Seattle Beats California

[Ben]

Looks like Seattle beat the state of CA regarding banning plastic straws. They took it a step further and are banning plastic utensils.

While there are some options for straws (I seem to remember using paper straws when I was a kid), how do you replace plastic utensils? Not that I would buy a salad from McDonald's, but if someone does, are they supposed to use their hands? I eat at plenty of Mexican and other very casual places where you order at the counter and can eat there or in some "community eating area" shared by other businesses. Do they have to supply metal utensils that they then have to constantly clean? Between that and theft, the monetary loss could add up quick. Or maybe people have to show up with their own utensils.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/07/02/seattle-bans-plastic-straws-utensils-becoming-first-major-us-city-to-do-so.html

[K Frame]

Don't you know that eating products grown in or on the earth is rape of the blessed Earth mother?

[Perd Hapley]

Just puree everything together, and suck it down through a paper straw.

This is a good sign from Seattle, though. I mean, they must have solved that homeless problem, if they're moving on to this.

[Perd Hapley]

Hopefully, some of the Republican mayors around the country will declare their cities as sanctuaries for plastic utensils.

[zxcvbob]

Looks like Seattle beat the state of CA regarding banning plastic straws. They took it a step further and are banning plastic utensils.

While there are some options for straws (I seem to remember using paper straws when I was a kid), how do you replace plastic utensils? Not that I would buy a salad from McDonald's, but if someone does, are they supposed to use their hands? I eat at plenty of Mexican and other very casual places where you order at the counter and can eat there or in some "community eating area" shared by other businesses. Do they have to supply metal utensils that they then have to constantly clean? Between that and theft, the monetary loss could add up quick. Or maybe people have to show up with their own utensils.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/07/02/seattle-bans-plastic-straws-utensils-becoming-first-major-us-city-to-do-so.html

Chopsticks.

[MillCreek]

The Seattle food services establishments are going to be giving out compostable straws and utensils, like these from Costco:  https://www.costco.com/Eco-Kloud-Compostable-Fork%2C-1000-count--.product.11657891.html

The problem is that they don't compost particularly well, and there is a dearth of commercial compost facilities that will take them.  A lot of people think they will just end up in the trash, where they take a long time to break down.

[Ben]

The Seattle food services establishments are going to be giving out compostable straws and utensils, like these from Costco:  https://www.costco.com/Eco-Kloud-Compostable-Fork%2C-1000-count--.product.11657891.html

The problem is that they don't compost particularly well, and there is a dearth of commercial compost facilities that will take them.  A lot of people think they will just end up in the trash, where they take a long time to break down.

Kinda funny. I read the utensil description at the link and on the face of it, every quality they list that makes them useable is something that, as you say, would make them not particularly well-suited to biodegradation. :)

[230RN]

^

Kinda funny. I read the utensil description at the link and on the face of it, every quality they list that makes them useable is something that, as you say, would make them not particularly well-suited to biodegradation.

How very very odd.  Why do you suppose that is? 

[K Frame]

"The problem is that they don't compost particularly well, and there is a dearth of commercial compost facilities that will take them.  A lot of people think they will just end up in the trash, where they take a long time to break down."

That's not a problem at all! Seattle will just pass another law mandating that all facilities accept and deal with this kind of bioplastic.

See? Problem solved! Government IS the answer!

[Jim147]

They could just use them to build housing for all the homeless.

[BobR]

Seattle Beats is Merely an Extension of California

Fixed that title for you. 

bob

[just Warren]

Serious question: What if someone, Average Joe Seattle Citizen say, walked into restaurants and started handing out plastic straws? Would that be illegal?

[Firethorn]

The Seattle food services establishments are going to be giving out compostable straws and utensils, like these from Costco:  https://www.costco.com/Eco-Kloud-Compostable-Fork%2C-1000-count--.product.11657891.html

The problem is that they don't compost particularly well, and there is a dearth of commercial compost facilities that will take them.  A lot of people think they will just end up in the trash, where they take a long time to break down.

Given that I remember a documentary where they unearthed a hot dog, presumably from some time in the '50s, while excavating a sanitary landfill, that didn't look any less edible than when it went in, a 'long time' would be accurate.

They could just use them to build housing for all the homeless.

What's the sense in that?

I remember reading that one city, I think it was LA, had somebody building "tiny houses" for the homeless.  Nice looking if basic structures, I'd say about the size of the sleeper compartment on trucks.  Room for a small bed, a bit of desk and shelf space. Problem?  The city was condemning and hauling them away as 'hazardous' to the homeless using them for shelter.

I mean, I start getting a mite concerned when you're spending more trying to drive the homeless out of the area than, you know, actually getting them housed. 

We wouldn't need all those "subtle" and expensive anti-homeless measures if we put the money instead towards addressing the problems.  Of course, fixing the rules so that housing could be built affordably for them again would help even more.

[Ben]

We wouldn't need all those "subtle" and expensive anti-homeless measures if we put the money instead towards addressing the problems.  Of course, fixing the rules so that housing could be built affordably for them again would help even more.

