Hey, remember we were talking about metric v. English measurement disasters?

[230RN]

Well, here was a good one, except it involved the Universal Transverse Mercator coordinate system versus the Transverse Mercator projection.

Not that I know the difference, but neither did the guys who set up their drilling rig in Lake Peigneur in Louisiana.

Short story, their 14" (35.6 cm) drill broke into the ceiling of an empty salt mine under the lake apparently because of the different geographical descriptions.

The whole lake practically disappeared in the resulting giant whirlpool as the hole eroded and got bigger and bigger.  Down went the drilling platform, eleven barges, a tugboat, many trees, and 65 acres (26 ha) of the surrounding terrain. So much water drained into those salt caverns that the flow of the canal that usually empties the lake was reversed.

Air displaced by the water flowing into the mine caverns erupted through the mineshafts as compressed air and then later as 400-foot (120 m) geysers.

Ah, but read all about it for yourself.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Peigneur

Terry, 230RN

[Hawkmoon]

That's a fairly large oops.

[griz]

Wow, there's fail and then there's epic fail.

My favorite metric-imperial unit fail was the Gimli Glider, a 767 that ran out of fuel because of a conversion mistake.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gimli_Glider

[K Frame]

I remember that happening. It was only a couple of months after Mt. St. Helens

[Ben]

This kind of thing was quite common in the late 80s through early 2000's, and still likely occurs too frequently today, regarding datums. At work, I used to run into digital maps all the time that when looked at, would show something 50 yards from where it was supposed to be. Usually because the knucklehead (almost always an intern, because digitizing is boring and mundane work) that digitized it either did not run, or ran incorrectly, the conversion from NAD27 to NAD83/WGS84 datums. Once I ran the correct conversion algorithm through Arc/INFO, things would line up again. In fact that was the "turn it off and back on again" of the geospatial sciences in my day. If some map didn't look just right, run the 27-83 datum conversion first to see what happens.

I've even run into it in the past with vehicle GPS systems, especially offroad. I used to come up to some forest service road (USFS had a ginormous archive of older NAD27 maps that were digitized when that tech (which defaulted to NAD83) became prevalent) intersections or turnoffs that would be well away from where I actually was. Usually it was easy to figure out, but if a couple of turnoffs were a couple hundred feet from each other, it could be easy to take the wrong road.

[griz]

I've even run into it in the past with vehicle GPS systems, especially offroad.

A couple times I've seen my position on the car's GPS paralleling maybe a couple hundred feet off the displayed road.  Eventually it snaps back on to the road, but it's good to know what caused it.

[Ben]

A couple times I've seen my position on the car's GPS paralleling maybe a couple hundred feet off the displayed road.  Eventually it snaps back on to the road, but it's good to know what caused it.

A lot of times, that's actually just a crappy GPS signal. At least if it happens off major roads/freeways. I've seen it happen to me on major freeways. Sometimes also because they did something like change the freeway path or add a lane in a short area in between map updates, so you're on a new section of road, but the GPS is displaying the old section.  Urban roads get frequently checked and updated, so in most cases stuff like the NAD27/83 errors were caught a good ways back. Rural and other boonie roads don't get the same level of QA/QC.

[Hawkmoon]

My automobile GPS isn't getting updated anymore. It's a TomTom unit that my daughter gave to my wife for Christmas maybe seven years ago. Supposedly came with "lifetime" map updates.

Turns out "lifetime" means "until we stop doing it." Which they did last year. They did condescend to send out an update to correct the time/date problem, but no more map updates. I don't like using my cell phone for navigation because that means I have to turn on geolocaton, so I'll use the GPS for another couple of years. Once it starts getting me lost, I'll have to buy a new one.

[HankB]

It's not just English/Metric conversions - I remember reading about a bridge under construction in which one of the members didn't fit; it seems that there was confusion between 10'2" and 102" . . .

[230RN]

It's not just English/Metric conversions - I remember reading about a bridge under construction in which one of the members didn't fit; it seems that there was confusion between 10'2" and 102" . . .

That 10'2" versus 102" reminds me that I questioned the water shooting out of the mine shafts to "400 feet."  I wonder if it wasn't really 40 feet.  Old Faithful only squirts 106 to 180 feet up. Now I'm getting to wonder where my Machinery's Handbook is to see about water squirting heights versus pressure.  (I reckon Firefighters probably know this offhand.)

There's a local problem about subsidence of ground into the many empty coal mines around here.  So far, nothing <ahem> earth shaking, but people's masonry work has cracked, stuff like that, etc.  I suspect, but nobody's said so, that the collapse of a bridge/overpass on the Boulder-Denver Turnpike (Hwy 36) recently was due to subsidence in that area:

        

Speaking of underground "voids," there used to be a coal mine near Marshall, Colorado (South of Boulder) that had been burning for decades and up until, say, 1980 or so I remember smoke coming out of the ground thereabouts.

Terry, 230RN

Pic credit in properties

[cordex]

I don't like using my cell phone for navigation because that means I have to turn on geolocaton

Ha.

