Author Topic: The 2024 Circus  (Read 35108 times)

Northwoods

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #275 on: December 20, 2023, 11:53:54 PM »
The actions of the Colorado Supreme Court remind me of the Iranian mullahs who only let the candidates they approve of appear on the ballot in their so-called "elections."

OK, let's say Trump is taken off the ballot in Colorado and a couple of other states.

What happens - that is, what do the lefties do - when the House refuses to certify the vote counts from those states?



Charge those legislators with insurrection and remove them office.

Or shoot them.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #276 on: December 21, 2023, 01:25:32 AM »
Biggest thing that has taken things away from me was the Patriot Act of 2001. Mostly voted for by right-wing. So, I'm going to disagree.

We're all going to be getting *expletive deleted*ed by Trumps Tax Law in the next couple of years, yep voted for by right-wing leadership again.

Three biggest deficit recent spending administrations. GW Bush, BH Obama, and DJ Trump. 2/3 are right wing. That is the cause of the inflation, devalue the currency in excessive spending.

No one is coming to take your house, no one is coming to shut down your church, no one is taking away your freedom of speech, well I guess the GOP did with the Patriot Act.

You're certainly quite wrong about those last few items. About home ownership, I may be misinformed, but hasn't there been a noticeable decline in home ownership for younger people? As with firearms, taking away what people already have is not the whole story. If you're willing to go deeper than the shallow analysis you've offered, there is more to it. Making it harder for new people to acquire homes or guns is just as important, even if it's not flashy enough to suit your rhetoric.

Churches were shut down all over the country, and many never recovered. The last I heard, California is still going after the churches that wouldn't surrender their rights (and their Christian duties). So you picked a bad example there. But again, church closures are just the more dramatic side of things. The Left mainly deals with churches by infiltrating and poisoning them; the same "long march" they use with other institutions.

As for freedom of speech, you're really into some hardcore gaslighting on that one. Team Biden and multiple federal agencies spent years directing social media on what and whom to censor. They're probably still at it. The Left is absolutely salivating at the chance to overrule Citizens United, and they've primed college students to accept (or really, demand) laws against so-called hate speech. Those are just the highlights.

As for the rest of your response, you're confusing Democrat & Republican with Left & Right. I blamed the Left; not the DNC. Nor am I claiming the GOP is blameless. No one is.

You're also pretending that only the GOP supports the Patriot Act. I mean, really?


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Ben

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #277 on: December 21, 2023, 07:42:52 AM »
No one is coming to take your house, no one is coming to shut down your church, no one is taking away your freedom of speech, well I guess the GOP did with the Patriot Act.

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charby

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #278 on: December 21, 2023, 07:50:13 AM »
You're certainly quite wrong about those last few items. About home ownership, I may be misinformed, but hasn't there been a noticeable decline in home ownership for younger people? As with firearms, taking away what people already have is not the whole story. If you're willing to go deeper than the shallow analysis you've offered, there is more to it. Making it harder for new people to acquire homes or guns is just as important, even if it's not flashy enough to suit your rhetoric.

I didn't say anything about guns, don't add things that aren't in my argument.

Decline in home ownership? That isn't a political problem that is an economic problem. Everything from supply and demand, income over time has not kept up with inflation, etc. People in exiting houses are not selling and moving because they took advantage of the lower interest rates from that were extended past the time needed.

Quote
Churches were shut down all over the country, and many never recovered. The last I heard, California is still going after the churches that wouldn't surrender their rights (and their Christian duties). So you picked a bad example there. But again, church closures are just the more dramatic side of things. The Left mainly deals with churches by infiltrating and poisoning them; the same "long march" they use with other institutions.

The churches around me that have shut down is due to either declining membership (such as kids are moving away for career opportunities) or the membership had a division of beliefs, and each side went elsewhere (I see this more in independent self-governed churches). Or just financial reasons, don't generate enough money to keep the lights and heat on.

