Bad news: feds raid Stag Arms over unserialized lowers

[Andiron]

I thought I heard the Cav Arms thing amounted to using a 3rd party to make the plastic receivers in 2 halves then allowing the 3rd party to have both halves of the mold and receivers at the same time.  The latter was something I think they were repeatedly told not to do.  I am not sure how many warnings or how firm the warnings were, but supposedly they were aware of the problem. 

The problem here with Stag about the receivers could almost be something to manufacturing guys were doing without others in the know, but hard to say.  I don't know how big their operation is.

Is the problem really anything more than complete procedural BS?

[Hawkmoon]

Stag Arms is a major manufacturer of AR-15s, and their guns have an excellent reputation. I very much doubt that they are (were) fooling around with selling unserialized lowers.

It's interesting how many firearms-related businesses are located on John Downey Drive. That's also the home of Metalform (the magazine maker), and I think a couple more similar companies.

[brimic]

It's interesting how many firearms-related businesses are located on John Downey Drive. That's also the home of Metalform (the magazine maker), and I think a couple more similar companies.

Its weird how stuff like that works out sometimes. Where I lived in my pre-divorce house, Bartlein Barrels was on the same street, a 5 minute walk away, Krieger barrels was in the next town over, a 5 minute drive away. The Krieger and Criterion High Power Teams usually shot at our club's matches...lots of friendly trash talk between the teams, all top notch shooters.

[Ron]

Stag Arms is a major manufacturer of AR-15s, and their guns have an excellent reputation. I very much doubt that they are (were) fooling around with selling unserialized lowers.

It's interesting how many firearms-related businesses are located on John Downey Drive. That's also the home of Metalform (the magazine maker), and I think a couple more similar companies.

IIRC Springfield Armory, Rock River Arms and one of the custom gun builders are all located really close to each other in of all places here in Illinois.

[Angel Eyes]

IIRC Springfield Armory, Rock River Arms and one of the custom gun builders are all located really close to each other in of all places here in Illinois.

When your business requires certain specialized skills, it's a good idea to locate where such skilled labor already is.

[Ned Hamford]

The DOJ does maintain that a shoelace possession can be prosecuted as possession of automatic weaponry.

[Jocassee]

Maybe one day we'll have a government that prefers to focus on crimes that are malum in se instead of malum prohibitum.

[roo_ster]

Maybe one day we'll have a government that prefers to focus on crimes that are malum in se instead of malum prohibitum.

Nabbing murderers is dangerous, time consuming, and costly.  Nabbing regulatory rule breakers is danger-free, easy, and can make the enforcers a lot of money.

[Angel Eyes]

Nabbing murderers is dangerous, time consuming, and costly.  Nabbing regulatory rule breakers is danger-free, easy, and can make the enforcers a lot of money.

This.  Eloquently, if depressingly, put.

[MechAg94]

Is the problem really anything more than complete procedural BS?

It was procedural BS that was a core part of being licensed as a firearms manufacturer.  Compliance is a big deal.  Yeah, it would be great to get rid of those regulations, but that is not the world we live in.  (Referring to Cav Arms not Stag. 

My company has had issues before with FDA and EPA, but we can't afford to screw around with regulations when the govt auditors get involved.  I hear the BATFE is worse than most others so that makes it even more important to be careful.

I wasn't clear on what exactly triggered laying down the hammer on Stag.  It sounds like they had an issue flagged in an audit and didn't fix it?  Not sure.

[Andiron]

It was procedural BS that was a core part of being licensed as a firearms manufacturer.  Compliance is a big deal.  Yeah, it would be great to get rid of those regulations, but that is not the world we live in.  (Referring to Cav Arms not Stag. 

My company has had issues before with FDA and EPA, but we can't afford to screw around with regulations when the govt auditors get involved.  I hear the BATFE is worse than most others so that makes it even more important to be careful.

I wasn't clear on what exactly triggered laying down the hammer on Stag.  It sounds like they had an issue flagged in an audit and didn't fix it?  Not sure.

I understand it's that state of things,  but it doesn't suck any less because of that. 

Just makes me mad is all. 

[MechAg94]

Agreed.  It is odd having a state environmental person auditing you who knows nothing about your process and nothing about how it works, but it just making sure you can show you are complying with all the regulations.  Those guys are probably smart as far as Govt regulators go. 

[Scout26]

From my understanding the BATFEIO-EIO can and does change the rules without notice or warning.  Often from one agent to the next.   Agent A says do X.  A year later Agent B comes in and you get in trouble for doing X. 

[DustinD]

While not likely applicable here the ATF also has the bad habit of drafting or changing rules after they arrest, seize, or investigate someone specifically to screw one person over. The requirement that firearm serial numbers require at least one number is an example.