Pre-employment problem solving ability tests

[41magsnub]

Anybody every use any of these that they can recommend?  We are an IT consulting firm, but are ok with a general test..  not industry specific.

We've had a flood of recent hires that can't problem solve their way out of a wet paper bag.  They looked good on paper.

I'm looking at the wonderlic tests which based on the demo looks reasonable.  Their sales process is pissing me off though.  They flat out refused to tell me what the costs are, they have to go through their dog and pony show which will not be until tomorrow.  I need to get some tests done on candidates ASAP,  I'd like to see some other options.

Any thoughts?

[Fitz]

Interested in this as well, as I need to hire someone and problem solving is a big part of the gig

[Perd Hapley]

Irony is ironic. 

[Brad Johnson]

Tell the sales people that you like the product, but that you have an ultimatum.  Tell them you are going to call them at X:00 oclock.  They have exactly 60 seconds from the time they pick up the phone to tell you what the total, complete, turn-key cost or you will hang up the phone.  Forever.

Sometimes this is the only way to get a "But Wait There's More" sales rep to put up or shut up.  The great thing about this tactic is you can do it in a pleasant, congenial, businesslike way.

Brad

[AZRedhawk44]

Criteria is another one that does placement testing.

http://www.criteriacorp.com/solution/pricing.php

The annual subscription fee for HireSelect is tiered based on the size of your organization — our customers range from 3-person medical offices to Fortune 500 companies with more than 10,000 employees. The annual subscription includes unlimited access to all our tests, as well as product training and support. Please contact Criteria Sales at 310-441-8571 or pricing@criteriacorp.com for an exact price quote.

Looks pretty straight-forward to get an answer from them.

[41magsnub]

Criteria is another one that does placement testing.

http://www.criteriacorp.com/solution/pricing.php

Looks pretty straight-forward to get an answer from them.

Oh yeah, looked at them too.  The cognitive ability test seemed the most relevant on paper.  When I took the exam it was more like an ADHD test.

Edt:  because I was taking the wrong test...  it really was what amounts to an ADHD test.  Doh.

[TechMan]

Oh yeah, looked at them too.  The cognitive ability test seemed the most relevant on paper.  When I took the exam it was more like an ADHD test.

Edt:  because I was taking the wrong test...  it really was what amounts to an ADHD test.  Doh.

That is too funny.

[41magsnub]

That is too funny.

Yeah...   

More accurately I misclicked and was taking two tests.  The first part seemed relevant.  The second part was throwing random series of numbers at me and wanting me to click F if odd and J if even...  that sort of thing.

[Tallpine]

Irony is ironic. 

So, ask the job candidate to design a test for determining problem solving ability of job candidates?

 

[RevDisk]

Joking?
Oxford Capacity Analysis (OCA), aka American Personality Analysis. I noticed it during a test, as it was copyrighted "L. Ron Hubbard Library". Should have gotten up and left on the spot. Reported to be "highly manipulative" and "manifestly unethical".


Serious?
"Best" one I've seen is Berke. Fairly detailed. You're also not supposed to share with the applicant, but I accidentally found my copy. It wasn't bad.
http://www.berkeassessment.com/

[RevDisk]

Good test for programmers:

http://imranontech.com/2007/01/24/using-fizzbuzz-to-find-developers-who-grok-coding/

[41magsnub]

I just signed up for a demo of the burke test.

[Nick1911]

Good test for programmers:

http://imranontech.com/2007/01/24/using-fizzbuzz-to-find-developers-who-grok-coding/

4 minutes, 17 seconds from blank file to working code in Java.  The modulo operation makes short work of it.

Code: [Select]

public class fizzbuzz {
public static void main(String[] args) {
for (int i = 0; i< 100; i++) {
if((i%5 == 0)&&(i%3 == 0)) {
System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
}
else if(i%3 == 0) {
System.out.println("Fizz");
}
else if(i%5 == 0) {
System.out.println("Buzz");
}
else
System.out.println(i);
}
}
}

[CNYCacher]

4 minutes, 17 seconds from blank file to working code in Java.  The modulo operation makes short work of it.

Code: [Select]

public class fizzbuzz {
public static void main(String[] args) {
for (int i = 0; i< 100; i++) {
if((i%5 == 0)&&(i%3 == 0)) {
System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
}
else if(i%3 == 0) {
System.out.println("Fizz");
}
else if(i%5 == 0) {
System.out.println("Buzz");
}
else
System.out.println(i);
}
}
}

Fail. Your code generates numbers 0-99 and the problem asked for 1 to 100.

Here, I fixed it for you.

Code: [Select]

public class fizzbuzz {
        public static void main(String[] args) {
                System.out.println("1");
                System.out.println("2");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("4");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("7");
                System.out.println("8");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("11");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("13");
                System.out.println("14");
                System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
                System.out.println("16");
                System.out.println("17");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("19");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("22");
                System.out.println("23");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("26");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("28");
                System.out.println("29");
                System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
                System.out.println("31");
                System.out.println("32");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("34");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("37");
                System.out.println("38");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("41");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("43");
                System.out.println("44");
                System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
                System.out.println("46");
                System.out.println("47");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("49");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("52");
                System.out.println("53");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("56");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("58");
                System.out.println("59");
                System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
                System.out.println("61");
                System.out.println("62");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("64");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("67");
                System.out.println("68");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("71");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("73");
                System.out.println("74");
                System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
                System.out.println("76");
                System.out.println("77");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("79");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("82");
                System.out.println("83");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("86");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("88");
                System.out.println("89");
                System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
                System.out.println("91");
                System.out.println("92");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("94");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("97");
                System.out.println("98");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
        }
}


[RevDisk]

4 minutes, 17 seconds from blank file to working code in Java.  The modulo operation makes short work of it.