Point to a credible source, not twitchy, not a pundit, not some website, but an actual real news article that has a church being shut down by the government for doing their "Christian duties". Not for tax invasion, fraud, pedophile, polygamy, etc. but actually in the course of their "Christian duties".

Quote
As for freedom of speech, you're really into some hardcore gaslighting on that one. Team Biden and multiple federal agencies spent years directing social media on what and whom to censor. They're probably still at it. The Left is absolutely salivating at the chance to overrule Citizens United, and they've primed college students to accept (or really, demand) laws against so-called hate speech. Those are just the highlights.

I want to see an actual credible example of a public university or college that is actually indoctrinating students via directive from the administration. Don't include private schools, we already know that there are left (American University) and right (such as faith based, like Oral Roberts) private colleges and universities that are very open about their mission and political leanings.

Quote
As for the rest of your response, you're confusing Democrat & Republican with Left & Right. I blamed the Left; not the DNC. Nor am I claiming the GOP is blameless. No one is.

GOP is the right. Last time I checked there isn't a viable right winged third party.
Quote
You're also pretending that only the GOP supports the Patriot Act. I mean, really?

I'm going off the original Act and votes in House, Senate, and POTUS. GOP has had the majority since the act passed and haven't over turned it.
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dogmush

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #279 on: December 21, 2023, 08:44:46 AM »

Point to a credible source, not twitchy, not a pundit, not some website, but an actual real news article that has a church being shut down by the government for doing their "Christian duties". Not for tax invasion, fraud, pedophile, polygamy, etc. but actually in the course of their "Christian duties".

Reuters:  CA Shuts down churches during pandemic. 

NBC: Pastor arrested for holding services (2020, so Trump can have some credit for this one)

Baltimore Sun: Church closed by health department

Pretty sure that holding services and fellowship is considered a "Christian Duty" by most denominations.

I want to see an actual credible example of a public university or college that is actually indoctrinating students via directive from the administration. Don't include private schools, we already know that there are left (American University) and right (such as faith based, like Oral Roberts) private colleges and universities that are very open about their mission and political leanings.

How about the directives themselves?

https://www.ed.gov/news/press-releases/fact-sheet-us-department-educations-proposed-change-its-title-ix-regulations-students-eligibility-athletic-teams#:~:text=The%20Title%20IX%20regulations%2C%20since,talents%2C%20capacities%2C%20and%20preferences.

https://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ocr/docs/ocr-factsheet-tvi-dia-202301.pdf

^^That one has a link to get Administration funding to facilitate indoctrination

charby

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #280 on: December 21, 2023, 10:14:00 AM »
Reuters:  CA Shuts down churches during pandemic. 

NBC: Pastor arrested for holding services (2020, so Trump can have some credit for this one)

Baltimore Sun: Church closed by health department

Pretty sure that holding services and fellowship is considered a "Christian Duty" by most denominations.

How about the directives themselves?

https://www.ed.gov/news/press-releases/fact-sheet-us-department-educations-proposed-change-its-title-ix-regulations-students-eligibility-athletic-teams#:~:text=The%20Title%20IX%20regulations%2C%20since,talents%2C%20capacities%2C%20and%20preferences.

https://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ocr/docs/ocr-factsheet-tvi-dia-202301.pdf

^^That one has a link to get Administration funding to facilitate indoctrination

All businesses in those states were subject to the Covid mandates, not just churches.

Title IX is related to Atheletics not Academia.
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Pb

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #281 on: December 21, 2023, 10:18:53 AM »

No one is coming to take your house, no one is coming to shut down your church, no one is taking away your freedom of speech, well I guess the GOP did with the Patriot Act.

I don't know if you considered this, but I know college professors at public universities are being fired or otherwise punished if their speech or research is un pc.

https://www.thefire.org/news/report-least-111-professors-targeted-their-speech-2021

dogmush

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #282 on: December 21, 2023, 10:22:10 AM »
All businesses in those states were subject to the Covid mandates, not just churches.
Bars and Walmart weren't.  Regardless you didn't say "only churches" you said "Show me where .gov shut down churches."  Stories provided as asked.


