I just ordered two...I'll DD one, so looking forward to AJ's results!
AJ, can you PM me with any info on the ATF process? (what did you call it, what form, what engraving, etc)
Okay,
What state are you in? That has bearing, since state laws on DD's override any fed.gov laws, or ATF regulations.
Also, are you in a NFA-friendly Chief Law Enforcement Officer's jurisdiction? Municipal Chief, DA, or County Sheriff? If not, you'll need to form a corporation or a trust to avoid the need for their sign-off on the forms. I recommend a trust, since it does not need upkeep or renewal like a corporation usually does, and it simplifies ownership of the NFA item should you get hit by a bus etc. Heirs can get tax-free NFA transfers since inheritance is not "commerce" under the ICC, the ATF/Treasury can't legally tax you on it. However, it's still similar paperwork as any other NFA transfer, and still takes six months+ to complete.
If you designate beneficiaries on a trust, they can automatically posses the NFA items without additional paperwork.
Namely, the NFA process starts with one of two forms the "Form 1" or the "Form 4". It's the same form for DD's, SBR's, SBS's, Silencers, or MG's.
Form 1 is used if you're "building" the NFA item.
Form 4 is used if you're "transferring" the NFA item.
http://www.atf.gov/forms/firearms/When wondering what to fill out on the form, always defer to the markings on the item itself when possible. I'd put down "Firearms collector" for the "Reason".
Even if you don't actively construct, or machine out the NFA item, if it's a non-NFA item already in your possession, and you somehow "promote it" to NFA status, you're considered as "building" or "making" and need the Form 1. This would include things like adding a stock to a pistol to make a SBR, or getting the barrel of a rifle or shotgun chopped, either by yourself, or a gunsmith, or in our case, simply filing for our RV85's to be declared DD's so we can use "offensive" ammo in them.
If you buy or transfer ownership of an existing ready-made NFA item, either in a private sale or from a dealer, then you use the Form 4.
Assuming you go the trust route, what you would normally want is a "Revocable Living Trust". This gives you the most power and flexibility over it. You can pretty much make changes at will, and only need get them notarized. The trust as a legal entity normally just comes into existence by drafting it, getting it notarized, and assigning it an asset. Although some states may have registration or filing of trusts. My only experience is with WI, which does not.
Even if you have a friendly CLEO who will sign-off, some use a trust and avoid it anyway, on the idea of "never invite the man into your life more than necessary". And for how they simplify ownership and use by others more than just yourself. In my case, Milwaukee County, I have no "friendly" CLEO's, although I hear my particular suburban police chief, will sign... grudgingly, if you inform him you know about trusts and corps and are prepared to create one. Personally, I don't think that kind of relationship with my local police department is.... wise.
Next county over is overwhelmingly Republican, and the pro gun, pro CCW, Sheriff there will sign, however, he still sends a deputy over to verify you have a safe, adequate locks, and to lecture you about having an alarm or security system if you don't have one.
Uh... thanks, but no thanks.
People have been making trusts themselves on the cheap, using websites or software, but I recommend using a real lawyer, because state laws vary on the trust's requirements, and the ATF has become much more diligent in reviewing trusts to ensure they meet all legal criteria, or they'll reject them. There's a few folks who've used software trusts, didn't include the right things, and have had the ATF come back and reject an application.
Problem was,
they already had several other NFA items in place registered to that trust, and now suddenly the ATF has declared it invalid. Oops. So I think a flesh-and-blood lawyer is a good investment. The trust should cost you somewhere between $200 and $400. I wouldn't pay more than that. I'd search local state level gun boards for recommendations in your area.
When naming your trust, INSIST on it being named something SHORT. Because the Trust name, and your city & state will need to be engraved on the receiver somewhere. "Birdman NFA Trust" is good. "The Birdman NFA Collecting Revocable Living Trust" is not. The ATF requires the EXACT name of the trust or .corp entity be engraved in full, they don't allow abbreviations like "RTL" for Revocable Living Trust.
You fill out the form 1, attach a check or money order for $200, a notarized copy of your trust, and Schedule A with the RV85 added as it's assigned asset, and send it in. Then you wait 6 months +, and play with non DD flares, pyro, chalk markers or a sub caliber adapter that's smaller than .50cal in the meantime.
When your form goes "pending" you disassemble the RV85 and send the receiver to Orion Arms
http://www.orion-arms.com/ for engraving with your trust name (or your name if you used CLEO sign-off), city, and state, which should cost $50. (If you're buying an NFA item from a dealer or manufacturer, you're using the Form 4, and all that stuff is already stamped or engraved on the item.)
When you get your tax-stamp back, you can start making buckshot, flechettes, "rubber rocket", superball, or wooden baton rounds. Any
offensive projectile with more than 1/4oz of explosive compound in it is it's own register-able DD, costs $200 and takes the same paperwork. However a pyrotechnic or signalling round with more than 1/4oz of black powder in it is okay. Although if you take any 26.5mm flare, practice, or pyro and shoot it at someone with ill intent, it instantly became DD ammo, and your RV85 a DD if it wasn't already registered.
Also, do note that the RV85 rush is still new, and nobody knows exactly how much it can take. While I talk a good game about wanting to try buckshot, even 4ga solids out of mine, all I can promise is that I'm researching it, and
trying to produce them. I have no idea that I can succeed. Spring/Summer/Fall when people can experiment hasn't hit yet since the Internet took notice of these, so not much data beyond pyro loads which replicate existing factory flares is all that's out there so far.
One other caveat, there's some pretty reliable word out there (from high-ups at
www.nfatca.org) that CLEO sign-off is going away as part of the NFA process. Namely because it's a hold-over from before the existence of NICS, and the ATF is tired of all the trust paperwork they get from people avoiding cranky CLEO's. And that a passive CLEO notification/copy, much like when you apply for a Curio & Relics Collector FFL, is all that's needed.
Some are hoping it'll be within a few months. However, others think the process of regulation review, public comment, and hearings etc. will still take 1-2 years. I'm just throwing this out there for the sake of disclosure, in case you spend a few hundred bucks on a trust, and then you feel it was wasted just a few months later.