I think even Warren Buffet's modular home companies have 500sq ft units in the $20K range. Tiny houses seem to go for at least triple that, and are often much smaller. Affordable manufacturing means for housing are there, but don't seem to be utilized much. I saw in Boise they have a couple of small apartment complexes going up that are made of shipping containers.

[HankB]

. . .  We wouldn't need all those "subtle" and expensive anti-homeless measures if we put the money instead towards addressing the problems. 

Water cannons? With soapy water and a de-lousing agent? To be used 1 week after passing out one-way bus tickets to San Francisco, Chicago, and NYC?

[freakazoid]

Looks like Seattle beat the state of CA regarding banning plastic straws. They took it a step further and are banning plastic utensils.

While there are some options for straws (I seem to remember using paper straws when I was a kid), how do you replace plastic utensils? Not that I would buy a salad from McDonald's, but if someone does, are they supposed to use their hands? I eat at plenty of Mexican and other very casual places where you order at the counter and can eat there or in some "community eating area" shared by other businesses. Do they have to supply metal utensils that they then have to constantly clean? Between that and theft, the monetary loss could add up quick. Or maybe people have to show up with their own utensils.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/07/02/seattle-bans-plastic-straws-utensils-becoming-first-major-us-city-to-do-so.html

Paper straws?
If they are forced to use metal utensils, I wonder how much extra water will now get used.

[just Warren]

Just use sharpened chopsticks and stab your food! Slicing might be a problem, though. And soups. And applesauce. And peas.

Okay, I've not thought this through completely.

[Ben]

Paper straws?

Gall darned young whippersnappers:

[KD5NRH]

Chopsticks.

https://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/10/24/disposable-chopsticks-strip-asian-forests/

Each year, the equivalent of 3.8 million trees go into the manufacture of about 57 billion disposable pairs of chopsticks in China, according to statistics from that nation’s national forest bureau. About 45 percent of disposable chopsticks are made from trees like cotton wood, birch, and spruce, while the remainder are made from bamboo.

[Northwoods]

I think even Warren Buffet's modular home companies have 500sq ft units in the $20K range. Tiny houses seem to go for at least triple that, and are often much smaller. Affordable manufacturing means for housing are there, but don't seem to be utilized much. I saw in Boise they have a couple of small apartment complexes going up that are made of shipping containers.

It's not the cost of building the structure.  It's the cost of the land it sits on.

In Seattle 95% of land zoned as residential is restricted to single family detached homes.  With the water and the mountains there's only so much land to build on.   By not allowing much high density housing (especially going vertical) the supply is heavily restricted.  Demand keeps climbing so now a 1300sf nothing special house on a small lot in a not great neighborhood is going to cost $800k+.  Anything you would actually want for your family is even more.

The structure, even a really, really nice one, is peanuts compared to the land.

[Scout26]

https://twitter.com/CuffyMeh/status/1013846397047771136

[just Warren]

Has anyone done any sort of survey of the public on this issue?

[RoadKingLarry]

 

Has anyone done any sort of survey of the public on this issue?

 
When did libtard politicians start caring about what the peasants thought?

[MechAg94]

It's not the cost of building the structure.  It's the cost of the land it sits on.

In Seattle 95% of land zoned as residential is restricted to single family detached homes.  With the water and the mountains there's only so much land to build on.   By not allowing much high density housing (especially going vertical) the supply is heavily restricted.  Demand keeps climbing so now a 1300sf nothing special house on a small lot in a not great neighborhood is going to cost $800k+.  Anything you would actually want for your family is even more.

The structure, even a really, really nice one, is peanuts compared to the land.

Available land is only part of it.  The zoning you mention is part of the other side.  The liberals who run those cities create the real estate problem (in part) through multiple levels of regulation that restrict potential solutions and make them more expensive to implement.   

[Ben]

Well, now my old hometown has beat Seattle. Jail time for plastic straws.

https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2018/07/24/iowahawk-dreams-big-as-santa-barbara-ups-the-ante-on-seattles-plastic-straw-ban/

Also, a quote from the local rag there. Please note bolded text:

In years past, such bans would have occasioned serious debate in addition to heartfelt theatrics. But with the exception of Councilmember Randy Rowse ​— ​who supported banning Styrofoam but not straws ​— ​the vote was unanimous. For the majority of the council, the only question was how best to wordsmith the ordinance language to tighten the exemptions. Rowse sought to draw a softer regulatory line but got nowhere for his efforts. “Let’s invite people to care about the environment like [people] do,” he said. “They’ll exceed your expectations every time.” People should be given the opportunity to display “good behavior,” he said, before the council resorted to Plan B: “You better do the right thing, or we’re going to come after you.”

Councilmember Jason Dominguez countered that “we can’t always count on common sense,” adding, “We have to regulate every aspect of people’s lives.”

https://www.independent.com/news/2018/jul/20/banned-santa-barbara/