Should they be an American

[Cosmoline]

If there is no birthright citizenship, how do you know YOU'RE an American citizen?  Can you prove that all your ancestors were here legally?  Produce the papers, or it's back to the old world with you!

[Perd Hapley]

Nonsense, Cosmo.  It's not a matter of legal residency.  The only question is whether one of your parents was a citizen. 

Besides, there was no party before whites settled here.

Wow.  Paging Mr. Gibson, Mr. Mel Gibson...

That's cute, Zeke, but if the party you're talking about is the free, prosperous nation everyone wants to be a part of, then you'll have to cede my point.  I'll grant you that the Europeans didn't bring the natural resources with them, but to stay with the party metaphor, the natives had hops but no beer.  They had taters, but no chips.  They had some kickin' CD's, but no sound system. 

To get back to reality, though, my statement wasn't racial, it was cultural.

[grislyatoms]

Baby was not born on United States soil. Baby was born in United States airspace.

therefore

Baby is not a citizen.


Additional thought, if they deem that the baby IS a citizen, what altitude limit will they set for future cases?

Stratosphere? Ionosphere? Space? The moon? Mars? Next solar system?

Gives new meaning to the term "Illegal alien".

[Hawkmoon]

So sparked on by a recent news story on FoxNews a question came to my mind, first the back story.

I can't find any online links to the story so I'll sumerize.  A pregnant Mexican woman was on a flight from Mexico into the United States (forget the exact departure and destination cities)  While on the flight she gave birth and some are calling for the baby to be an American citizen since its supposed to be if you are born in the US you are a US citizen.  Ok thats it in short.

The question really isn't to the specific baby, its just what got the question in my mind.

The question is should a baby born on US soil be considered an American citizen if its parents are not themselves Americans?

I think not, but it will require a change in the laws to revise the status quo. In the case of the woman on the flight, she should not be considered to have been "in" the U.S. until the plane landed and she had cleared customs and immigration. If she gave birth in the air, she hadn't legally "entered" the U.S.

[Ezekiel]

There you go again. Throwing that old race card when it's not even a little bit justified.

To get back to reality, though, my statement wasn't racial, it was cultural.

"Paging Mr. Gibson..."

I meant related to his latest flick, which readily points out that Natives were decidedly not cut from cloth better than any other human.  (In sum, a validation of Fistful's point regarding actions prior to Anglo invasion, not a racial attack.)

I should have been more clear, which shows specifically how far our opinion of Mel has fallen: any mention of him becomes direct racial diatribe...

[Perd Hapley]

OK.  I'm still not sure what you were trying to say vis-a-vis Gibson.  I don't know much about his latest movie. 

[Ezekiel]

While outright fiction, it apparently documents a whole bunch of evils going on in North America long before we Natives decided to announce Anglos as the Great Satan.  (subtle, inside humor implied)

I'm merely copping to such goings on being closer to reality than a Utopian land filled with honey...

OK.  I'm still not sure what you were trying to say vis-a-vis Gibson.  I don't know much about his latest movie.

[Ezekiel]

If there is no birthright citizenship, how do you know YOU'RE an American citizen?

Precisely.

It must remain intact, or all citizenship becomes questioned.

[Perd Hapley]

That is a false dichotomy.  Sure, we could write a law that repeals born-here instant citizenship AND strips away the citizenship of anchor-babies already considered citizens.  We could more easily write a law that repeals it, leaving the citizenship of all current citizens grandfathered in.  The second seems a lot easier to do, practically, and a lot safer for politicians who want to keep their jobs. 

[doczinn]

I meant related to his latest flick, which readily points out that Natives were decidedly not cut from cloth better than any other human.

Then I apologize.

how far our opinion of Mel has fallen: any mention of him becomes direct racial diatribe...

It's not just that; I also considered the source. 

It's a point I frequently make, that all was not sweetness and light before our arrival.

[Ezekiel]

No issues at all, Doc. 

I meant related to his latest flick, which readily points out that Natives were decidedly not cut from cloth better than any other human.

Then I apologize.

how far our opinion of Mel has fallen: any mention of him becomes direct racial diatribe...

It's not just that; I also considered the source. 

It's a point I frequently make, that all was not sweetness and light before our arrival.