The "deep state" - the permanent ruling class

[Viking]

Interesting piece on the unelected permanent ruling class.
http://tucker.liberty.me/2014/11/07/what-about-the-unelected/

[Balog]

One of the reasons I'm a fan of monarchy as a form of government is because it's an acknowledgement of what is already happening. We have nobility in America, they just happen to be bureaucrats.

[MicroBalrog]

Please. Bureaucrats are inferior to actual nobility in almost every possible way.

[Scout26]

Please. Bureaucrats are inferior to actual nobility in almost every possible way.

Says the guy that doesn't live in the US.  (much less Illinois...)

[MicroBalrog]

Says the guy that doesn't live in the US.  (much less Illinois...)

Actual nobility at least had codes of honor, and complicated systems of values to live up to, which limited just how rapacious they could become. It didn't always work, but it had its value.

The rapaciousness, arrogance, and outright sadistic evil of a modern bureaucrat, on the other hand, is unimpeded by such things.

[Zardozimo Oprah Bannedalas]

And this is why 'Yes, Minister' and 'Yes, Prime Minister" are probably the best political documentaries out there.

[grampster]

Actually, part of the reason that elections don't matter anymore is because America is now an Administrative State; no longer a constitutional republic.  Congress has handed over most of its power to the unelected civil service protected bureaucrats who make the rules, enforce them, and ignore or stonewall congress, the courts and the executive.

[Blakenzy]

And this is why 'Yes, Minister' and 'Yes, Prime Minister" are probably the best political documentaries out there.

Hmmm...   Will search and watch.

[Viking]

Hmmm...   Will search and watch.

One of my favorites: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGscoaUWW2M

[Ron]

Administrative State = Bureaucratic Tyranny

[lee n. field]

"a swarm of officers, to harass us and eat out our substance"

[KD5NRH]

Actual nobility at least had codes of honor, and complicated systems of values to live up to, which limited just how rapacious they could become. It didn't always work, but it had its value.

Also, they often gave a crap what they would be passing on to their heir.

[MillCreek]

Bureaucrats are all very well and good to rant about, but let us not forget the real ruling class in America: our corporate masters and the very wealthy.  With money comes political and media power, and once you have political and media power, you have it made.

[Ron]

The powerful and rich in the private sector can at least be counted on to neglect and ignore the little people under most circumstances.

The public sector bureaucrats very existence is to actively control the little people.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

It's no joke that the pro's run dc


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[Balog]

Actual nobility at least had codes of honor, and complicated systems of values to live up to, which limited just how rapacious they could become. It didn't always work, but it had its value.

The rapaciousness, arrogance, and outright sadistic evil of a modern bureaucrat, on the other hand, is unimpeded by such things.

You're making my argument for me here. We have a demi-nobility that essentially functions as noblity but are worse in every way because of it. An actual nobility would not significantly change how things are done, just make them better.

[Balog]

Actually, part of the reason that elections don't matter anymore is because America is now an Administrative State; no longer a constitutional republic.  Congress has handed over most of its power to the unelected civil service protected bureaucrats who make the rules, enforce them, and ignore or stonewall congress, the courts and the executive.

Not to mention the people who actually write the laws. Senator *expletive deleted*che may be voted out and Senator Turd may take his place, but they're just figureheads. The staffers and wonks who write the actual laws (which the figureheads don't even pretend to read anymore) have the real power.

[Balog]

Bureaucrats are all very well and good to rant about, but let us not forget the real ruling class in America: our corporate masters and the very wealthy.  With money comes political and media power, and once you have political and media power, you have it made.

If the .gov didn't have so much power, the wealthy elite couldn't do all that fence building and rent seeking.

[Scout26]

Bureaucrats are all very well and good to rant about, but let us not forget the real ruling class in America: our corporate masters and the very wealthy.  With money comes political and media power, and once you have political and media power, you have it made.

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

― C.S. Lewis


I can't think of a thing that Bill Gates has done to screw with me^* (Yes, Windows.  But to give credit, he created the PC revolution.)  Warren Buffet hasn't passed any laws that limit my rights.   I can't think of any wealthy person that has done me harm (and several have given me jobs), in any way, shape, or form.

Have some spent money on PAC's and Political ads?  Sure.  I don't have to watch them. 


^* - Okay.  Common Core.  But that's once he stopped being the head of Microsoft and decided to become a "Philanthropist".  Why can't he just build an Art Gallery or sponsor a Symphony.  Hell, how about endowing a tech college or six.   It worked for the original Robber Barons. 

[MillCreek]

Scout: corporate bailouts, financial manipulation of markets (too big to fail), reduction or elimination of governmental regulation or oversight of those same markets, favorable rewriting of tax and financial laws and other 'trickle down' economics approaches designed to benefit the wealthy or corporations at the expense of the middle class or the government as a whole.   And the corporations and very wealthy people use the media to convince the useful idiots average citizen how wonderful this all is.  

[Scout26]

Scout: corporate bailouts, financial manipulation of markets (too big to fail), reduction or elimination of governmental regulation or oversight of those same markets, favorable rewriting of tax and financial laws and other 'trickle down' economics approaches designed to benefit the wealthy or corporations at the expense of the middle class or the government as a whole.   And the corporations and very wealthy people use the media to convince the useful idiots average citizen how wonderful this all is.  

All done by elected politicians and unelected bureaucrats.  Te problem is too much government and too much money in government. 

Look at Hong Kong before the takeover.  No one gave a *expletive deleted*it who the head guy was, or even who was on the council.  Why? They had no power to do much of anything.  Why?  very low taxes, te .gov didn't have much. PRC comes in and starts flexing it's muscle and now there are demonstrations.  Why?  China wants it cut.

Anywho.  Bailouts- .gov approved.  Too Big to Fail- .gov approved.  Reduction or elimination of regulatory oversight- .gov approved.  Rewriting laws to favor the big guys- .gov approved.

[roo_ster]

The question of "Who truly holds the power" was answered by Mao Tse Tung:
"Power flows from the barrel of a gun."

Tell me again how many of Bill Gates's hirelings can shoot me in the face and then go home safe to his family if I don't buy Office 2010?  How many gov't hirelings can shoot me in the face and then go home safe to his family if I don't follow unconstitutional laws and regulations? 

Gov't has the whip hand.  The rich can only mildly influence it.

[Balog]

The question of "Who truly holds the power" was answered by Mao Tse Tung:
"Power flows from the barrel of a gun."

Tell me again how many of Bill Gates's hirelings can shoot me in the face and then go home safe to his family if I don't buy Office 2010?  How many gov't hirelings can shoot me in the face and then go home safe to his family if I don't follow unconstitutional laws and regulations? 

Gov't has the whip hand.  The rich can only mildly influence it.

Agree with all but the last. Government is bought and sold routinely. Shovels 100's of millions in fed.gov contracts to Co X and get tens of millions in "salary" for being a "board member" and giving "motivational speeches" etc. Congresscritters exist as figureheads, but they exist to exploit the system for money and power. And the money flows from the private sector.

[MicroBalrog]

You're making my argument for me here. We have a demi-nobility that essentially functions as noblity but are worse in every way because of it. An actual nobility would not significantly change how things are done, just make them better.

That's exactly what I was trying to say.

[Balog]

That's exactly what I was trying to say.

Hmmm, for some reason I thought you had quoted me and said that as a rebuttal to my point, but looking back I see that you were replying to Scout. My mistake, carry on.