Author Topic: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks  (Read 50651 times)

RoadKingLarry

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Re: Embassy Marines in Egypt Disarmed by US Ambassador??
« Reply #150 on: September 13, 2012, 10:16:22 PM »
Yeeaaah, not so much.

I stood various armed watches when I was in: Pier sentry, flight deck rover, gate guard, quarter deck cover, interior rover, pier rover. All of them included live ammo. (Variously, armed with M500, M9, M14 or M60.)

As did I. We had a standard load out of 2 magazines for the 1911, 5 rounds each. I think the M14 load out was 2 magazines with 10 rounds and we were handed 5 or 6 rounds for the shotguns. None of the weapons were to be loaded.  This was the same SOP when we were overseas in foreign ports.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #151 on: September 13, 2012, 10:48:56 PM »

You want to prove you mean it? I want to see those men who dragged our Ambassador through your streets hanging from lampposts tomorrow. Crucifixion merits bonus points.


Suspects in custody.
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Jamie B

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #152 on: September 13, 2012, 11:18:37 PM »
Suspects in custody.

Scapegoats or not, blood is blood.

It is a good start.
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Battle Monkey of Zardoz

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #153 on: September 13, 2012, 11:29:55 PM »
IMO Islam is not a religion. Period. It needs to be handle like that. Incidents like this will get worse. FBI already issuing bulletins that violence could happen here in CONUS, yet they have NO info to support that.   
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zxcvbob

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #154 on: September 13, 2012, 11:33:47 PM »
According to senior diplomatic sources, the US State Department had credible information 48 hours before mobs charged the consulate in Benghazi, and the embassy in Cairo, that American missions may be targeted, but no warnings were given for diplomats to go on high alert and "lockdown", under which movement is severely restricted.

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Jamie B

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #155 on: September 13, 2012, 11:42:46 PM »
IMO Islam is not a religion. Period. It needs to be handle like that. Incidents like this will get worse. FBI already issuing bulletins that violence could happen here in CONUS, yet they have NO info to support that.   

Yea, no *expletive deleted*it - terrorism and racism mildly poorly guised as a religion.
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Jamisjockey

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #156 on: September 13, 2012, 11:43:56 PM »
Well exactly.  According to some reports over here, a decent sized portion of the mob that stormed the consulate took the ambassador out, put him and a wounded companion in a couple of cars and ran him straight down to what passes for a local A+E.

A+E?
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zxcvbob

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #157 on: September 13, 2012, 11:51:45 PM »
A+E?

*Expletive deleted* with a broomstick.   :mad:
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RoadKingLarry

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #158 on: September 13, 2012, 11:56:51 PM »
Does anyone else get the feeling that the response of the administration is being filtered through some kind of bizarro world parallel universe where what they see isn't the same thing we see?
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

MillCreek

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #159 on: September 14, 2012, 12:04:57 AM »
A+E?

Accident and Emergency.  What the British call an ER.
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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #160 on: September 14, 2012, 12:05:56 AM »
Does anyone else get the feeling that the response of the administration is being filtered through some kind of bizarro world parallel universe where what they see isn't the same thing we see?

Pretty much.  And it is deliberate, I think, not the product of wishful thinking.
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Re: Embassy Marines in Egypt Disarmed by US Ambassador??
« Reply #161 on: September 14, 2012, 12:41:30 AM »
As did I. We had a standard load out of 2 magazines for the 1911, 5 rounds each. I think the M14 load out was 2 magazines with 10 rounds and we were handed 5 or 6 rounds for the shotguns. None of the weapons were to be loaded.  This was the same SOP when we were overseas in foreign ports.

They stepped it up a bit when I was standing those watches some 8 years ago. Minimum load outs were 15 rds for the shotguns, 45 for the pistols, 30 for rifles, and two cans (200rd belts) were with the M60 with a looooot more in the nearby ready locker. >:D [ar15] Pistols were always condition 1 (round in the pipe) and longarms were condition 3 (loaded mag, just rack the action).  Also there may or may not have been some M79's in a ready locker nearby.  :angel:  We really didn't dick around with our security at the time, and while there wasn't anyone constantly posted at them, all the .50 and 25mm mounts were generally ready to roll with the removal of a padlock.

No doubt things have changed in the last 8 years though, and probably towards even more stringent/well armed. Hell, IMO and based on these recent events, our MSG's at the embassies should have some XM-214's in concealed mounts. Nothing says "Get the f--- off my damned lawn!" like 12,000 RPM of AP M995 5.56mm.

De Selby

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #162 on: September 14, 2012, 01:01:17 AM »
IMO Islam is not a religion. Period. It needs to be handle like that. Incidents like this will get worse. FBI already issuing bulletins that violence could happen here in CONUS, yet they have NO info to support that.   

So we declare things not to be what they are, so that normal respect and protections don't hamper the government?   Smart....I can't imagine any way that would go wrong!
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

RoadKingLarry

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #163 on: September 14, 2012, 02:59:40 AM »
I'll take it even further.
Islam is no different than Scientology. The "prophet" just beat Hubbard to the punch by a millennium or so. And Islam is slightly less goofy.
If you really want to make some money start your own religion.

If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

MicroBalrog

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #164 on: September 14, 2012, 03:31:11 AM »
I'll take it even further.
Islam is no different than Scientology. The "prophet" just beat Hubbard to the punch by a millennium or so. And Islam is slightly less goofy.
If you really want to make some money start your own religion.



