I can't afford my student loan debt! But I can...

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

Graduated in 77 it was college and make 50 k right away or vocational school. Or enlist


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[Sergeant Bob]

Even way back in the Stone Age when I was in high school they pressed College the same way
It always remain your choice

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That right there Ed!

[Mannlicher]

I graduated from college with three degrees.  Not a single penny of 'student debt' on my shoulders?  How?  Simple answer is that I worked like a dog, usually two jobs, while paying my way.  My college career took an extra two years, but it was worth it.
Both of my kids graduated college debt free as well. 

[Grebnaws]

I work closely with a lot of students. As a non-academic I'm able to work alongside them more casually and get to know them quite a bit. Many of them are hard working and prioritize their student expenses well. Some do not. I also only come in contact with students who WANT to work by holding a job so there are many worse examples out there.

The number one most ridiculous expense, particularly among African-American females, is the cost of hair. Do you know what it costs for them to get their done? Do you know how often they do it? Hundreds per month. They are happy to tell you all about it. They are also proud of supporting their families by sending their LINK cards (food stamp debit card) back home. It sounds pretty common and they really congratulate themselves for doing it. It's THEIR money and they can do whatever they want with it. 

[agricola]

I'm probably going to catch some flack for saying this...

But I actually do feel a little bad for a lot of them, because I know what they were indoctrinated with in high school. They were all told that they would fail in life if they *didn't* go to collage and that they *had* to do this. They were not even remotely prepared for making any kind of educated decision or even actually prepared for the academic requirements of collage. I can see how a lot of them are very bitter and disillusioned since for many of them, signing into all of that debt was like signing a contract to Faustus disguised as all the people they were supposed to be able to trust.

I'm not saying the should be allowed to flake on their loans, but I wouldn't be against forcing some HS guidance counselors to be contributing to those payments, either.  

TBH there are large parts of the college system that should be stumping up money as well, after all its them that have both encouraged and enriched themselves from this.  

Over here, we used to have a grant system (for fees and board, though the maintenance grant was set at a level that you were just able to subsist on) that didn't cost the state that much (in fact it probably didn't cost them anything over the lifetime of the student), but which meant that there was a degree of selection in terms of only paying for sensible degrees, only paying for students who could be expected to pass them etc.   After thirty years of politicians recognizing that this actually made sense, John Major did the initial work in getting rid of most the maintenance grant, then Blair got rid of the tuition fee grant whilst offering everyone loans, and finally Cameron bumped the tuition fees up to nine grand a year (largely irrespective of the quality of the university), whilst they all went around trumpeting how important university education is, whilst also congratulating themselves at reducing the unemployment figures.  

Now we have loads of people applying, getting themselves into £40k plus of debt, and then fighting over unpaid internships when they come out - whilst the state guarantees the loans, and senior university management are all paid more than the Prime Minister.  

[Strings]

I actually argued with my guidance counselor about college... twice

First argument was about the "Trans American School of Broadcasting" (I was a DJ at the local AM station, and the GC thought I should attend this school). I contacted the local rock station (happened to be the market leader in the area), and talked with one of their HR people about schooling: they told me "regular 4 year degree is what we look for". GC didn't believe me

While later, and GC found out I had enlisted. He started in on me about going to college: I pointed out that college was being pushed on too many, and it was going to devalue the degree

Oh look... 20 years later, and a BA is now looked at as a HS diploma was when I graduated...

[K Frame]

Two of the three guidance counselors in my high school were absolutely worthless. One wasn't bad, but the two men? Wow.

The school nurse placed FAR more students in college as those two worthless lumps of flesh. The nurse's office was, basically, college app central.

The one GC was the football coach. That's all he cared about. Want to try to get into college? You're stupid, you should play football, that's the only way you'll be successful in life. Have a sucking chest wound? Rub some dirt on it and play football. Pretty much all we did in his class was watch tapes of the high school football team. And my high school football team SUCKED.

The other guy was, if anything, even worse. He had stopped caring, but he hadn't stopped trying, and chose to exercise it in the most toxic way possible. My first day in his class in 8th grade he looks at me and says "Irwin... If you're anything like your brother I won't like you."

I eyed him right back and said "I'm nothing like my brother, but I don't think that will matter to you, so I don't give a *expletive deleted*it."

BOOM. To the principal's office. :D

The principal was a family friend, and he and I were on good terms, so I voiced my complaint about the guidance counselor, he chuckled, alluded (but didn't say, he couldn't) that the man was worthless and I should ignore him, scolded me as he should have, and we talked about the Phillies for half an hour.

When I was in 11th grade, that GC, Jerry(?) Stidfole, found out I was applying to Dickinson College. Good school, very competitive to get in. He decided I needed "some counseling."