Even with geo turned off you can be nearly pinpointed.  I was tangentially involved in a criminal case that included testimony from the FBI's Cellular Analysis Survey Team.  Between tower footprinting, directional sectors, signal strength and timing, and input from multiple towers they can get really, really close if your phone has power.

[Ben]

Ha.

Even with geo turned off you can be nearly pinpointed.  I was tangentially involved in a criminal case that included testimony from the FBI's Cellular Analysis Survey Team.  Between tower footprinting, directional sectors, signal strength and timing, and input from multiple towers they can get really, really close if your phone has power.

I recently posted an article that showed how a phone's sensors could be used to track you even with geolocation and GPS off.

[RoadKingLarry]

That 10'2" versus 102" reminds me that I questioned the water shooting out of the mine shafts to "400 feet."  I wonder if it wasn't really 40 feet.  Old Faithful only squirts 106 to 180 feet up. Now I'm getting to wonder where my Machinery's Handbook is to see about water squirting heights versus pressure.  (I reckon Firefighters probably know this offhand.)

There's a local problem about subsidence of ground into the many empty coal mines around here.  So far, nothing <ahem> earth shaking, but people's masonry work has cracked, stuff like that, etc.  I suspect, but nobody's said so, that the collapse of a bridge/overpass on the Boulder-Denver Turnpike (Hwy 36) recently was due to subsidence in that area:

        

Speaking of underground "voids," there used to be a coal mine near Marshall, Colorado (South of Boulder) that had been burning for decades and up until, say, 1980 or so I remember smoke coming out of the ground thereabouts.

Terry, 230RN

Pic credit in properties

We closed down a whole town in NE Oklahoma because of all the lead/zinc mines under it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picher,_Oklahoma

[Hawkmoon]

Ha.

Even with geo turned off you can be nearly pinpointed.  I was tangentially involved in a criminal case that included testimony from the FBI's Cellular Analysis Survey Team.  Between tower footprinting, directional sectors, signal strength and timing, and input from multiple towers they can get really, really close if your phone has power.

Yes, I know. If I were planning to commit any crimes, I'd leave my cell phone at home, turned on.

[K Frame]

You want a goddamned disaster?

The coffee machine at the office is down this morning! It's like the zombie apocalypse in here!

[RocketMan]

You want a goddamned disaster?

The coffee machine at the office is down this morning! It's like the zombie apocalypse in here!

Did someone measure out the coffee in metric amounts when they put it in the imperial measurement-based machine?

[griz]

Did someone measure out the coffee in metric amounts when they put it in the imperial measurement-based machine?

I can see a caffeine deficient worker trying to figure out how many milliliters of coffee constitutes a serving.  You'll be lucky if there aren't any injuries.

[230RN]

We closed down a whole town in NE Oklahoma because of all the lead/zinc mines under it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picher,_Oklahoma

Wow.  I didn't know about the Oklahoma situation, and your link also pointed me to the problem of Gilman, Colorado.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilman,_Colorado

[BobR]

Wow.  I didn't know about the Oklahoma situation, and your link also pointed me to the problem of Gilman, Colorado.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilman,_Colorado

Here's a few underground fires that have been burning since before the US became a country. 

http://mentalfloss.com/article/52869/5-places-are-still-fire

bob

[K Frame]

*expletive deleted*it, the one may have been burning long before the Egyptians built the damned pyramids, and may have been burning longer than humans have been congregating in cities...

[RocketMan]

When I was a youth living in Issaquah, WA., there was an underground fire burning off the side of the town cemetery.  The cemetery itself was located on the lower north side of Squak Mountain.  Walking along that side of the cemetery, one could see smoke and fumes coming from cracks in the ground.
The story was that the fire was burning in an underground coal seam, though I never did hear any real confirmation of that.  The story was certainly plausible as there were several abandoned coal mine tunnels at various places around Squak Mountain, and there was an abandoned open pit mine a few miles away on the side of the mountain opposite the cemetery.

[K Frame]

"The story was that the fire was burning in an underground coal seam, "

Nah. That close to the cemetery?

Satan was roasting the souls of the sinners buried there.

[Doggy Daddy]

You want a goddamned disaster?

The coffee machine at the office is down this morning! It's like the zombie apocalypse in here!

Some goof probably hit the wrong switch by mistake when they were trying to turn off the overhead lights.   

[230RN]

Double post, dang it.

[230RN]

Youtube additional details and "color" on the Lake Peigneur disaster.  The "400 foot geyser" is confirmed.

https://youtu.be/_feWtkSucvE

Here's a few underground fires that have been burning since before the US became a country.  

http://mentalfloss.com/article/52869/5-places-are-still-fire

bob

Very informative, thank you.  I was kind of spooked out when I first found smoke coming out of the ground as a buddy of mine and I prowled around out there.  He knew the area, and 'splained it.

WRT my theory as to the collapse of the roadway on Hwy 36 I noted above, there's no doubt the road goes over underground mines, since there's a memorial a hundred yards or so away from the road for a miner whose body could not be found after a mine disaster down there.  The marker is over where he should have been if he were on his standard rounds when the disaster occurred.