

They did the same to their page on 100th anniversary 1911s.

I can't figure how they'd get around the regs on >.5 caliber weapons, either. What are the guidelines on those massive African hunting cartridges - .700 NE and similar? Are the weapons that fire them all smoothbore?

[PTK]

No; they're specifically (and individually) exempted from the NFA as only having a sporting purpose, having no utility as a weapon (not easily concealed, etc.).

The Judge in 28ga, quite simply, isn't going to get exempted. Ever.

[Regolith]

They did the same to their page on 100th anniversary 1911s.

I can't figure how they'd get around the regs on >.5 caliber weapons, either. What are the guidelines on those massive African hunting cartridges - .700 NE and similar? Are the weapons that fire them all smoothbore?

They're considered "sporting guns." IIRC, shotguns are actually under the same exception. Anything, smooth-bore or not, is considered a destructive device if it has a bore over .50" unless it's ruled to have a "sporting purpose."

[Tallpine]

What about a caplock/flintlock pistol 

[Viking]

What about a caplock/flintlock pistol 

Non-firearm due to being muzzle loader.

[Tallpine]

Non-firearm due to being muzzle loader.

So a double barreled caplock sawed off twelve gauge would be just fine 

[Regolith]

So a double barreled caplock sawed off twelve gauge would be just fine 

Yup.

Cabela's actually sells one.  It's a replica of a Howdah pistol, which is basically a sawed-off double barrel 20 gauge shotgun, which you can have shipped straight to you since it's not technically a firearm.

[AJ Dual]

But I thought that was all rumor?

http://www.americanrifleman.org/blogs/quashing-raging-judge-rumors/

http://www.shootingillustrated.com/5521/truth-missing-from-raging-judge-28-gauge-rumors/

Yeah, but if you haven't been "informed through channels", rumors are still rumors, even when they're right.

I think if it was really "We're still working with the BATF to bring this to market." as they're trying to imply, they wouldn't have pulled it from SHOT. Vendors show off plenty of stuff there that's just "show off" pieces like the famous Magpul AFG/PFG from 2008 that will never see a market. Just like concept cars at auto shows.