"Why are you doing that, you'll never get in, even if you do, you'll never make it, you should go to Central Penn Business School..." just complete and utter bullshit.

I was accepted at Dickinson. Got the letter Christmas Eve. When we got back to school after holiday break I dropped by his office and said I had something I thought he'd be interested in seeing...

"What?"

"My acceptance letter to Dickinson, along with the grant and scholarship they're giving me."

And you know I said it in my best FU tone of voice, and with my best FU smile. I really thought for a second he was going to hit me.

A few years later I made one last turn of the knife. After I became associate editor of American Rifleman magazine I sent him a letter on my letter head with one of my first articles, reminded him what he said to me about my brother, and thanked him for giving me a drive to succeed so that I didn't end up like him, a brain dead ahole in a menial dead end job.

He never answered me... 

 

[RoadKingLarry]

When I was in High School our guidance counselor was a crusty olde farte that had been a teacher at the small country school my dad graduated from. Apparently there was some "bad blood" that lingered.
However, he did manage to unkowingly feed me a straight line that festered for more than 10 years.

While home on leave one summer the family was gathered at dad's house and for some reason the conversation turned to the teacher/counselor mentioned above.
My sister stated that she didn't like the man, he had told her that he did not believe she had what it took to go to Jr. college.
I spoke up and said "Well, you sure proved him wrong, you've been doing it for almost 10 years now". One of our uncles was laughing so hard he fell out of his lawn chair and one of our aunts walked away snickering.
She didn't talk to me the rest of the time I was home.

[Jocassee]

Two of the three guidance counselors in my high school were absolutely worthless. One wasn't bad, but the two men? Wow.

The school nurse placed FAR more students in college as those two worthless lumps of flesh. The nurse's office was, basically, college app central.

The one GC was the football coach. That's all he cared about. Want to try to get into college? You're stupid, you should play football, that's the only way you'll be successful in life. Have a sucking chest wound? Rub some dirt on it and play football. Pretty much all we did in his class was watch tapes of the high school football team. And my high school football team SUCKED.

The other guy was, if anything, even worse. He had stopped caring, but he hadn't stopped trying, and chose to exercise it in the most toxic way possible. My first day in his class in 8th grade he looks at me and says "Irwin... If you're anything like your brother I won't like you."

I eyed him right back and said "I'm nothing like my brother, but I don't think that will matter to you, so I don't give a *expletive deleted*it."

BOOM. To the principal's office. :D

The principal was a family friend, and he and I were on good terms, so I voiced my complaint about the guidance counselor, he chuckled, alluded (but didn't say, he couldn't) that the man was worthless and I should ignore him, scolded me as he should have, and we talked about the Phillies for half an hour.

When I was in 11th grade, that GC, Jerry(?) Stidfole, found out I was applying to Dickinson College. Good school, very competitive to get in. He decided I needed "some counseling."

"Why are you doing that, you'll never get in, even if you do, you'll never make it, you should go to Central Penn Business School..." just complete and utter bullshit.

I was accepted at Dickinson. Got the letter Christmas Eve. When we got back to school after holiday break I dropped by his office and said I had something I thought he'd be interested in seeing...

"What?"

"My acceptance letter to Dickinson, along with the grant and scholarship they're giving me."

And you know I said it in my best FU tone of voice, and with my best FU smile. I really thought for a second he was going to hit me.

A few years later I made one last turn of the knife. After I became associate editor of American Rifleman magazine I sent him a letter on my letter head with one of my first articles, reminded him what he said to me about my brother, and thanked him for giving me a drive to succeed so that I didn't end up like him, a brain dead *expletive deleted*hole in a menial dead end job.

He never answered me... 

 

The slow knife is the best knife.

[K Frame]

"Just want to point out that that's a lot easier to do when student debt was something like 10% of median income, rather than the 100% it is know.  IE 10X as much, even inflation compensated."

And I just want to point out, once again, the premise of "BUT I WANT ALL THESE COMPLETELY FRIVOLOUS THINGS! I DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO GIVE UP MY TWICE A DAY $7 A CUP STARBUCKS HABIT! I DON'T WANT TO GIVE UP GOING OUT WITH MY FRIENDS A COUPLE OF TIMES A MONTH EVEN IF IT MEANS SPENDING A WEEK'S TAKE HOME PAY! I NEED BERNIE TO MAKE THE DEBT I AGREED TO PAY BACK DISAPPEAR!"

This entire article is about people being pissed that they have to live up to their obligations.


Oh, and when I got out of college in 1987, I had just shy of $25,000 in student loan debt. And guess what the median income was?

$25,872 in 1988.