And how are both different from catholicism?
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Monkeyleg

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #165 on: September 14, 2012, 03:33:52 AM »
Quote
And how are both different from catholicism?

Muslims and Scientologists don't have to eat those tasteless wafers.

RoadKingLarry

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #166 on: September 14, 2012, 04:34:19 AM »
And how are both different from catholicism?

Catholicism is older therefore it must have more legitimacy.
 :lol:
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

Hutch

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #167 on: September 14, 2012, 07:18:24 AM »
Far, far fewer Catholics seem to sign up for bomb vests.  Haven't seen too many Scientology imams call for extralegal executions for insults.  Can we at least TRY to remember that the Inquisitions are half a millennium in the past?  Are either perfect?  Of course not.  But neither offer an existential threat to the Republic, as radical Islam does.
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birdman

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #168 on: September 14, 2012, 07:34:56 AM »
Suspects in custody.

I say there are two options.  Voluntary or involuntary extradition to the US for trial....or unfortunate accident.

RevDisk

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #169 on: September 14, 2012, 08:47:41 AM »
"There are still quite vague details, but clearly it was the signing of Al-Qaeda," said Mike Rogers, Republican chairman of the Intelligence Committee in the U.S. Congress.

...

My head hurts.
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Battle Monkey of Zardoz

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #170 on: September 14, 2012, 09:02:21 AM »
The problem isn't any faction, Al Qaeda  Taliban..... The problem is Islam. Plain and simple
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HankB

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #171 on: September 14, 2012, 09:03:40 AM »
Far, far fewer Catholics seem to sign up for bomb vests.  Haven't seen too many Scientology imams call for extralegal executions for insults.  Can we at least TRY to remember that the Inquisitions are half a millennium in the past?  Are either perfect?  Of course not.  But neither offer an existential threat to the Republic, as radical Islam does.
Every religion has some criminal adherents, but today's Catholics are generally not known for fatwas to murder, IEDs, kidnapping and beheadings, honor killings, polygamy, forced marriages to little girls under 10, forbidding of voting, driving, education, and other rights to women, murder of ambassadors, rioting because of books/pictures/movies on the other side of the world, and on and on and on.

Seriously, unless one is trying to deflect criticism of the screaming beards, it's hard to draw a moral equivalence between the two religions.

And as for the Inquisition . . . aside from ending centuries ago, at least partially it came about from the Reconquista which reclaimed the Iberian peninsula from  - you guessed it - the domination of Moslem invaders.
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RevDisk

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #172 on: September 14, 2012, 09:49:02 AM »
Every religion has some criminal adherents, but today's Catholics are generally not known for fatwas to murder, IEDs, kidnapping and beheadings, honor killings, polygamy, forced marriages to little girls under 10, forbidding of voting, driving, education, and other rights to women, murder of ambassadors, rioting because of books/pictures/movies on the other side of the world, and on and on and on.

It basically did at one time. Or the equivalent. Catholics advanced past it. Not quickly, not easily, not without plenty of bodies, but yep. They advanced and are just normal folks these days.

Most folks that follow Islam are just normal people. Everyone has their likes and dislikes, but mostly they work a job, have a family and mind their own business. The overwhelming majority are thoroughly civilized. But there is a vocal, active minority that DOES like starting trouble, and the majority hasn't gotten to the point where it's so overwhelming that only fringe cases exist.
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Ron

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #173 on: September 14, 2012, 10:03:18 AM »
My rambling thoughts, I spent all that time streaming consciousness so I feel obligated to post!  :laugh:

There has been a very healthy (and in some cases unhealthy) symbiosis between western civilization and Christianity over the centuries.

Christs message to follow him and his example doesn't really lend itself to using the government to construct heaven on earth IMHO.

The early church "fathers" Augustine and Aquinas were very much steeped in Greek philosophy. This unholy alliance between church and state is where things went off the rails. In that type of alliance the state always eats the church, the message of Christ being utterly lost. The first healthy step was the Protestant reformation that rejected the authority of Rome. The second healthy step was the US constitution that both separated church and state (institutionally) and provided acknowledgement of the churches important role in society by defining its free exorcise as worthy of enumeration.    

While I appreciate those early works of Christian theology and philosophy, as well as enjoy the classics in philosophy, I do believe the church needs to be independent of the state. American Roman Catholics for the most part get it, not up on world wide Catholicism to speak to Romes position on the issue.  

Like in the Doctors Hippocratic oath I believe the states first duty is to do no harm. I also believe the government that governs least governs best. Finally like those in our history pointed out, our Republic was designed for and will only work with a moral people. We ceased to be a great nation when we ceased to be a good people.

There is no history of Islam where the prevailing philosophy of "give unto Caesar that which is Caesars, give unto God that which is Gods" has been practiced. The only exceptions are where Muslims are a minority.  

From what I can gather, Islam by its very dogma is political and seeks to become "Caesar" so that the force of the state can be used to bring everything into submission to Allah.

      
For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse. Because knowing God, they didn’t glorify him as God, and didn’t give thanks, but became vain in their reasoning, and their senseless heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.

Jamisjockey

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Re: Egypt and Libya embassy attacks
« Reply #174 on: September 14, 2012, 10:04:32 AM »
My only real problem with Islam as a whole is that they haven't really made a concerted effort to stamp out the violent minority.  
JD

 The price of a lottery ticket seems to be the maximum most folks are willing to risk toward the dream of becoming a one-percenter. “Robert Hollis”