Title IX is related to Atheletics not Academia.

The first link is the Department of Education fact sheet on applying Title IX to Academia.  Fit's your request.  The second link is Title VI, again specifically applying DEI to Academia and offering funding to apply it more effectively.

dogmush

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #283 on: December 21, 2023, 10:24:10 AM »

No one is coming to take your house, no one is coming to shut down your church, no one is taking away your freedom of speech, well I guess the GOP did with the Patriot Act.

Owen Troyer and Enrique Tarrio to the white courtesy phone please.

charby

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #284 on: December 21, 2023, 11:26:06 AM »
I don't know if you considered this, but I know college professors at public universities are being fired or otherwise punished if their speech or research is un pc.

https://www.thefire.org/news/report-least-111-professors-targeted-their-speech-2021

So I dug into the report the article linked to. One of the examples was from the U of Rhode Island firing a faculty member for criticizing the schools policy on diversity and that it wasn't being diverse as it said it was. I guess that university fits the right wing agenda on diversity.
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charby

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #285 on: December 21, 2023, 11:40:24 AM »
Owen Troyer and Enrique Tarrio to the white courtesy phone please.

Are those civil cases, aka defamation lawsuits?
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Ben

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #286 on: December 21, 2023, 11:43:43 AM »
Are those civil cases, aka defamation lawsuits?

Seriously?!?

You gleefully posted about these guys getting their outrageously long prison terms when the sentences came down.
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charby

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #287 on: December 21, 2023, 11:44:34 AM »
Bars and Walmart weren't.  Regardless you didn't say "only churches" you said "Show me where .gov shut down churches."  Stories provided as asked.


The first link is the Department of Education fact sheet on applying Title IX to Academia.  Fit's your request.  The second link is Title VI, again specifically applying DEI to Academia and offering funding to apply it more effectively.

Yes it's to Dept of Ed.

Title VI is related to 64 Civil Rights Act.

How about an example of church that was shut down and assets confiscated by the government for refusing entry to a trans or homosexual? 
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Boomhauer

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #288 on: December 21, 2023, 11:45:36 AM »
In my experience when someone authoritatively states “nO oNe iS tAKinG aWAy…” they are lying like hell
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charby

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #289 on: December 21, 2023, 12:11:42 PM »
Seriously?!?

You gleefully posted about these guys getting their outrageously long prison terms when the sentences came down.

Sorry I can't remember everyone's name and how the government wronged them. I was thinking they were involved in one of the Alex Jones defamation lawsuit.

Tarrio was found guilty by a jury trial for sedicious conspiracy. I'm sorry if you think leftist groups aren't getting the same treatment, but you're young enough to go back to school for 3 years, get your JD, pass the Bar Exam and form a practice to go after the leftists.

Shroyer plead guilty to a misdemeanor for trespassing in a restricted area.
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Northwoods

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #290 on: December 21, 2023, 12:21:00 PM »
Yes it's to Dept of Ed.

Title VI is related to 64 Civil Rights Act.

How about an example of church that was shut down and assets confiscated by the government for refusing entry to a trans or homosexual? 

Way to shift the goal posts.

There's a much longer response I'd love to type but I don't have time.  I'm sure one of the other capable folks here will explain all that is wrong (besides goal post shifting) with that post.
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WLJ

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #291 on: December 21, 2023, 12:27:54 PM »
Lets get back to what's important here....The Babylon Bee!   :P

Colorado Supreme Court Demands Jack Phillips Bake Cake To Celebrate Trump Ruling
https://babylonbee.com/news/colorado-supreme-court-demands-jack-phillips-bake-cake-to-celebrate-trump-ruling
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cordex

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #292 on: December 21, 2023, 12:28:09 PM »
Quote
Almost 70% of the incidents came from individuals and groups to the political left of the scholar, compared to 30% that came from the right of the scholar.
;)

Apropos of nothing, while I enjoy a good debate, any discussion requires agreement that provable facts are fundamental to the discussion.  Sometimes an interlocutor suffers from such intense ideological possession that they don't overly concern themselves with veracity when proposing or rejecting foundational assumptions.  When inconvenient evidence is presented, such a conversation partner dismisses it as irrelevant, changes their claims, or ignores it outright.