Code: [Select]

public class fizzbuzz {
public static void main(String[] args) {
for (int i = 1; i<= 100; i++) {
if((i%5 == 0)&&(i%3 == 0)) {
System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
}
else if(i%3 == 0) {
System.out.println("Fizz");
}
else if(i%5 == 0) {
System.out.println("Buzz");
}
else
System.out.println(i);
}
}
}

Fixed.

In the pseudo code, I didn't use if then else nest. I try to shy away from them, same with case. I'm not sure which is more efficient, better, more good. I would lean towards each independently.

The other trick I considered was

// in pseudo code
// mod being modulo
i=1
while i<=100 do {
 if ((i mod 3)=0) then print "Fizz";
 if ((i mod 5)=0) then print "Buzz";
 if (((i mod 3)!=0)&&((i mod 5)!=0)) then print i;
 print "\n"
 i++
}

That should work too, no? You don't need to separately check for Fizz, Buzz and Fizzbuzz. Just Fizz and Buzz, just make sure Fizz goes first.

[Tallpine]

Here, I fixed it for you.


Code:
public class fizzbuzz {
        public static void main(String[] args) {
                System.out.println("1");
                System.out.println("2");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("4");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("7");
                System.out.println("8");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("11");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("13");
                System.out.println("14");
                System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
                System.out.println("16");
                System.out.println("17");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("19");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("22");
                System.out.println("23");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("26");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("28");
                System.out.println("29");
                System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
                System.out.println("31");
                System.out.println("32");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("34");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("37");
                System.out.println("38");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("41");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("43");
                System.out.println("44");
                System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
                System.out.println("46");
                System.out.println("47");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("49");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("52");
                System.out.println("53");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("56");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("58");
                System.out.println("59");
                System.out.println("FizzBuzz");
                System.out.println("61");
                System.out.println("62");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("64");
                System.out.println("Buzz");
                System.out.println("Fizz");
                System.out.println("67");
                System.out.println("68");
                System.out

You must be from India 

[Nick1911]

Fail. Your code generates numbers 0-99 and the problem asked for 1 to 100.

That should work too, no? You don't need to separately check for Fizz, Buzz and Fizzbuzz. Just Fizz and Buzz, just make sure Fizz goes first.

Yea, it would.  I toyed with doing that instead, to get around using the if-else chain or a case statement.  I don't know why, but I tend to avoid case statements.

[Tallpine]

Yea, it would.  I toyed with doing that instead, to get around using the if-else chain or a case statement.  I don't know why, but I tend to avoid case statements.

Switch/case statements work well where they work well. 

[Jamisjockey]

Anybody every use any of these that they can recommend?  We are an IT consulting firm, but are ok with a general test..  not industry specific.

We've had a flood of recent hires that can't problem solve their way out of a wet paper bag.  They looked good on paper.

I'm looking at the wonderlic tests which based on the demo looks reasonable.  Their sales process is pissing me off though.  They flat out refused to tell me what the costs are, they have to go through their dog and pony show which will not be until tomorrow.  I need to get some tests done on candidates ASAP,  I'd like to see some other options.

Any thoughts?

I don't have any suggestions, but just watched a 20 year retired navy Chief get shown the door because despite having a resume' that I'm sure looks great, he couldn't keep two airplanes from slamming into each other with a crow bar.  He sucked so bad I was embarrassed to train the guy.  I shouldn't have to over-key a trainee who's that "qualified" in a tower like where I am now.  It should be easy as cake.
 

He knew none of the required regulations (wake turbulence, runway sep, etc), his phraseology was horrible and that's before we get into his actual ability to put anything together.  Sigh.

[41magsnub]

Hey, so I just found out the local job service offers this sort of testing for free using my tax dollars.  I need to look at what they have and how difficult it is to arrange...

[CNYCacher]

That should work too, no? You don't need to separately check for Fizz, Buzz and Fizzbuzz. Just Fizz and Buzz, just make sure Fizz goes first.

That's how I wrote the code which generated the joke code :)

[zahc]

There is nothing wrong with outsourcing your job, but if you are a hiring manager, you are supposed to be good at recognizing, placing, motivating and rewarding talent. Humans are icky and complicated and I am skeptical of any and all means of evaluating them that does not involve another human. If you are hiring for a job, and you think it's possible to objectively assess someone,s eligibility against some requirement, then you maybe should be looking into robots and automation for that role.

[41magsnub]

Not a hiring manager and desperately trying to not become one.  A CTO trying more ways to vet candidates is all.  There are still several in person interviews on technical knowledge and the touchy feely stuff.

[AJ Dual]

Hey, so I just found out the local job service offers this sort of testing for free using my tax dollars.  I need to look at what they have and how difficult it is to arrange...

I think you're going to be woefully disappointed.

state.gov job service stuff is very geared towards "Show up on time.", "Wear clothes.", (Advanced testing) "Wear NICE clothes.", "Speak in complete sentences and don't use profanity." etc.

At best they've got some Meyers-Briggs type testing that says "You're a EFJVM! That means you're an introverted extrovert who likes people and things and ideas and breathing! Wheee!"

Maybe I'm wrong, and your state actually has some serious tools for employers and job-seekers, but that's my experience, at least with the extra hoops to proove you're a functioning human being and have a pulsethey put you through once you've been on UI for 6 months in Wisconsin.

[zahc]

seq 100|perl -ne'$_%5?$_%3?print:say"Fizz":$_%3?say"Buzz":say"FizzBuzz"'

Best I could do on lunch. You have to use perl 5.10 to get the 'say' to work; it works the same with 'print"foo\n"' it's just longer.