It is impossible to carry on a productive discourse with such a person.

Pb

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #293 on: December 21, 2023, 12:30:02 PM »
I guess that university fits the right wing agenda on diversity.

The report does detail university suppression of professors speech, like I said.

Here are some other examples:

Jeffrey Goldhagen — Goldhagen was forbidden by the university administration from providing pro bono expert witness testimony in a lawsuit challenging the governor’s ban on school mask mandates.

University of Illinois, Chicago — Jason Kilborn — Kilborn was suspended after a student complaint about an exam question that presented expurgated racial and misogynistic slurs.

University of Michigan — Bright Sheng — Sheng resigned from teaching amid student backlash over showing the 1965 film version of “Othello,” in which a white actor appears in blackface. He was subsequently reinstated.

University of Rhode Island — Louis Kwame Fosu — Fosu was suspended and later terminated after criticizing the university’s success at promoting diversity, equity, and inclusion, and saying that the university practiced “de facto Jim Crow racism” in its hiring and promotion. Fosu was subsequently reinstated.

dogmush

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #294 on: December 21, 2023, 12:30:54 PM »

Tarrio was found guilty by a jury trial for sedicious conspiracy. I'm sorry if you think leftist groups aren't getting the same treatment, but you're young enough to go back to school for 3 years, get your JD, pass the Bar Exam and form a practice to go after the leftists.

Shroyer plead guilty to a misdemeanor for trespassing in a restricted area.

This is either dishonest or willfully ignorant.  The AUSA in both cases was clearly vocal that they were pursuing charges based on the political speech of the men in question.  You'd have to be actively avoiding the case to have missed it.

Related, the DOJ is also charging Steve Baker, a credentialed journalist, for crimes "Related to his activities on Jan 6".  As a journalist he was one of several covering the riot and the DOJ has decided that his coverage no longer deserves 1A protection.

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #295 on: December 21, 2023, 12:31:06 PM »
Quote
    Almost 70% of the incidents came from individuals and groups to the political left of the scholar, compared to 30% that came from the right of the scholar.

While agreeing that's a slippery number to pin down I feel I can safely say which side of that got 90+% of media coverage.
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dogmush

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #296 on: December 21, 2023, 12:32:32 PM »
Yes it's to Dept of Ed.

Title VI is related to 64 Civil Rights Act.

How about an example of church that was shut down and assets confiscated by the government for refusing entry to a trans or homosexual?

Are you seriously arguing that the Federal Department of Education's policies on how they will apply Federal Law to colleges has no relation to Academia?

charby

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #297 on: December 21, 2023, 12:47:42 PM »
This is either dishonest or willfully ignorant.  The AUSA in both cases was clearly vocal that they were pursuing charges based on the political speech of the men in question.  You'd have to be actively avoiding the case to have missed it.

Related, the DOJ is also charging Steve Baker, a credentialed journalist, for crimes "Related to his activities on Jan 6".  As a journalist he was one of several covering the riot and the DOJ has decided that his coverage no longer deserves 1A protection.

I'm sorry I don't see what you're seeing,  probably won't either.

Also the what about this rebuttal is getting old in arguments.
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charby

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #298 on: December 21, 2023, 12:51:24 PM »
Are you seriously arguing that the Federal Department of Education's policies on how they will apply Federal Law to colleges has no relation to Academia?

Then post a 100% academia only rule from Dept of Ed that forces students to be endoctorinated in leftist ideals of the won't graduate.
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dogmush

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Re: The 2024 Circus
« Reply #299 on: December 21, 2023, 12:51:47 PM »
What "what about this"?

You said the government is not silencing people for speech.  I provided two recent examples where the government said, in court, that they were criminally procecuteing people because of their speech.  The attempted jailing of a journalist was just a bonus topic since it's 1A related.